Fi Exhaust
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   BMW M3 and BMW M4 Forum > BMW F80 M3 / F82 M4 Technical Topics > Suspension | Brakes | Chassis

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      07-07-2021, 01:51 AM   #1
FaRKle!
Colonel
United_States
2715
Rep
2,840
Posts

Drives: '17 328d Wagon, '21 M2 Comp
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
Front Sway Bar Install Guide

Like a few others here, I ordered an M2 CS Racing front sway bar and got around to installing it this past weekend. It's still amusing to me that the CSR front sway bar is cheaper than pretty much any aftermarket bar, and it really does seem to be the same as the H&R 30mm F8x front sway bar. Doing a front sway bar install is pretty easy on the M2/3/4 since the bar is mounted under the subframe, unlike on the regular 2/3/4 where you have to drop the front subframe because the bar is on top of it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Index
0:00 Intro
0:14 Stock vs M2 CS Racing Sway Bars
3:17 Prepping to Get Under the Car
3:59 Removing Underbody Panels
6:54 Disconnecting End Links
7:40 Removing Front Sway Bar
8:06 Removing Sway Bar Brackets/Bushings
9:57 Installing Sway bar Bushings/Brackets
11:52 Installing Front Sway Bar
12:43 Connecting End Links
13:48 Installing Underbody Panels
16:32 Closing Commentary
__________________
-328d Wagon Build Log (with helpful reference links)
-My YouTube Channel for some of the best DIYs and in depth information

Please don't PM me for suspension recommendations unless interested in paid private consultations.
Appreciate 3
      07-07-2021, 12:05 PM   #2
stevehifi
Captain
371
Rep
671
Posts

Drives: 17 F80 M3 ZCP
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Irvine,CA

iTrader: (3)

Nice video. You'll need the adjustable endlinks on the front if your car is lowered otherwise stock endlinks become too long and swaybar isn't at the correct level that it should be.
Appreciate 0
      07-07-2021, 04:42 PM   #3
FaRKle!
Colonel
United_States
2715
Rep
2,840
Posts

Drives: '17 328d Wagon, '21 M2 Comp
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehifi View Post
Nice video. You'll need the adjustable endlinks on the front if your car is lowered otherwise stock endlinks become too long and swaybar isn't at the correct level that it should be.
Yup that's the plan (I'm running the stock springs/dampers right now). I have a set lying around already. Interestingly, the SPL LCA may prevent me from getting the optimal geometry once lowered due to their reduced clearance.
__________________
-328d Wagon Build Log (with helpful reference links)
-My YouTube Channel for some of the best DIYs and in depth information

Please don't PM me for suspension recommendations unless interested in paid private consultations.
Appreciate 1
F3061919.00
      08-07-2021, 08:04 AM   #4
jmciver
///M SubDriver
jmciver's Avatar
United_States
1218
Rep
2,269
Posts

Drives: 2017 M3, 2020 X7 40i
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Northeast

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 BMW 128i  [0.00]
2013 BMW X3  [0.00]
2020 BMW X7  [0.00]
2017 BMW M3  [0.00]
Quick question on this, specifically as it pertains to the need for adjustable endlinks on a lowered car. When using adjustable sway bar endlinks with this bar (or any sway bar for that matter) as a result of the car being lowered, how do you determine what the correct “new” endlink length should be? Is it just a matter of installing the new sway bar (with new endlinks disconnected from the bar), then placing the vehicle on the ground (or ramps for access under the car) with the full weight of the car at rest, then adjust to length and install the new endlinks to the sway bar, thus with no pre-load on them?
__________________
///M3 COMPETITION 6MT - 2017 F80 Smoked Topaz Metallic
BM3 / MP-HAS / GC Camber Plates / Carbonstructure Interior
X7 XDrive 40i ///M-SPORT - 2020 G07 Arctic Grey Metallic

X3 - 2013 F25 Titanium Silver Metallic (wife's) / 128i 6MT - 2009 E82 Jet Black (son's)
Appreciate 0
      08-07-2021, 04:42 PM   #5
USSEnterprise
Second Lieutenant
102
Rep
201
Posts

Drives: 18 M3 CS
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: DFW

iTrader: (0)

Hey FaRKle! another great video, nice job.

