Anyone else get banned from the G8X section for making fun of its looks?

[Tecnniqe]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

Yup, China already has $5,000 EVs (Nio maybe? Can't remember the brand) which, of course, are extremely cheaply built and probably wouldn't be legal in any western country but the broad point is ... $5k car

As EV deliveries continue to scale and materials/parts costs continue to fall, you can see the low cost market being overrun by these more/less disposable/recyclable vehicles and/OR mobility services.


I don't understand Toyota's EV positioning - their market is reliable cars ... if all future vehicles are reliable, cheap, and recyclable where is Toyota's niche? Hyundai/Kia is gonna eat Toyota's lunch by replacing their ole-reliable value product with an emotionally-driven value product.

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/ele...u10920-germany

When Dacia first announced the Spring Electric as a concept back in March last year, it led with the claim that it'd be "Europe's most affordable all-electric vehicle".

Well, now it's delivering on that promise, because in Germany at least, prices for the production version will start at €10,920. Very impressive indeed. Technically of course, that's a €20,490 start price for the base-spec Comfort trim level, but the German government provides a €9,570 grant, meaning you can pick up a brand-new Spring for the equivalent of around £9,400.

[Tecnniqe]

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

That's because Benz always cultivated the older wealthier customer; the joke was a Benz is YOUR car and a BMW is your kid's car ... but not a joke. Very much like Rolex has over the last 15 years, Benz spent decades building those customers and then stretching down.

BMW has tried to do the opposite - sell the kids car and stretch up.

And yet, BMW has built many halo cars, the most recent of which was the i8 ... yet they never have the balls to stick with the halo cars and invest in that market. If they did they wouldn't be in this position ...

This partly makes sense. OTH Benz has always been known as "old money, high tech but conservative" whereas BMW represented "new money, and fun to drive".

Driving dynamics and design have always been synonymous with BMW. That's a tougher sell today because the market has caught up.

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by dms-01

I wanted to like a v8 C63 but the sedans just look small IMHO. Coupes look good but I prefer 4 vs 2 doors.

We have a C300 in the stable. The 4 cylinder is powerful but I have a mental issue with paying a luxury price on a 4-banger as it reaks of price gouging. Anyways with 19" it's incredibly response but it's difficult to get a proper seating position with the small greenhouse and the interior bits get noisy over time. Much worse than my older BMW.

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

Brings up an interesting question (maybe only for me) - the new car market has always had a large young-buyer low cost high volume set of vehicles like Civics, Corollas, Escorts, etc ... with EVs, generational change over, Uber/lyft, and other forces at play will this market segment crash?

If so, do the low-cost premium models start to disappear?

I don't think so. I think it's the higher priced models which disappear. EV powertrains will turn automobiles into commodity items because people drive torque not horsepower. EV's provide instant torque.

Other than choice of interior materials what will high priced luxury be able to offer that can't be found on lower priced luxury? They can't get any bigger.

[FormulaMMM]

Originally Posted by stein_325i

I really hope these rumors aren't true. The ship is already sinking, lets not drown it.

Rear-drive 420bhp M2 will pave the way for an M2 Gran Coupé and fiery full-fat M 1 Series

I'll have an M2 Gran Coupe CS! With enough mixing & matching and stacking of variations eventually they'll recreate something like an E90. Proper size, fun, engaging, not revolting.

[stein_325i]

Smoking Tire Review is up.

Originally Posted by TheSmokingTire

The all-new BMW G80-series M3 and M4 are the fastest, most powerful M3 and M4 ever, with an optional 500-HP tune on the S58 engine in Competition trim. But they are also hideously ugly at every angle, they have become huge, and they have been muted by the electronic gods. BUT, BMW is #savingthemanuals​ because both the coupe and sedan come with an optional 6-speed manual! Is three pedals enough driving engagement to bring the fun back to the blandest M4 yet? Zack and Matt find out.

[R N M]

^
The side view on M4 is worse than the giant grills.

[irunalot]

Finally a review where the reviewer is not blowing BMW

[swagon]

Originally Posted by stein_325i

Smoking Tire Review is up.

