M4 accidentally ordered without adaptive suspension

[gthal]

Originally Posted by nachob

Sir, please do some research.

Now that's a funny comment given to whom it is directed

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Sir Loin

LOL! This is funny, someone is telling Racer20 to go do some research on suspension. nachob, you don't know what Racer20 does for his day job, do you? Go look up Racer20's posts then come back to educate how he should design and test suspensions at work.

This is about to get good. Where's the popcorn?

[BhamDavid]

I suspect we have seen the last of nachob.

[Sir Loin]

Originally Posted by nachob

Sir, please do some research.

Adaptive suspension is a way to control body motion that happen with a soft suspension and would not happen with a firm suspension.

Tell M engineering head Albert Bierman how to control his body motion. Love him some adaptive suspension!

[Lups]

LOL boys, well done.

[DieGrüneHölle]

Originally Posted by BhamDavid

I'm amazed by the fact that so many of you tout how modern and more efficient that the DCT transmission is than the manual trans and then go on about how the passive suspension is better than the adaptive. The adaptive is so much more than being able to dial in more comfort. Watch all of the video I posted above and be educated.

It isn't better. EDC just gets in the way when you get a proper adjustable coilover suspension. You don't have to deal with getting an EDC module to get rid of the error code.

[BhamDavid]

Originally Posted by Blipit_

It isn't better. EDC just gets in the way when you get a proper adjustable coilover suspension. You don't have to deal with getting an EDC module to get rid of the error code.

If a coilover suspension is your desire, then I agree that there's no reason for adaptive suspension. But I would question if you actually would have a better handling car or just a car that looks cooler. There's many hours of tuning that goes into the factory suspension. I doubt that any coilover manufacturer spends as much tuning time.

[DieGrüneHölle]

Originally Posted by BhamDavid

If a coilover suspension is your desire, then I agree that there's no reason for adaptive suspension. But I would question if you actually would have a better handling car or just a car that looks cooler. There's many hours of tuning that goes into the factory suspension. I doubt that any coilover manufacturer spends as much tuning time.

I can guarantee a fully adjustable JRZ, Moten, or TC Kline coilover suspension with camber plates will no doubt provide quicker lap times on weekend track days. The same suspension setups are used in racing for a reason.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by BhamDavid

If a coilover suspension is your desire, then I agree that there's no reason for adaptive suspension. But I would question if you actually would have a better handling car or just a car that looks cooler. There's many hours of tuning that goes into the factory suspension. I doubt that any coilover manufacturer spends as much tuning time.

You'd be wrong. OEM suspensions are all about compromise (..performance versus comfort). They are not about maximizing performance potential. That's not to say that they aren't great, but they aren't the best thing that money can buy.

[angelc5]

Originally Posted by Sir Loin

Why didn't your SAs print out the order list after you made a change? I get a printout from my SA every time I make changes to my order to confirm that the changes is correct.

I did not made any changes that was the original order since the first day that we were able to choose our options, the salesperson just forgot to added when he sent the order. I do have all of my paperwork.

[rubber_ducky]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

You'd be wrong. OEM suspensions are all about compromise (..performance versus comfort). They are not about maximizing performance potential. That's not to say that they aren't great, but they aren't the best thing that money can buy.

This.

While it's true that manufacturers spend substantial amounts of time and money engineering a car's suspension (and engine, and chassis, and brakes, etc), their ultimate goal is to come up with a solution that fits the car's "personality". And the M3/4's personality, while sportier than most sedans (or coupes), is that of a high-performance, daily driving, street car.

[Racer20]

Originally Posted by nachob

Sir, please do some research.

Adaptive suspension is a way to control body motion that happen with a soft suspension and would not happen with a firm suspension.

For example it can reduce brake dive by firming the shock during breaking. If you had a stiff, spring and suspension you wouldn't get as much brake dive. Then when not braking it can continue fluid soft motion on the road. That is very nice but the first step in building an EDC suspension is putting softer springs. Think about it, If you had hard springs you couldn't have soft ride no matter what your shocks do. It is a noble pursuit for comfort but that is its purpose. It is not for pure performance, it is a way of getting performance with a softer suspension. It is also different than other adjustable suspension that go from soft to stiff and stay fixed. I don't actually have much issue with those but where it gets dicey is that the computer is making decisions on how to respond thousands a times per second and that can make the suspension feel strange and hard to learn. so to reiterate so there is no confusion, the EDC is there to offer comfort to a car that is supposed to be a high performance car.