Do you know what swaybar the F80 M3 CS comes with from factory?
Appreciate 0
      08-08-2021, 01:35 PM   #6
FaRKle!
Colonel
United_States
2715
Rep
2,840
Posts

Drives: '17 328d Wagon, '21 M2 Comp
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmciver View Post
Quick question on this, specifically as it pertains to the need for adjustable endlinks on a lowered car. When using adjustable sway bar endlinks with this bar (or any sway bar for that matter) as a result of the car being lowered, how do you determine what the correct “new” endlink length should be? Is it just a matter of installing the new sway bar (with new endlinks disconnected from the bar), then placing the vehicle on the ground (or ramps for access under the car) with the full weight of the car at rest, then adjust to length and install the new endlinks to the sway bar, thus with no pre-load on them?
I have a previous video on that too, haha. To understand the concept of determining the length, start from 3:50 (front) and 9:53 (rear). For actually doing the adjustment, the procedure you mentioned is the best way, but you can also use the "quick and dirty" method in the video.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Index
0:00 Intro
0:14 Measuring ride height *adjustable end links only*
1:28 Removing the front end links
3:50 Front sway bar geometry and adjustment concept *adjustable end links only*
5:30 Setting the front knuckle to ride height *adjustable end links only*
6:07 Installing the front end links
8:50 Rear end link removal
9:53 Rear sway bar geometry and adjustment concept *adjustable end links only*
10:59 Rear end link installation
12:34 Rear end link length adjustment *adjustable end links only*
13:22 End link adjustment to remove preload *adjustable end links only*
15:33 Installing bottom covers and wheels
Quote:
Originally Posted by xxaarraa View Post
Hey FaRKle! another great video, nice job.

Do you know what swaybar the F80 M3 CS comes with from factory?
This post has some info on that.
__________________
-328d Wagon Build Log (with helpful reference links)
-My YouTube Channel for some of the best DIYs and in depth information

Please don't PM me for suspension recommendations unless interested in paid private consultations.
Appreciate 2
      08-13-2021, 10:03 PM   #7
Jamongkad
Second Lieutenant
United_States
169
Rep
280
Posts

Drives: BMW M3 F80 @yellowmellowm3
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Sacramento, CA

iTrader: (2)

Do you have to get an alignment after installing new sway bars and end links?
Appreciate 0
      08-13-2021, 10:18 PM   #8
FaRKle!
Colonel
United_States
2715
Rep
2,840
Posts

Drives: '17 328d Wagon, '21 M2 Comp
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamongkad View Post
Do you have to get an alignment after installing new sway bars and end links?
Nope.
__________________
-328d Wagon Build Log (with helpful reference links)
-My YouTube Channel for some of the best DIYs and in depth information

Please don't PM me for suspension recommendations unless interested in paid private consultations.
Appreciate 1
Jamongkad169.00
      08-13-2021, 10:54 PM   #9
F82KPowers
First Lieutenant
F82KPowers's Avatar
United_States
278
Rep
364
Posts

Drives: F82, E46 M3, 86' 325, 04 MCS
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by xxaarraa View Post
Hey FaRKle! another great video, nice job.

Do you know what swaybar the F80 M3 CS comes with from factory?
Same as the Comp Pack
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2021, 06:14 AM   #10
USSEnterprise
Second Lieutenant
102
Rep
201
Posts

Drives: 18 M3 CS
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: DFW

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by F82KPowers View Post
Same as the Comp Pack
According to the thread linked by Farkle, CS uses base model sway not competition pack.
Appreciate 1
      09-17-2021, 01:19 PM   #11
sly1types
Captain
230
Rep
674
Posts

Drives: F80M3 and E46M3
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: KC

iTrader: (0)

