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      01-23-2015, 07:32 AM   #67
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      01-23-2015, 09:11 AM   #68
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For anyone that cares...I have noticed that the EQ settings on the HK perceivably sound worse than the settings I use on my phone's media player (Samsung S5 Google Player). Additionally, the Google player frequencies can be manipulated at 60Hz which I crank by 6db. I get a LOT deeper bass this way which somewhat satisfies me.

To set expectation, I am an audiophile and am really particular on the components I use for the sound I want. In fact my system is quite a bit more expensive than my M4 (not bragging...just showing you what sound means to me). To be honest I really like the sound I get out of HK with my phone's EQ. I've thought about redoing the entire system; use BavSound OEM replacements, MusiCarNW subwoofer solution, etc. However, I am concerned that any panel removal will cause rattles like the e46 did.

Give it a try and use your phone for tone manipulation and see if you like it better or worse. curious to hear your responses.
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      01-23-2015, 10:07 AM   #69
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I posted this in another thread, but it bears repeating:

The reason you all are getting poor sound is that you are playing from a poor source. Bluetooth just doesn't have the bandwidth to pass good quality music files. MP3s at 320 kbps or FLAC files is what you want. If you are playing MP3 at 128 kbps, or even 192 or 256, then yeah, you are going to get poor sound. It's far too compressed. And the Bluetooth transfer protocol is compressing it even further.

Go get FLAC files, or if those aren't available, at least 320 KBPS MP3s (still compressed too much IMO), and transfer them to the hard drive on the M, and then play them from there. You'll find out you don't need to do fancy tricks with the EQ to get them to sound decent.

next step after that, of course, if upgrading the speakers (Bavsound Stage 1 is highly recommended) and then, if you need more bass, get one of the musciarnw.com add-a-subs.

But first, at least get a decent quality sound source. Not Bluetooth transfer
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      01-23-2015, 11:37 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave 90TT View Post
I posted this in another thread, but it bears repeating:

The reason you all are getting poor sound is that you are playing from a poor source. Bluetooth just doesn't have the bandwidth to pass good quality music files. MP3s at 320 kbps or FLAC files is what you want. If you are playing MP3 at 128 kbps, or even 192 or 256, then yeah, you are going to get poor sound. It's far too compressed. And the Bluetooth transfer protocol is compressing it even further.

Go get FLAC files, or if those aren't available, at least 320 KBPS MP3s (still compressed too much IMO), and transfer them to the hard drive on the M, and then play them from there. You'll find out you don't need to do fancy tricks with the EQ to get them to sound decent.

next step after that, of course, if upgrading the speakers (Bavsound Stage 1 is highly recommended) and then, if you need more bass, get one of the musciarnw.com add-a-subs.

But first, at least get a decent quality sound source. Not Bluetooth transfer

I have done the comparison of usb vs. Bluetooth on flac. The sound quality perception is negligible. However...audio is a very subjective topic. If usb sounds better for you then go for it. This is my personal opinion.
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      03-04-2015, 04:38 PM   #71
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Update: I have been fiddling with the settings a bit since my early January post. The 5k was overpowering the 10k. Very annoying. So here's the latest. Give it a try. It sounds pretty damned good. Lemme know what y'all think!
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      03-05-2015, 10:58 AM   #72
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Why would you boost all signals? Makes no sense
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      03-07-2015, 10:10 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by 8600RPM View Post
Why would you boost all signals? Makes no sense
Haha! You're right. I've just been in tweak mode this whole time, so I didn't really think about that.

Obviously, one could bring all bands down in kind, which I will probably do.

But, let's be honest. We're not driving sound studios. The gigantically high noise floor in a car on the road renders such concerns fairly trivial.

It does sound pretty good regardless.
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      03-12-2015, 01:25 PM   #74
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Can you guys share some updated settings that you are running?
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      03-14-2015, 04:35 AM   #75
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Originally Posted by dbski View Post
Can you guys share some updated settings that you are running?
Here is what I finally came up with. I listen mostly to hip hop and try to get some good hitting bass out of this HK upgrade. I'm still indecisive on where to have the 1kHz setting (maybe 2 notches higher). I have the treble at one notch below full and the bass at 100%.
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      03-14-2015, 08:55 PM   #76
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Here is what I finally came up with. I listen mostly to hip hop and try to get some good hitting bass out of this HK upgrade. I'm still indecisive on where to have the 1kHz setting (maybe 2 notches higher). I have the treble at one notch below full and the bass at 100%.
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      03-15-2015, 12:47 AM   #77
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I finally got my car. Here is what I came up with using an Audio Control RTA and pink noise from a CMAA test code (IASCA soaked them up in the early 1990's). This was done in my 2015 M3 with full leather. The microphone was in the drivers seat at my ear level about 2 inches forward of where my ears would be (deep microphone and I didn't want to adjust the seat with the tripod in place).