Zack needs to grow a spine and tell Farah to stop interrupting him; this ain't no podcast with in-house guests having banter.

[stein_325i]

The one time that Sao Paulo Yellow actually works...

[MFNATIK]

Originally Posted by stein_325i

Smoking Tire Review is up.

Skip to 17:02 for the real take...

Some memorable quotes:

"Super super super ugly"

"Extremely heinous looking"

"Doesn't have a good angle on it"

"Enormous design fail"

"I can see the faces of others drivers...say ewwww"

BTW, this is a really sad/disappointing precedent as I have NEVER EVER heard of any reviews in all my 20+ years of BMW ownership, referring to the marquee M car as it has been described above.

[FormulaMMM]

Originally Posted by MFNATIK

BTW, this is a really sad/disappointing precedent as I have NEVER EVER heard of any reviews in all my 20+ years of BMW ownership, referring to the marquee M car as it has been described above.

The external rolling shots are just brutal.

[Tecnniqe]

So what is the TL;DR on everything else except the exterior?

[swagon]

Originally Posted by Tecnniqe

So what is the TL;DR on everything else except the exterior?

Huge car
No need to be this big
Great engine
Less torque down low helps traction
Drives well for a GT car
Not much different from F82
But more sorted ride
Steering and shifter worse than civic type r
Nice cabin
Spacious cabin
Expensive
Get an M2 CS

[swagon]

Originally Posted by MFNATIK

Skip to 17:02 for the real take...

Some memorable quotes:

"Super super super ugly"

"Extremely heinous looking"

"Doesn't have a good angle on it"

"Enormous design fail"

"I can see the faces of others drivers...say ewwww"

BTW, this is a really sad/disappointing precedent as I have NEVER EVER heard of any reviews in all my 20+ years of BMW ownership, referring to the marquee M car as it has been described above.

Don't wanna keep beating the dead horse, but it's pretty telling that even Alpina now use M Sport body kits on their G20 and G30 LCI which they've never done before. Either a behind-the-door deal with BMW or its just that Alpina thinks base models look a lot worse than M Sports. It may very well be the latter.

[65fastback]

I think This car is going to loose more bmw customers than gain new customers. I think it’s pretty clear.

Not a chance I’ll buy one of these. Once iam done with my f82 and depending on what bmw does from here .... I might never be back, this G thing really bums me out !

[Tecnniqe]

Originally Posted by 65fastback

I think This car is going to loose more bmw customers than gain new customers. I think it’s pretty clear.

Not a chance I’ll buy one of these. Once iam done with my f82 and depending on what bmw does from here .... I might never be back, this G thing really bums me out !

If the new M1/2 holds up and does something right it might be a path to go for a fun semi daily at the end of it's generation or something

[Tecnniqe]

Originally Posted by R N M

^
The side view on M4 is worse than the giant grills.

It's better than the door panel alignment at the rear on the 3 😂

[dmk08]

Man Ive been looking for two weeks now and there just are not any deals on clean 6MT F80s. Guess I missed that boat lol

[65fastback]

Originally Posted by Tecnniqe

If the new M1/2 holds up and does something right it might be a path to go for a fun semi daily at the end of it's generation or something

My f82 is not a daily for me... it’s sole purpose is 100% pure entertainment in my life. So big & ugly ain’t gonna cut it.

Maybe hopefully the m2 or 1 will be the new m3 in the future?

[irunalot]

I knew this car would be an incremental step up in performance. It should be its a newer design. What I'm not OK with is it being a modern M6/M5. Not that there is anything wrong with those cars they are just not what I want or expect from a M3/M4. I had a track modified Jag XKR at one time that I loved, and this new car reminds of that one(sans the looks of course). It was capable but hefty, numb, and less fun overall. The S58 is a beast of an engine from a tuning standpoint as I never keep anything stock.

The engine and driving dynamics don’t mean squat if it looks like ass. I’m not paying 80K plus for car in which I need to excuse its design. I keep hearing its “not as bad in person”, “its modern mobile phone cameras”, blah blah blah regarding its looks. All of those are nice delusional ways of saying its fugly… Not as bad is still BAD!