Whats the part number for it?
__________________
F80 M3-DCT MaxPSI CH, BM3 with F80 Paul E85 and Custom Rom track tune MCS 2Way Remotes
Signature SV104
E46 M3
F85 X5M
https://www.instagram.com/fastmacm3/
Appreciate 0
      09-17-2021, 06:01 PM   #12
MR RIZK
Major
MR RIZK's Avatar
Australia
548
Rep
1,130
Posts

Drives: AW M2C
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sly1types View Post
Whats the part number for it?
It's in the YouTube description.
__________________
Previous Rides: 13' 135i, 08' 130i, 03' HKS Turbo'd 350z, Modded GC8 WRX, NA MX5
Appreciate 1
FaRKle!2715.00
      09-21-2021, 07:29 PM   #13
carbon//m3
Lieutenant
carbon//m3's Avatar
United_States
154
Rep
599
Posts

Drives: m4 vert
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: CA

iTrader: (3)

Nice video and good info.
Appreciate 0
      09-29-2021, 11:53 AM   #14
jmciver
///M SubDriver
jmciver's Avatar
United_States
1218
Rep
2,269
Posts

Drives: 2017 M3, 2020 X7 40i
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Northeast

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 BMW 128i  [0.00]
2013 BMW X3  [0.00]
2020 BMW X7  [0.00]
2017 BMW M3  [0.00]
FaRKle! , any updated impressions on this sway bar upgrade over the stock bar - on the street and/or track? My basic questions are..

1) Did you see a noticeable improvement with less body roll?

2) Did you experience an increased tendency for the car to understeer?

3) In your install video, you installed the sway bar in the "soft" position. Do you think that worked well or would the "stiff" position possibly provide better performance (specifically less body roll without increased understeer)?

I am strongly considering this sway bar upgrade on my F80. And while the driving dynamics are different between the M3 and M2, I figure they are close enough such that whatever changes in driving dynamics (good or bad) you saw on your M2 would be comparable to what I would see on my M3.

Thanks!
__________________
///M3 COMPETITION 6MT - 2017 F80 Smoked Topaz Metallic
BM3 / MP-HAS / GC Camber Plates / Carbonstructure Interior
X7 XDrive 40i ///M-SPORT - 2020 G07 Arctic Grey Metallic

X3 - 2013 F25 Titanium Silver Metallic (wife's) / 128i 6MT - 2009 E82 Jet Black (son's)
Appreciate 0
      09-29-2021, 05:32 PM   #15
MR RIZK
Major
MR RIZK's Avatar
Australia
548
Rep
1,130
Posts

Drives: AW M2C
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmciver View Post
FaRKle! , any updated impressions on this sway bar upgrade over the stock bar - on the street and/or track? My basic questions are..

1) Did you see a noticeable improvement with less body roll?

2) Did you experience an increased tendency for the car to understeer?

3) In your install video, you installed the sway bar in the "soft" position. Do you think that worked well or would the "stiff" position possibly provide better performance (specifically less body roll without increased understeer)?

I am strongly considering this sway bar upgrade on my F80. And while the driving dynamics are different between the M3 and M2, I figure they are close enough such that whatever changes in driving dynamics (good or bad) you saw on your M2 would be comparable to what I would see on my M3.

Thanks!
His follow up video answers your questions.

__________________
Previous Rides: 13' 135i, 08' 130i, 03' HKS Turbo'd 350z, Modded GC8 WRX, NA MX5
Appreciate 2
FaRKle!2715.00
jmciver1217.50
      09-30-2021, 12:33 AM   #16
FaRKle!
Colonel
United_States
2715
Rep
2,840
Posts

Drives: '17 328d Wagon, '21 M2 Comp
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmciver View Post
FaRKle! , any updated impressions on this sway bar upgrade over the stock bar - on the street and/or track? My basic questions are..

1) Did you see a noticeable improvement with less body roll?

2) Did you experience an increased tendency for the car to understeer?

3) In your install video, you installed the sway bar in the "soft" position. Do you think that worked well or would the "stiff" position possibly provide better performance (specifically less body roll without increased understeer)?