Let me start with my credentials and goals. I have been an audiophile since I before was 12 (my love of cars started at 7). I was a car electronics installer in the higher end space for 9 years in high school and college. I was a CMAA certified SQ judge. I love accurate sound, when I say that I mean as close to the source recording as possible. That's is not just a flat response but also sound stage and imaging. Because of sound stage and image my primary setting front channels only (fader all the way to the left) and logic 7 turned off.

All of my measurements were taken at 80db avg level using the CMAA CD in the CD player. My main source of music is a 1tb hard drive plugged into the USB port with 2300 songs burned in uncompressed FLAC and 3100 songs burned WAV.

What I am posting here is 4 different settings
1. Bass, Treble, Fader, Balance all centered, logic 7 turned ON
2. Bass, Treble, Fader, Balance all centered, logic 7 turned OFF
3. Bass, Treble, Balance all centered, Fader to the front and logic 7 turned OFF
4. Absolute flattest I could get - Bass -6 or 7 (I can't tell from the pic but I remember its four bars from the left showing), Treble center, balance center, fader front, logic 7 OFF

The first 3 pics are the setup of the RTA in the passenger floor and the mic in the drivers seat. I sat in the passenger seat to take the measurements.

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1. Bass, Treble, Fader, Balance all centered, logic 7 turned ON

EQ setting
100hz -3
200hz -1
500hz +2
1khz +1
2khz flat
5khz +2
10khz +3

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2. Bass, Treble, Fader, Balance all centered, logic 7 turned OFF

EQ setting
100hz -3
200hz -1
500hz +2
1khz +1
2khz flat
5khz +2
10khz +2

Only difference between logic 7 on and off was the +1 bump in 10k.

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3. Bass, Treble, Balance all centered, Fader to the front and logic 7 turned OFF

EQ setting
100hz -4
200hz flat
500hz -2
1khz +2
2khz +1
5khz +1
10khz +2

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4. Absolute flattest I could get - Bass -6 or 7 (I can't tell from the pic but I remember its four bars from the left showing), Treble center, balance center, fader front, logic 7 OFF

EQ setting
100hz +3
200hz -4
500hz -1
1khz +2
2khz -2
5khz flat
10khz -1

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All four examples are very flat from around 500hz to 20k. Below 500 is where the real problems lie. There is bump at 200hz that you can't tune out with the available tools and overall the system a tad brighter then it should be. Overall, It's better then many stock systems and the best I've had in a BMW but still just OK. The bass starts rolling off at 50hz.

I will be using setting #4 with the balance +3 to the right to center it for the driver. +3 is almost perfect but it's a hair too much, +2 is not enough.
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      03-15-2015, 12:54 AM   #78
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What???????!!!!!!!1111!!!!??? You mean the crazy settings that some have shown with everything boosted most of the way to the right are not good????!!!!11111?????

Blasphemy!!!!!1111!!! Infidel with your crazy qualifications and standards!!!!!1111!!!!
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      03-15-2015, 01:03 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave 90TT View Post
What???????!!!!!!!1111!!!!??? You mean the crazy settings that some have shown with everything boosted most of the way to the right are not good????!!!!11111?????

Blasphemy!!!!!1111!!! Infidel with your crazy qualifications and standards!!!!!1111!!!!
There are no right or wrong settings. Each individual needs to decide what settings they like. This is a reference to get it as close to correct (what source sounds like) as possible. With this info you can start at the most accurate settings and make taste adjustments from there.
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      03-15-2015, 10:30 AM   #80
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So are you going to leave the fader in the Front? Can you explain that, please.


Also, what kind of music are you going to be listening to with these settings?

Define "flat"?


Sorry for the questions, I'm genuinely interested. Just not really an audiophile per se.
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      03-15-2015, 12:02 PM   #81
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I listen to all kinds of music from Pop, alternative rock, classic rock to jazz to standards with a little hip hop and country mixed in.

Fader to the front for better image and soundstage for 2 channel recordings. In a home reference system you have a pair of speakers in front of you, there is a reason for that. The only real use for more then 2 channels IMHO is for actual multi-channel recordings like movies with discrete multi channel audio tracks (not mutliplexed like logic 7 - which is taking 2 channel material and processing it to 5 or more channels instead of the 5 or more channels being present on the recording.

Flat is every frequency playing at the same level. Pink noise is that, it sounds like static but it is every frequency in audible range playing at the same level. This link probably explains it better then I can.

http://www.centerpointaudio.com/HowT...onseGraph.aspx

In the end, a flat response is going to be closest to the sound of the source material. If you are using uncompressed sources then this sound should be extremely close to what recording engineer released and intended for you to hear.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vectors2final View Post
So are you going to leave the fader in the Front? Can you explain that, please.


