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      06-03-2019, 09:02 PM   #1
Chris@VargasTurboTech
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Updated Spline Lock: More Spline, better lock, now available with no-slip guarantee!

We at VTT are very excited to release our updated Spline Lock. Let's get right into all the details:

Basics: Why a spline vs. a key or pin?
While there are many ways to solve crank hub slip issues, of the three major methods (spline, key, pin) the spline is the only one primarily designed to transmit torque. Splines are considered to be "torque dense", meaning extremely efficient at transmitting torque, and do not suffer from balance issues as can be had with some key/pinned setups. Typically many splines are used, which means a more uniform transfer of torque and a lower loading on a given part of the shaft/hub interface. Don't take our word for it though, just look at your own car; transmission input shafts, axles, clutch disks and more all use splines as the chosen torque transmission method. As we see it, the only disadvantage of using a spline over a key or pin is in the manufacturing cost. Don't trust us though, do a little google searching and you'll find this to be repeated many times, a couple quick examples in no particular order (if you want some light spline related reading for the evening):

https://gearsolutions.com/features/inside-splines/

http://westmichiganspline.com/theory/

Why a redesign, does this mean the original doesn't hold?

As of yet, we have had zero reported issues of the original Spline Lock slipping when properly installed and a CBC used with it. In fact, the only stock motor S55 running in the 9's runs one. So why the redesign? We're always innovating and while the original Spline Lock (with CBC) worked very well, we saw an opportunity to improve on a few design features, really step up the torque holding capability, and even offer a no-slip guarantee when installed at our (or one of our approved) shops.

Design Details!
At a glance summary: we switched to straight splines, made them bigger, and increased the interference fit. How tight? Tight enough that you will need a special puller to remove the Spline Lock if for some reason you ever choose to (puller available for a small additional cost). What about hardness? Great question, glad you asked. The new Spline Locks are made of 440C Tool Steel material with a Rockwell hardness of 55-60 HRC. Check out the pics below (note the hardening process turns the metal a matte grey, then the surface where the seal rides is polished):

No-slip guarantee? Here's the scoop!
Simple. If installed by our shop (VHP in Hayward CA) or one of our approved shops (right now that list includes EAS, and in PR Bimmer Solutions) we guarantee the hub won't slip. The no slip guarantee says the spline lock will not slip for the life of your engine (original owner only). If any issues arise (they won't), diagnosis and/or repair must be performed by VHP or approved installation shop, which is just another way to saying we want people who know what they're doing installing it, and if anything comes up, we want those same qualified people repairing it. If found to have slipped, we will replace the hub, and labor at no cost. This does not cover any possible engine damage.

What if I have an original Spline Lock purchased, but not installed?
If you are the original purchaser of an original spline lock and it is in new, uninstalled condition, shoot us an email to get an RMA number and details. Weíll have you send it back with all pertinent information (order number/name/address/etc.) then we'll exchange it for a new version for the cost of shipping.

What if I have an original Spline Lock purchased, but I have a deep NEED to have the latest version installed!
We haven't had any issues with the original Spline Lock slipping when properly installed and used with CBC, but if you already installed your original Spline Lock and want the newest version, shoot us an email to get an RMA number and details, take 'er out, box 'er up, include all pertinent info, and we'll give you 50% off a new Spline Lock!

Do I need to use the CBC with this?
Yes, the Spline Lock and the CBC together are a complete solution.

Are these in stock?

Yes, 20 available at the moment, more coming soon.

Cost increase from the original?
No price change! See website for all pricing details!
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Last edited by Chris@VargasTurboTech; 06-03-2019 at 09:53 PM..
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      06-03-2019, 09:03 PM   #2
Chris@VargasTurboTech
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For those interested, here are some pics of the puller that's required if you ever want to remove the spline lock once it's installed:
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      06-03-2019, 10:25 PM   #3
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Quick question,

Is there a reason why you leave the end of the spline as a square edge instead of putting a chamfer on it? I would think with a chamfer it would give each tooth of the spline a bit of a lead in to cut into the crank a bit more smoothly rather than plowing a square edge into the crank and peeling some material out instead of just cutting in?