I am strongly considering this sway bar upgrade on my F80. And while the driving dynamics are different between the M3 and M2, I figure they are close enough such that whatever changes in driving dynamics (good or bad) you saw on your M2 would be comparable to what I would see on my M3.

Thanks!
Whatever understeer it the bar might've caused, was corrected away with some more camber. The car does feel flatter. I don't think I'm going to try a stiffer setting for a while to keep consistency with some other testing I'm doing.
__________________
-328d Wagon Build Log (with helpful reference links)
-My YouTube Channel for some of the best DIYs and in depth information

Please don't PM me for suspension recommendations unless interested in paid private consultations.
Appreciate 1
jmciver1217.50
      09-30-2021, 06:44 AM   #17
jmciver
///M SubDriver
jmciver's Avatar
United_States
1218
Rep
2,269
Posts

Drives: 2017 M3, 2020 X7 40i
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Northeast

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 BMW 128i  [0.00]
2013 BMW X3  [0.00]
2020 BMW X7  [0.00]
2017 BMW M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by FaRKle! View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmciver View Post
FaRKle! , any updated impressions on this sway bar upgrade over the stock bar - on the street and/or track? My basic questions are..

1) Did you see a noticeable improvement with less body roll?

2) Did you experience an increased tendency for the car to understeer?

3) In your install video, you installed the sway bar in the "soft" position. Do you think that worked well or would the "stiff" position possibly provide better performance (specifically less body roll without increased understeer)?

I am strongly considering this sway bar upgrade on my F80. And while the driving dynamics are different between the M3 and M2, I figure they are close enough such that whatever changes in driving dynamics (good or bad) you saw on your M2 would be comparable to what I would see on my M3.

Thanks!
Whatever understeer it the bar might've caused, was corrected away with some more camber. The car does feel flatter. I don't think I'm going to try a stiffer setting for a while to keep consistency with some other testing I'm doing.
Thanks for the additional insight! My F80 is lowered on the MP HAS kit with GC camber plates set at 2.5 deg of neg camber. On the street this setup performs well for me. On the track I like the performance, but the body roll was still a bit more than I would prefer (even some roll on the street as well). I am not looking for a full blown track suspension setup, so it looks like this upgraded front sway bar will give me the performance improvement I am looking for - and the price for a BMW Motorsport part can't be beat when compared to other options.

Just placed my order! And I will probably pair the new sway bar with SPL adjustable end links for optimal sway bar positioning due to my car being lowered.
__________________
///M3 COMPETITION 6MT - 2017 F80 Smoked Topaz Metallic
BM3 / MP-HAS / GC Camber Plates / Carbonstructure Interior
X7 XDrive 40i ///M-SPORT - 2020 G07 Arctic Grey Metallic

X3 - 2013 F25 Titanium Silver Metallic (wife's) / 128i 6MT - 2009 E82 Jet Black (son's)
Appreciate 0
      10-01-2021, 12:07 PM   #18
jmciver
///M SubDriver
jmciver's Avatar
United_States
1218
Rep
2,269
Posts

Drives: 2017 M3, 2020 X7 40i
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Northeast

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 BMW 128i  [0.00]
2013 BMW X3  [0.00]
2020 BMW X7  [0.00]
2017 BMW M3  [0.00]
Quick follow-up question…. I purchased the SPL adjustable sway bar links for the front as my car is lowered and I would like to have proper suspension geometry when I install the new front sway bar. Any recommendation to get adjustable sway bar links for the rear? I don't intend to replace the rear bar, but just wondering would there be a noticeable performance improvement if I were to add appropriately adjusted rear sway bar end links since my car is lowered. Or are the factory rear links good enough?
__________________
///M3 COMPETITION 6MT - 2017 F80 Smoked Topaz Metallic
BM3 / MP-HAS / GC Camber Plates / Carbonstructure Interior
X7 XDrive 40i ///M-SPORT - 2020 G07 Arctic Grey Metallic