Also, what kind of music are you going to be listening to with these settings?

Define "flat"?


Sorry for the questions, I'm genuinely interested. Just not really an audiophile per se.
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      03-15-2015, 12:59 PM   #82
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Lincoln30 I'm surprised you haven't replaced the speakers yet. I tried every EQ setup I could find on the forums and was still disappointed with the stock HK system. Will be interesting to follow this and see if you do replace them in the future.
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      03-15-2015, 01:39 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
Lincoln30 I'm surprised you haven't replaced the speakers yet. I tried every EQ setup I could find on the forums and was still disappointed with the stock HK system. Will be interesting to follow this and see if you do replace them in the future.
With only 600 miles on the car, I haven't lived with it long enough yet to decide what I will do about the sound. If you heard mine with the settings I'm using you might be surprised (I was), while no reference system, I am pretty impressed with the detail and feel of the music (good midbass). I think my biggest problem with the system is that it just does not have enough power to "rock out". At 80db avg level you are at about the maximum volume level before the system starts to distort, that's pretty sad.

I would love to do a reference system like the M4 that MusicarNW did with the Dynaudio front stage only but I will likely start out with replacing the underseat woofers (I can't remember the name of them at the moment). The next step for me would be something like the Musicar full bass subwoofer kit. This adds the sub in the trunk over the battery compartment and an amp to power the sub and underseat woofers, this includes changing the crossover on the underseat woofers to cut out the lower frequencies the the sub will play.

I'm going to look into the BavSound speakers. If they use a silk dome tweeter, that might be a better option with the factory amps to tone down the brightness. I would only replace the front stage in my car so the Bavsound upgrade would be cheap.
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      03-15-2015, 01:51 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lincoln30 View Post
With only 600 miles on the car, I haven't lived with it long enough yet to decide what I will do about the sound. If you heard mine with the settings I'm using you might be surprised (I was), while no reference system, I am pretty impressed with the detail and feel of the music (good midbass). I think my biggest problem with the system is that it just does not have enough power to "rock out". At 80db avg level you are at about the maximum volume level before the system starts to distort, that's pretty sad.

I would love to do a reference system like the M4 that MusicarNW did with the Dynaudio front stage only but I will likely start out with replacing the underseat woofers (I can't remember the name of them at the moment). The next step for me would be something like the Musicar full bass subwoofer kit. This adds the sub in the trunk over the battery compartment and an amp to power the sub and underseat woofers, this includes changing the crossover on the underseat woofers to cut out the lower frequencies the the sub will play.

I'm going to look into the BavSound speakers. If they use a silk dome tweeter, that might be a better option with the factory amps to tone down the brightness. I would only replace the front stage in my car so the Bavsound upgrade would be cheap.
That was one of my main complaints as well. As I'm sure you have read, a lot of us have done the Bavsound Stage 1 upgrade and are much happier with the system. For $600ish bucks, it is hard to beat. It's not perfect, but much much better over stock in mine and others opinion here.
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      03-15-2015, 04:36 PM   #85
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I think I'm just gonna add my own 12" sub in the back. I think the HK system is great quality... the only problem I really have with it is trying to get the low bass. I think a single 12 in the back should fix that... Hopefully
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      03-15-2015, 05:21 PM   #86
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If anybody is near Boston, I often like to measure random car stereos with measuring mic and analyzer. I use regular music (including yours).

Making it actually linear requires that you are too heavy-handed on the EQ and "bending" things too much makes things sound bad for reasons other than frequency distribution. So what you get out of measuring is just a starter point to then go try a few things on your own after you know what is wrong in the first place. Plus different songs show different distributions due to resonance, unavoidable in our tin cam listening rooms.

I published my Z4/professional hifi results over in the e89 section. I would be interested in doing a F80, especially a convertible.
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      03-16-2015, 02:54 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
That was one of my main complaints as well. As I'm sure you have read, a lot of us have done the Bavsound Stage 1 upgrade and are much happier with the system. For $600ish bucks, it is hard to beat. It's not perfect, but much much better over stock in mine and others opinion here.
I read some more about the Bavsound speakers last night and I am going to buy them sometime in the next few weeks. Did you do the "dynamat" add on too?
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      03-16-2015, 03:00 PM   #88
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Quote:
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I read some more about the Bavsound speakers last night and I am going to buy them sometime in the next few weeks. Did you do the "dynamat" add on too?
I did. Can't really tell you if it helped or not as I'm not sure. They recommended it and it was cheap/easy to install so I went for it.
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