EDC can provide better body control without than passive suspension without compromising comfort. In the case of the M3, you shouldn't think of it as making the car more comfortable, you should think of it as improving body control.

If you prefer the passive suspension, I have no agrument, as I'm sure it's fantastic. But don't bash the adaptive suspension without driving it.

Also, you might want to check my post history before you tell me to do some research. Here, I'll get you started:

http://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=942225
(Written in context of the F30, but you get my point)

Edit: Looks like I was beaten to the punch! Thanks guys. I have no issue with his comments, I'm just trying to make sure misinformation doesn't get spread to far.

[gerbs]

Originally Posted by angelc5

And this is from the supposedly the #1 BMW dealer in the USA.

Every BMW dealership is "the #1 BMW dealer in the USA."

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by gerbs

Every BMW dealership is "the #1 BMW dealer in the USA."

True!

[Racer20]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Some of us get it, but how imperative/crucial is a "micro adjusting damper" to the performance of a street driven car? I can't see EDC/M-Adaptive having any significant impact (...and having had EDC in all three of my E9X's, I can't say that it necessarily improved my driving experience in any meaningful way; yes, I spec'd M-Adaptive on my M4, but simply because of the button ). I understand the science behind the tech, but what people 'feel' is the comfort level between the settings, and it is for that reason that comfort is cited so often.

I'll reiterate: The point of EDC is NOT to improve comfort. It's to minimize ANY kind of body motion. With a passive suspension, you cannot minimize unwanted body motion (roll, pitch, float) without introducing other types of unwanted body motion (kick, jerk, headtoss). With a semi-active suspension, you can get MUCH closer to the ideal of a skyhook ride.

[BhamDavid]

Originally Posted by Blipit_

I can guarantee a fully adjustable JRZ, Moten, or TC Kline coilover suspension with camber plates will no doubt provide quicker lap times on weekend track days. The same suspension setups are used in racing for a reason.

A serious racer will take the time to tune the car for the coilovers and no doubt have a better suspension for track conditions. I can agree to that. But too many people think they can bolt on a set of coilovers and without any tuning of the system or further adjustments to the suspension system to compensate for the lowered ride height, they majically have a better handling car. But then, I suspect most of these geniuses just want to look cool.

[dmk08]

Are you speaking about Hendricks? If so it's the worst dealer I have ever tried to deal with. Called with a cash offer for an 11 E92 and they didn't call me back for 3 days. Bought a car somewhere else.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by BhamDavid

A serious racer will take the time to tune the car for the coilovers and no doubt have a better suspension for track conditions. I can agree to that. But too many people think they can bolt on a set of coilovers and without any tuning of the system or further adjustments to the suspension system to compensate for the lowered ride height, they majically have a better handling car. But then, I suspect most of these geniuses just want to look cool.

To be fair, MOST of the mod-squad don't claim to be extracting the most performance potential from their lowered vehicles. They are going for an aesthetic. These are primarily street cars.

[angelc5]

Originally Posted by dmk08

Are you speaking about Hendricks? If so it's the worst dealer I have ever tried to deal with. Called with a cash offer for an 11 E92 and they didn't call me back for 3 days. Bought a car somewhere else.

Yes, but remember they were voted the #1 BMW dealer in the USA.

[Andrew115]

Originally Posted by angelc5

Yes, but remember they were voted the #1 BMW dealer in the USA.

How many ppl in this thread are ordering from Hendrick? I ordered one from them on the 21st, for delivery at performance ctr.

[DieGrüneHölle]

Originally Posted by BhamDavid

A serious racer will take the time to tune the car for the coilovers and no doubt have a better suspension for track conditions. I can agree to that. But too many people think they can bolt on a set of coilovers and without any tuning of the system or further adjustments to the suspension system to compensate for the lowered ride height, they majically have a better handling car. But then, I suspect most of these geniuses just want to look cool.

Thats why I take my cars to my tuner. Get a proper corner balance done and alignment (dial in some negative camber).

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Blipit_

Thats why I take my cars to my tuner. Get a proper corner balance done and alignment (dial in some negative camber).

So do all of the mod-squad. Do you know how popular tuner installed, corner-balanced and aligned suspensions are? Hell, EAS does them all day long.