X3 - 2013 F25 Titanium Silver Metallic (wife's) / 128i 6MT - 2009 E82 Jet Black (son's)
Appreciate 0
      10-01-2021, 10:01 PM   #19
MR RIZK
Major
MR RIZK's Avatar
Australia
548
Rep
1,130
Posts

Drives: AW M2C
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmciver View Post
Quick follow-up question…. I purchased the SPL adjustable sway bar links for the front as my car is lowered and I would like to have proper suspension geometry when I install the new front sway bar. Any recommendation to get adjustable sway bar links for the rear? I don't intend to replace the rear bar, but just wondering would there be a noticeable performance improvement if I were to add appropriately adjusted rear sway bar end links since my car is lowered. Or are the factory rear links good enough?
Depends how much you lower the car. Adjustable end links are there to keep the link to swaybar at 90 degree (or oem angle) while adjusting the linkage point to the same oem location so when the bar pivots it doesn't contact anything else. Also when adjusted correctly it will remove any preload from the bar.

IMO I doubt you will notice the difference. I have never seen a post in my lifetime for any car owner that said "wow what a difference after installing the end links". Some cars need to be replaced as under high lateral loads sometimes you can hear the links pop.

If your changing the front it makes sense to do the rear at the same time since the rear will be sustaining a drop at the same time.

Why pay the shop twice for a relatively inexpensive item.
__________________
Previous Rides: 13' 135i, 08' 130i, 03' HKS Turbo'd 350z, Modded GC8 WRX, NA MX5
Appreciate 0
      10-02-2021, 07:45 AM   #20
jmciver
///M SubDriver
jmciver's Avatar
United_States
1218
Rep
2,269
Posts

Drives: 2017 M3, 2020 X7 40i
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Northeast

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 BMW 128i  [0.00]
2013 BMW X3  [0.00]
2020 BMW X7  [0.00]
2017 BMW M3  [0.00]
Thanks!

FWIW, I was not really expecting a significant (or even noticeable) difference in performance with just the end links alone. This is one of those "…well since you are already in there, you might as well consider this…." moments. The "this" is that I am upgrading the front sway bar to a stiffer adjustable sway bar on an already lowered car and the "absolute correct" way to do it is to change the length of the end links, front and rear, for optimum suspension geometry. But I figured I would ask this question in case there was something "special" about the F8x chassis that I may be missing.

My previous street/track car, an '05 E46 M3, had a full blown track suspension w/JRZ Double Adjustables, GC camber plates, GC front and rear adjustable sway bars w/adjustable links and more. Great setup on track (and street), but I don't desire to go that "wild" with my F80. My F80 has been lowered on the MP HAS for the last 20k miles or so (pic below and it is set lower than the "stock" MP HAS recommended height). And while I consider my DIY skills above average, I probably did not pay as much attention to the sway bars and pre-load like I should have. So I figured I would use this sway bar upgrade opportunity to "tweak" a bit more - but not too wild like my previous M3.

Oh, and as far as paying the shop twice for work, well for this job, the "shop" is me - so I am not too worried about that …..
Attached Images
 
__________________
///M3 COMPETITION 6MT - 2017 F80 Smoked Topaz Metallic
BM3 / MP-HAS / GC Camber Plates / Carbonstructure Interior
X7 XDrive 40i ///M-SPORT - 2020 G07 Arctic Grey Metallic

X3 - 2013 F25 Titanium Silver Metallic (wife's) / 128i 6MT - 2009 E82 Jet Black (son's)
Appreciate 0
      10-02-2021, 09:13 AM   #21
MR RIZK
Major
MR RIZK's Avatar
Australia
548
Rep
1,130
Posts

Drives: AW M2C
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

Interesting colour.. not sure I would pick it but for some reason it works.

Since you are doing it yourself just check how orientation of the rear arm sits at your ride height and make a decision from there.
__________________
Previous Rides: 13' 135i, 08' 130i, 03' HKS Turbo'd 350z, Modded GC8 WRX, NA MX5
Appreciate 1
jmciver1217.50
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:49 AM.




f80post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST