SSOTT

[minn19]

Originally Posted by Lups

So black men get arrested in the USA for sitting down in a coffee house, and in Canada man plows over people and the arresting cop is being provoked to shoot him and they take him down very nicely.

Just an observation: I loved Canadian cops.

Well done by the cop, but he is lucky he is going home to his family alive/uninjured.

Not trying to sound like a tough guy, but I would’ve shot him after watching that video. Unless he could see it wasn’t a gun or something else I’m missing of course.

Another innocent dead person doesn’t do anybody any good. Especially that cops family.

[Lups]

Originally Posted by minn19

Well done by the cop, but he is lucky he is going home to his family alive/uninjured.

Not trying to sound like a tough guy, but I would’ve shot him after watching that video. Unless he could see it wasn’t a gun or something else I’m missing of course.

Another innocent dead person doesn’t do anybody any good. Especially that cops family.

True, but somehow it feels safer when even a cop takes a risk rather than shoots in vain.

I can't sleep! J has the famn jaw doctor (see, I forgot the word!) tomorrow, and I'm having a panic attack sorta state Lups way. I already walked the tiny dog (five km( the big dog (10 km) and now, at 1.30 am I'm absolutely convinced the tiny dog needs an other walk since the big one gave me a perfect fu stare when I asked her to go again.

Well trained my ass. The bitch hates me.

[Lups]

"okay, let's put the sunglasses on, and look!"

"Open your mouth!"

"good. Let's look!"

"good. Done. We'll do this again in January. "

"bye! Grow four more teeth!"

Thank coffee I spent a month panicking over this!

[myzmak]

Originally Posted by Lups

Two minutes and the politics ot explodes. Canada...

Originally Posted by Lups

So black men get arrested in the USA for sitting down in a coffee house, and in Canada man plows over people and the arresting cop is being provoked to shoot him and they take him down very nicely.

Just an observation: I loved Canadian cops.

Originally Posted by minn19

Well done by the cop, but he is lucky he is going home to his family alive/uninjured.

Not trying to sound like a tough guy, but I would’ve shot him after watching that video. Unless he could see it wasn’t a gun or something else I’m missing of course.

Another innocent dead person doesn’t do anybody any good. Especially that cops family.

Originally Posted by Lups

True, but somehow it feels safer when even a cop takes a risk rather than shoots in vain.

I can't sleep! J has the famn jaw doctor (see, I forgot the word!) tomorrow, and I'm having a panic attack sorta state Lups way. I already walked the tiny dog (five km( the big dog (10 km) and now, at 1.30 am I'm absolutely convinced the tiny dog needs an other walk since the big one gave me a perfect fu stare when I asked her to go again.

Well trained my ass. The bitch hates me.

So here is 30 seconds of perspective from this side of the border:

(1) Obviously, massive story here. Newspapers are full of the expected 10 pages of coverage, etc, etc. That is expected.

(2) Of more interest is what is missing: even in the first hours, nobody was running around looking at Muslims/blaming Islamic terrorism/etc. For the most part, everyone sat back and let the information come out about who the driver was.

....that is significant because Ontario (the province where this happened) is in the midst of a provinicial election and the guy most likely to win is Doug Ford. Doug is the serially-lying brother of late-great-crack-smokingly famous mayor of Toronto, Rob Ford. Doug is often compared to Trump and they are similar. Both dumb, both populists, both have an absolute aversion to the truth. BUT even with all that, Doug didn't play the 'Islamic terrorist card'. Can you imagine many GOP politicians in the midst of an election not going there?

Why didn't he? Multiculturalism. Toronto is a very diverse city. Less than 50% of European ancestry. What we call 'visible minority' (ie: not white. South Asian, east Asian, African, middle eastern, latin american, etc) are over 50% of the population.

So appealing to white fears is a good way to alienate lots of voters.


(3) Who was the driver? Probably the sort of person who you guys play with on real OT. Socially awkward computer guy.

Here is apparently is praising the 'incel' rebellion.

incel = involuntarily celebate.

huh. who knew there was a word for the condition i had in high school? wonder if they have an alumni group....

some indication he may have had Asperger syndrome.