And for the record, not bashing at all. Im quite a fan of your desgin.
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      06-04-2019, 12:15 AM   #4
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      06-04-2019, 12:19 AM   #5
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Hi, thanks for the question, itís a little hard to see in the photos especially if viewing on a cell phone etc, but there is a small chamfer on there already.

Chris
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      06-04-2019, 12:34 AM   #6
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Great news! Already have a M3 waiting on the lift for one of these.
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      06-05-2019, 03:22 PM   #7
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Just want to clarify... the guarantee includes that if it slips, you will replace the part that failed (spline lock) and the labour but none of the damage that it may have caused? :
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      06-05-2019, 03:44 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudVIII View Post
Just want to clarify... the guarantee includes that if it slips, you will replace the part that failed (spline lock) and the labour but none of the damage that it may have caused? :
It reads that way.
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      06-05-2019, 03:47 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by behindthen0thing View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudVIII View Post
Just want to clarify... the guarantee includes that if it slips, you will replace the part that failed (spline lock) and the labour but none of the damage that it may have caused? :
It reads that way.
Ok good I'm not the only one.
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      06-05-2019, 03:51 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudVIII View Post
Ok good I'm not the only one.
So If it slips and the engine is destroyed or damaged, you'll get a new hub installed in the new or repaired engine that YOU pay for.

The actual engine does not appear to be covered for damages.
If it slips in the crankshaft though, I think that would damage the crankshaft due to the splines digging in.

Probably isn't gonna slip though, so most likely a moot point.
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      06-05-2019, 03:54 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by behindthen0thing View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudVIII View Post
Ok good I'm not the only one.
So If it slips and the engine is destroyed or damaged, you'll get a new hub installed in the new or repaired engine that YOU pay for.

The actual engine does not appear to be covered for damages.
If it slips in the crankshaft though, I think that would damage the crankshaft due to the splines digging in.

Probably isn't gonna slip though, so most likely a moot point.
If it slips I likely will not be using the same "solution" to prevent the slip, but maybe that's just me. Hopefully the new and improved spline lock works better.
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      06-05-2019, 03:59 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudVIII View Post
If it slips I likely will not be using the same "solution" to prevent the slip, but maybe that's just me. Hopefully the new and improved spline lock works better.
yeah that's the thing,
If It slipped, I wouldn't put the same part back in the damn engine either because now it's proven to fail. Setting yourself up for another failure.

Clever marketing on the part of VTT though.
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      06-05-2019, 04:01 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudVIII View Post
If it slips I likely will not be using the same "solution" to prevent the slip, but maybe that's just me. Hopefully the new and improved spline lock works better.
I think the audi RS3 is a good spun crank hub solution. And it comes with a warranty too from what I heard.
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      06-05-2019, 04:02 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudVIII View Post
Just want to clarify... the guarantee includes that if it slips, you will replace the part that failed (spline lock) and the labour but none of the damage that it may have caused? :
Yeah, I donít get it either. I understand itís not supposed to spin, but if something happened and it did, why would I put the same part in my car anyway? Not trying to flame anyone here, but in my opinion it would have been better if nothing was said about any guarantee. I fully realize the risk vs cost and not wanting to deal with warranty from a business perspective, not disputing that. But if itís not a Dinan/ carbahn type thing where you can pay more for a legit warranty, then I donít see how it holds any weight other than marketing fluff.

Again, not trying to crap on anyone - trying to be constructive.
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      06-05-2019, 04:03 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by behindthen0thing View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudVIII View Post
If it slips I likely will not be using the same "solution" to prevent the slip, but maybe that's just me. Hopefully the new and improved spline lock works better.
I think the audi RS3 is a good spun crank hub solution. And it comes with a warranty too from what I heard.
Ya that platform is impressive. I just cannot do the compact sedan. Tried it out and so small.
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      06-06-2019, 01:23 PM   #16
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I had one and changed to the F80!!... too small for me... cracking car though!!!
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      06-06-2019, 03:58 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudVIII View Post
Ya that platform is impressive. I just cannot do the compact sedan. Tried it out and so small.
Same and have to build engine motor asap so thats 2 cons
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      06-06-2019, 06:16 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ntgarage44 View Post
Yeah, I donít get it either. I understand itís not supposed to spin, but if something happened and it did, why would I put the same part in my car anyway? Not trying to flame anyone here, but in my opinion it would have been better if nothing was said about any guarantee. I fully realize the risk vs cost and not wanting to deal with warranty from a business perspective, not disputing that. But if itís not a Dinan/ carbahn type thing where you can pay more for a legit warranty, then I donít see how it holds any weight other than marketing fluff.

Again, not trying to crap on anyone - trying to be constructive.
You wouldn't want to put the same part in if that happened. Period.

I don't think VTT realizes the circular logic they've created here (though, it's not too surprising since they don't pay anyone to help them with the PR side of things).

ALL engine damage should be covered if the hub and CBC are installed by VTT. PERIOD. Why would anyone trust the product if they cannot provide warranty beyond the part itself?

Isn't the point of this product NOT to damage any part of the engine? If VTT is so sure about this product and its efficacy they should have no issue providing a full warranty that covers the engine with a "proper" install.

Whole lot of jumping through hoops here
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      06-06-2019, 06:59 PM   #19
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My two pennies:

The fact that VTT is even willing to provide any sort of warranty at this price point, when no other Crank Hub Solution manufacturer in the U.S. is offering the same coverage, should show how confident they are with the updated spline grooves. I can imagine them providing full engine warranty coverage if they were charging $3,000+ per kit, but even then, things can get slippery pretty fast on both sides of the party.

I'm currently running their competitor's crank hub solution, but I'm willing to make a friendly wager that something in the engine will break if I were to dog on the car for an extended period of time. This is the reason why I don't see how it makes business sense for anyone to provide full warranty coverage for a performance oriented part designed to address a known achiles heel of the engine design.
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      06-06-2019, 08:20 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nars3000 View Post
My two pennies:

The fact that VTT is even willing to provide any sort of warranty at this price point, when no other Crank Hub Solution manufacturer in the U.S. is offering the same coverage, should show how confident they are with the updated spline grooves. I can imagine them providing full engine warranty coverage if they were charging $3,000+ per kit, but even then, things can get slippery pretty fast on both sides of the party.

I'm currently running their competitor's crank hub solution, but I'm willing to make a friendly wager that something in the engine will break if I were to dog on the car for an extended period of time. This is the reason why I don't see how it makes business sense for anyone to provide full warranty coverage for a performance oriented part designed to address a known achiles heel of the engine design.
Your points are reasonable, but since VTT is putting their word out there that this solves the problem and will not slip, many of us would like them to put their money where their mouth is as a show of faith. The "no-slip guarantee" comes with a big asterisk. Hell, I'll go so far to say if they developed a product that requires an "expert" beyond your usual mechanic to install, that's not a great product and it's not "set apart from the rest" since it comes with all these what-ifs.

I don't know how this warranty is going to give anyone faith. If your valves and pistons become close friends you're not going to re-install the product that just caused it.

Also, none of this contemplates the recent issue with Ghassan's 135i build in which the VTT crank hub slipped. VTT has yet to make a statement about that situation, but the radio silence so far speaks volumes.
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Last edited by doodlebro; 06-06-2019 at 08:26 PM..
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      06-06-2019, 09:15 PM   #21
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Isn't BMW pinning the crank on the G80 M3? Speaks volumes if so.
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      06-06-2019, 09:50 PM   #22
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Buy our part with a full guarantee. BUT if you blow your motor, we will happily build you another motor and god knows what else will need repair AT around 15-20K. Has to be done here or at our 2 buddies shops. Rest easy though, we will give you our 500 parts that we originally charged 3K for at no cost. This is awesome! I mean, someone wrote this and wasn't kidding. LOL
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