(4) The cop. Gonna disagree with Minnie here. What this cop did in NOT shooting is far better than the easier act of shooting.

First, a couple points: had he shot, it would likely have been justified. You've probably seen it, but this is the video to watch:

You'll see from 15 seconds in that the suspect is clearly trying to be shot (suicide by cop). He says he has a gun and repeatedly makes quick draw movements to get the cop to shoot him.

I think in the USA he would have been very dead. Hell, I think a good number of cops here would have shot and probably been justified.

BUT: part of being a cop (the hardest part, in fact) is recognizing that you arent just in a neverending struggle with 'bad guys' - some endless war. Your actual job is to protect peace and order and citizens and the rule of law. That means you don't always shoot. In fact, ideally, it means you shoot only when you have no other choice.

Could a cop have felt threatened enough to shoot? sure. But a better cop would hold the shot (which this one did)

ALSO: While I think many canadian cops may have also shot, they would still be less likely to shoot than an american cop. Why? Guns and fear. We have fewer guns so, while they exist and are issues in the minds of our police, it is still less of an issue than an officer would consider there. Down south, it is hard to believe a cop would doubt a guy saying 'I have a gun'. Here? It is not that hard to believe because the odds of the guy actually having a gun are much lower. That is just the effect of gun control.

And that ties to fear. Bad things happen to people and police here, but with less frequency. We don't have a media outlet whipping up fear like you do. It exists and some do whip it up, for sure, but again not as much. That lesser 'fear' and the lack of the same 'state of permanent war' that many american officers feel when dealing with suspects means they are handled a bit differently.

Put all of that together and the actions of the officer become that much easier to see.

He made a hard decision, a decision not all would have made, but it was absolutely the right one.

[Lups]

Originally Posted by (((myzmak)))

So here is 30 seconds of perspective from this side of the border:

(1) Obviously, massive story here. Newspapers are full of the expected 10 pages of coverage, etc, etc. That is expected.

(2) Of more interest is what is missing: even in the first hours, nobody was running around looking at Muslims/blaming Islamic terrorism/etc. For the most part, everyone sat back and let the information come out about who the driver was.

....that is significant because Ontario (the province where this happened) is in the midst of a provinicial election and the guy most likely to win is Doug Ford. Doug is the serially-lying brother of late-great-crack-smokingly famous mayor of Toronto, Rob Ford. Doug is often compared to Trump and they are similar. Both dumb, both populists, both have an absolute aversion to the truth. BUT even with all that, Doug didn't play the 'Islamic terrorist card'. Can you imagine many GOP politicians in the midst of an election not going there?

Why didn't he? Multiculturalism. Toronto is a very diverse city. Less than 50% of European ancestry. What we call 'visible minority' (ie: not white. South Asian, east Asian, African, middle eastern, latin american, etc) are over 50% of the population.

So appealing to white fears is a good way to alienate lots of voters.


(3) Who was the driver? Probably the sort of person who you guys play with on real OT. Socially awkward computer guy.

Here is apparently is praising the 'incel' rebellion.

incel = involuntarily celebate.

huh. who knew there was a word for the condition i had in high school? wonder if they have an alumni group....

some indication he may have had Asperger syndrome.

(4) The cop. Gonna disagree with Minnie here. What this cop did in NOT shooting is far better than the easier act of shooting.

First, a couple points: had he shot, it would likely have been justified. You've probably seen it, but this is the video to watch:

You'll see from 15 seconds in that the suspect is clearly trying to be shot (suicide by cop). He says he has a gun and repeatedly makes quick draw movements to get the cop to shoot him.

I think in the USA he would have been very dead. Hell, I think a good number of cops here would have shot and probably been justified.

BUT: part of being a cop (the hardest part, in fact) is recognizing that you arent just in a neverending struggle with 'bad guys' - some endless war. Your actual job is to protect peace and order and citizens and the rule of law. That means you don't always shoot. In fact, ideally, it means you shoot only when you have no other choice.

Could a cop have felt threatened enough to shoot? sure. But a better cop would hold the shot (which this one did)

ALSO: While I think many canadian cops may have also shot, they would still be less likely to shoot than an american cop. Why? Guns and fear. We have fewer guns so, while they exist and are issues in the minds of our police, it is still less of an issue than an officer would consider there. Down south, it is hard to believe a cop would doubt a guy saying 'I have a gun'. Here? It is not that hard to believe because the odds of the guy actually having a gun are much lower. That is just the effect of gun control.

And that ties to fear. Bad things happen to people and police here, but with less frequency. We don't have a media outlet whipping up fear like you do. It exists and some do whip it up, for sure, but again not as much. That lesser 'fear' and the lack of the same 'state of permanent war' that many american officers feel when dealing with suspects means they are handled a bit differently.

Put all of that together and the actions of the officer become that much easier to see.

He made a hard decision, a decision not all would have made, but it was absolutely the right one.

Yes. All that.

I read something about the guy having mental issues and that he had social issues and that's why this isn't terrorism. I need to rewire my brain since I still can't link Muslims, which as we've been taught lately, are the only bad people in the world alone to the word.

The coverage of this attack was pretty damn good. Toronto clearly has a superior team behind their city. It was very well handled and extremely carefully presented to the world. Hell, even trump didn't tweet!

And now we got back to trump. The fucking idiot just shat all over the Iranians and the EU and well everyone because he is a fucking idiot! I need to stop listening to the radio because the topic of the mayors of Toronto would've been so much better than being surprised about something trump said.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by (((myzmak)))

Put all of that together and the actions of the officer become that much easier to see.

He made a hard decision, a decision not all would have made, but it was absolutely the right one.

I agree with everything, but this (I'm sure you are not surprised) .

The only reason he is correct right now is because he is not in the hospital with a gunshot wound or in the morgue. I'm very curious what the internal investigation will show in the review of how the officer handled this situation. We will never know the outcome of it, but you can bet there is some serious debating in his own PD and every other one in other PDs right now here and Canada. (probably many others as well).

All the info I'm guessing he had to go on is what the suspect obviously did and the fact he was currently pointing an object at him (the officer). I'm guessing in both Canada and the US training program this would've been a clear cut shoot situation in shoot or don't shoot situational training.

As I've said I/we don't know what was said between each other or what the object was that the officer could see. Needless to say I'm glad it worked out this way, but it very very easily could've been different.

[myzmak]

Originally Posted by Lups

Yes. All that.

I read something about the guy having mental issues and that he had social issues and that's why this isn't terrorism. I need to rewire my brain since I still can't link Muslims, which as we've been taught lately, are the only bad people in the world alone to the word.

The coverage of this attack was pretty damn good. Toronto clearly has a superior team behind their city. It was very well handled and extremely carefully presented to the world. Hell, even trump didn't tweet!

And now we got back to trump. The fucking idiot just shat all over the Iranians and the EU and well everyone because he is a fucking idiot! I need to stop listening to the radio because the topic of the mayors of Toronto would've been so much better than being surprised about something trump said.

Yeah, the part I bolded above bugs me too.

I can't help but feel if this guy were from Azerbaijan (as opposed to Armenia) and thus his ancestors were more into a different son of Abraham we'd ignore all the socially awkward stuff and talk about how he is another islamic terrorist.

how many of the kids with middle eastern/muslim backgrounds are just as socially/intellectually f-ed up as this guy but we ignore that because when they post online they don't post to 4Chan and talk about being 'incel' but rather talk about jihad and ISIS?

I really do try to avoid as much trump talk as I can these days. Who he is and what he does isn't a mystery or revelation; he was a piece of shit 5 years ago (or 10), was clearly a piece of shit through the campaign and those that considered voting for him or justify votes for him or did vote for him must do so knowing they are justifying a piece of shit.

As always, I am looking to see how the country deals with what it has done. Will it double down or admit it fucked up and try to correct its error?

[myzmak]

Originally Posted by minn19

I agree with everything, but this (I'm sure you are not surprised) .

The only reason he is correct right now is because he is not in the hospital with a gunshot wound or in the morgue. I'm very curious what the internal investigation will show in the review of how the officer handled this situation. We will never know the outcome of it, but you can bet there is some serious debating in his own PD and every other one in other PDs right now here and Canada. (probably many others as well).

All the info I'm guessing he had to go on is what the suspect obviously did and the fact he was currently pointing an object at him (the officer). I'm guessing in both Canada and the US training program this would've been a clear cut shoot situation in shoot or don't shoot situational training.

As I've said I/we don't know what was said between each other or what the object was that the officer could see. Needless to say I'm glad it worked out this way, but it very very easily could've been different.

Well, from a canadian perspective, as I think I've mentioned before one of the areas in which i practice is police disciplinary work.

This officer won't be subject to any disciplinary work. Didn't do anything that might draw that into play.

Generally speaking, even if there were something someone wanted to try to push (endangering the public?) the key with all use of force/threat assessment models is the deference to the officer's discretion. In the same way it can be hard to criticize an officer for using too much force than is strictly speaking necessary, it is even harder to criticize the officer for using too little force.

The job of this officer was not to shoot a bad guy - it was to protect the public. IF this officer did not believe the guy truly represented a threat outside of his vehicle, he was more than justified in not shooting him even if someone else might have seen it another way.

I am certain that many cops would think he should have shot; but having worked with cops (Full time for a summer, and as clients for the last 18 years) I think there are a large number that think what this guy did was the best thing in that situation.

Remember, police aren't always/shouldn't always take on the 'paramilitary' role that has become their primary position in many ways lately. In the UK, until recently police didn't carry guns - most don't even now. While police have greater legal rights to use force, most of their work should (to the extent possible) be done without force and, in particular, without deadly force.

[Lups]

Originally Posted by (((myzmak)))

Yeah, the part I bolded above bugs me too.

I can't help but feel if this guy were from Azerbaijan (as opposed to Armenia) and thus his ancestors were more into a different son of Abraham we'd ignore all the socially awkward stuff and talk about how he is another islamic terrorist.

how many of the kids with middle eastern/muslim backgrounds are just as socially/intellectually f-ed up as this guy but we ignore that because when they post online they don't post to 4Chan and talk about being 'incel' but rather talk about jihad and ISIS?

It's almost comical for sure.

I've told here multiple times what my country did after our school shootings. Of course the gun shit is straight forward but we actually put a helluva lot more resources to mental health of the young, especially boys. That's the one thing that's a global thing in these, it's always a male.

Finland had a long, proud tradition of depressed young men, who ended up killing themselves a year or two after army. Basically that was the stage when the problems got bigger since mom and dad weren't feeding them anymore, and the old palls had moved on to schools. By then this concept of mass murder suicides was not trending yet so I guess we got very fucking lucky.

It's a well established fact that all gangs prey on vulnerable teenagers, no matter if it's ms 13 or Aryan brotherhoods or the fucking knitting party! Somehow we are not giving giving Isis and palls the same level of feed in shitheadism and apparently they only hire the upstanding citizens with mild tendency for murdering in any means possible.

I think the word terrorism should be banned and we should come up with a new one that'll cover all forms of terrorism. We currently have the words radical Islamic terrorism, and terrorism, and homegrown terrorism which all mean a Muslim did it, but we need a word that'll include these incident fucktards too who shoot at schools, drive around in vehicles killing people and they only get a non offending tone of an incident. Sad!

[myzmak]

Originally Posted by Lups

It's almost comical for sure.

I've told here multiple times what my country did after our school shootings. Of course the gun shit is straight forward but we actually put a helluva lot more resources to mental health of the young, especially boys. That's the one thing that's a global thing in these, it's always a male.

Finland had a long, proud tradition of depressed young men, who ended up killing themselves a year or two after army. Basically that was the stage when the problems got bigger since mom and dad weren't feeding them anymore, and the old palls had moved on to schools. By then this concept of mass murder suicides was not trending yet so I guess we got very fucking lucky.

It's a well established fact that all gangs prey on vulnerable teenagers, no matter if it's ms 13 or Aryan brotherhoods or the fucking knitting party! Somehow we are not giving giving Isis and palls the same level of feed in shitheadism and apparently they only hire the upstanding citizens with mild tendency for murdering in any means possible.

I think the word terrorism should be banned and we should come up with a new one that'll cover all forms of terrorism. We currently have the words radical Islamic terrorism, and terrorism, and homegrown terrorism which all mean a Muslim did it, but we need a word that'll include these incident fucktards too who shoot at schools, drive around in vehicles killing people and they only get a non offending tone of an incident. Sad!

Agreed. Why is this crime less horrific than if he had been doing it in Allah's name? Why are the neo-Nazis that burned swastika's in Georgia the other day seen as less horrible than the jihadists? This guy in Toronto wasn't religious, but he seems to have wanted to spark a revolution of the socially awkward/etc. Why is it less awful that he had THAT reason than belief in a higher power as his justification?

Anyway, frankly, I wish Canada were as good at focusing on things like mental health and less on punishment for criminal activity as many European countries are. One of the drawbacks of being next door to a cultural giant is that there is a constant back and forth with some of their views/practices that influence ours. So the 'law and order/punish the criminal' mentality that is very dominant south of the border is stronger here than it would be where you are. As always, we end up somewhere in the middle but....it can be a challenge.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by (((myzmak)))

Well, from a canadian perspective, as I think I've mentioned before one of the areas in which i practice is police disciplinary work.

This officer won't be subject to any disciplinary work. Didn't do anything that might draw that into play.

Generally speaking, even if there were something someone wanted to try to push (endangering the public?) the key with all use of force/threat assessment models is the deference to the officer's discretion. In the same way it can be hard to criticize an officer for using too much force than is strictly speaking necessary, it is even harder to criticize the officer for using too little force.

The job of this officer was not to shoot a bad guy - it was to protect the public. IF this officer did not believe the guy truly represented a threat outside of his vehicle, he was more than justified in not shooting him even if someone else might have seen it another way.

I am certain that many cops would think he should have shot; but having worked with cops (Full time for a summer, and as clients for the last 18 years) I think there are a large number that think what this guy did was the best thing in that situation.

Remember, police aren't always/shouldn't always take on the 'paramilitary' role that has become their primary position in many ways lately. In the UK, until recently police didn't carry guns - most don't even now. While police have greater legal rights to use force, most of their work should (to the extent possible) be done without force and, in particular, without deadly force.

As a preface to my response this is as non political and emotional analysis (mine) of the interaction. I hear you and agree with a large part of it. Also, I wasn't saying the officer should have been disciplined in any way for it.

First, I think it is a bit unfair the comparisons/assertions that are being made between US and Canadian law enforcement. Is there a different philosophy, of course. Does the US have many issues with their current LE including excessive force, of course. But, in my years affiliated with US LE I never met a cop who wanted to kill somebody. Maybe punch somebody (they always held off though from what I know), but never kill anyone. The threat levels the majority of US cops face are different than Canadian LE as well.

There is a very strong counter argument that this person should have been shot to end the threat period. It is unfortunate what lead the perpetrator to this (mental illness etc), but he could have very easily changed his mind from suicide by cop to shooting/injuring/killing the cop. And then continuing on his original course of action with the rental van or the cops squad/weapons.

Also, I fear this could get Canadian or US cops killed in the future with the lavish praise this officer is getting (and rightfully so to a point). There are times you need to act and kill somebody or be killed yourself. This gut wrenching video was part of our training and clear example why. This officer had an excessive force claim levied against him a few weeks prior and directly led him to making the wrong decisions and unfortunately getting killed himself.

Last, if I was the chief and others that are praising the Canadian way etc I hope they don't have to eat there words in the future in a very bad way. Had this been a terrorist/religious ideologue etc this would've went very very different as mentioned earlier. It also may show attackers in the future they have an edge on Canadian LE because they are hesitant to use deadly force.

I hope all of that makes sense, good discussion.

Edit: I knew about the UK officers as well, unfortunately that didn't work out for them as of late and may have got some people killed.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by (((myzmak)))

Agreed. Why is this crime less horrific than if he had been doing it in Allah's name? Why are the neo-Nazis that burned swastika's in Georgia the other day seen as less horrible than the jihadists? This guy in Toronto wasn't religious, but he seems to have wanted to spark a revolution of the socially awkward/etc. Why is it less awful that he had THAT reason than belief in a higher power as his justification?

Anyway, frankly, I wish Canada were as good at focusing on things like mental health and less on punishment for criminal activity as many European countries are. One of the drawbacks of being next door to a cultural giant is that there is a constant back and forth with some of their views/practices that influence ours. So the 'law and order/punish the criminal' mentality that is very dominant south of the border is stronger here than it would be where you are. As always, we end up somewhere in the middle but....it can be a challenge.

A zillion percent agreed and I wish that was for here as well.

[Lups]

Originally Posted by (((myzmak)))

Agreed. Why is this crime less horrific than if he had been doing it in Allah's name? Why are the neo-Nazis that burned swastika's in Georgia the other day seen as less horrible than the jihadists? This guy in Toronto wasn't religious, but he seems to have wanted to spark a revolution of the socially awkward/etc. Why is it less awful that he had THAT reason than belief in a higher power as his justification?

Anyway, frankly, I wish Canada were as good at focusing on things like mental health and less on punishment for criminal activity as many European countries are. One of the drawbacks of being next door to a cultural giant is that there is a constant back and forth with some of their views/practices that influence ours. So the 'law and order/punish the criminal' mentality that is very dominant south of the border is stronger here than it would be where you are. As always, we end up somewhere in the middle but....it can be a challenge.

Yeah, we've talked about the death sentence thing, the same conversation should work as a model for most of these.

When I met M4tw for breakfast, a few minutes earlier I had a lovely chat with a member of the force there. Basically, I had realized I'm speeding across a country and i have a knife with me (I bought one from Canada, a normal all purpose knife with a 12cm or so blade that'll do the job whether you go fishing, you hit a deer and you need to cut the throat, or if the car breaks down it doubles as a screw driver, basically one of these:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mora_knife ).

So I stopped her and told her that I'm speeding through the country and I feel better always if I have a knife in the boot of the car if something happens and if that's okay in Canada. The rock star she was wanted to know if I had any camping gear with me, since then it would be okay and I told her I had a tent, a sleeping bag, an air mattress but none of the items like paper plates she mentioned.

"you're fine. That's camping. Just if you get caught and someone wants to search your car, you should mention them that you have a knife in the trunk. The boot will land you in jail with your pronunciation."

It took a few years to get the joke. I'll work on my vocabulary. And pronunciation.

I think it's funny. In the USA I locked my kids in the car once when I searched the house for a gun after they told me they were shooting the neighbors cat. Turns out, they were shooting it with tampons which made the the tree in front of our home less than appropriate but they spent an hour in the car while I searched their rooms for weapons and silencers. In Europe and Canada I know countries like mine are filled with guns but I don't exactly think about them ever.

That tampon story will be in my preplanned wedding speech for each of them.

[Lups]

Originally Posted by minn19

A zillion percent agreed and I wish that was for here as well.

And how hard is it exactly?! I mean we in ten years went from shaming people with issues to actually talking about issues. We have this mantra here!

"oh, look at Americans, they talk about their feelings and get help! We need to be like them"

Seriously. Gazillion percent serious. We all need to act and talk for sure but at least you guys have the stigma thing down unlike we did.

[Real Dodger 2.0]

Originally Posted by (((myzmak)))

The job of this officer was not to shoot a bad guy - it was to protect the public. IF this officer did not believe the guy truly represented a threat outside of his vehicle, he was more than justified in not shooting him even if someone else might have seen it another way.

I am certain that many cops would think he should have shot; but having worked with cops (Full time for a summer, and as clients for the last 18 years) I think there are a large number that think what this guy did was the best thing in that situation.

Remember, police aren't always/shouldn't always take on the 'paramilitary' role that has become their primary position in many ways lately. In the UK, until recently police didn't carry guns - most don't even now. While police have greater legal rights to use force, most of their work should (to the extent possible) be done without force and, in particular, without deadly force.

The guy had just killed ten people.

[Lups]

Originally Posted by Real Dodger 2.0

The guy had just killed ten people.

Yeah, and he was more valuable alive to be studied.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by Lups

Yeah, and he was more valuable alive to be studied.

Maybe, maybe not.

[Lups]

Originally Posted by minn19

Maybe, maybe not.

They can hand in a ton of valuable information about the mentality which can help us all to prevent future attacks.

Remember the Norwegian shit? He wasn't kept alive because us Scandinavians are so epically nice but for us to study him. He didn't deserve the mystery dying would've given him. We kind of enjoy his antics, now that he is locked up, because he gives valuable information to the shrinks of tomorrow.

[Captain Blood]

Originally Posted by minn19

Maybe, maybe not.

I seen some reports that he is Asperger-level autistic

[minn19]

Originally Posted by Lups

They can hand in a ton of valuable information about the mentality which can help us all to prevent future attacks.

Remember the Norwegian shit? He wasn't kept alive because us Scandinavians are so epically nice but for us to study him. He didn't deserve the mystery dying would've given him. We kind of enjoy his antics, now that he is locked up, because he gives valuable information to the shrinks of tomorrow.

I don't know, the reason I said maybe/maybe not is psychology isn't my thing. I'm more sociologist minded and really don't know if anything valuable can be gleaned from them. It would be interesting to see if it was/is the case.

But, in my own analysis at the point of this type of contact that stuff goes out the window. I remember talking to one of my professors (who is a very respected high ranking/long time MN State Trooper) about how the socioeconomic/racial issues come into play in certain scenarios. His answer was sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't as the scenario often times dictates what you can/should do or can't/shouldn't do. Being a cop anywhere is one of the hardest jobs out there because of the rapid decisions that need to be made usually with very little information.

In short that is my basic argument. The officer shouldn't be thinking about future research etc, but first and foremost the publics and his/her safety first. If the assailant can be saved for such (and other purposes) great. But, the unfortunate part of an officer's job is that they may need to kill somebody for those reasons and if they can't do that they are a danger to the public, themselves and their coworkers. I'm not saying that this particular Canadian cop falls into that category as he very well may have done everything correctly, but just in a general sense.

Originally Posted by Real Dodger

I seen some reports that he is Asperger-level autistic

I read that to, very sad for all involved obviously.

[Lups]

Originally Posted by minn19

I don't know, the reason I said maybe/maybe not is psychology isn't my thing. I'm more sociologist minded and really don't know if anything valuable can be gleaned from them. It would be interesting to see if it was/is the case.

But, in my own analysis at the point of this type of contact that stuff goes out the window. I remember talking to one of my professors (who is a very respected high ranking/long time MN State Trooper) about how the socioeconomic/racial issues come into play in certain scenarios. His answer was sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't as the scenario often times dictates what you can/should do or can't/shouldn't do. Being a cop anywhere is one of the hardest jobs out there because of the rapid decisions that need to be made usually with very little information.

In short that is my basic argument. The officer shouldn't be thinking about future research etc, but first and foremost the publics and his/her safety first. If the assailant can be saved for such (and other purposes) great. But, the unfortunate part of an officer's job is that they may need to kill somebody for those reasons and if they can't do that they are a danger to the public, themselves and their coworkers. I'm not saying that this particular Canadian cop falls into that category as he very well may have done everything correctly, but just in a general sense.



I read that to, very sad for all involved obviously.

God I love the ssott. I fucking love the way we all have views, and then we talk about them!

I'm not a psychologist either, but basically in my view killing a killer gives the survivors nothing, where as we should learn more about how they came to be.

This cop was in broad daylight with a guy who had clear mental issues and who was screaming that he wanted to be shot. At that range, the cop would've spotted a gun.

[Lups]

Originally Posted by Real Dodger

I seen some reports that he is Asperger-level autistic

Those two have so many differences and similarities we need to find a shrink or a psy to join ssott to get a clear view in the differences.

Btw, I suggested we all would be better off if just banned men. I'm all for it since strap ons are great these days but we have all these young men killing masses of people and that's horrible but all is epically well with women! Right?!

Right.

Women are the biggest risk to a child. Our crisis point comes when we become moms and that also is a very well known fact that we just don't talk about. You guys may do the showy departures, we just do the horribly devastating ones.