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      05-21-2014, 08:40 AM   #331
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Originally Posted by Sapper_M3 View Post
Looks like I'll have to spend more time over at Pistonheads. Seems like an epic battle between two fairly well spoken/written car enthusiasts.

I'll admit I was actually fairly compelled by cmoose, until Chris Harris rolled onto the scene for the smackdown.
Very well said. Jeremy Laird/cmoose "got owned" (as the kids say) by Chris. Well done on Chris' part.
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      05-21-2014, 09:26 AM   #332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
my wife has a 135i and it is fun to drive...until you take it to the track and it doesn't handle worth shit and you feel the loss of power up top as well as its weight
Doesn't handle? The only real fault in the 135s handling would be far too soft rear subframe bushings and dampers. You replace those 2 and the car is a champ even without an LSD.
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      05-21-2014, 09:44 AM   #333
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Chris Harris is getting his own show

It looks like Chris Harris is getting his own TV show. Maybe this explains the wait time for the M3/M4 video? Also may explain the white suit!!!


http://m.autoblog.com/2014/05/20/dri...sports-network
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      05-21-2014, 10:39 AM   #334
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Interesting, things are looking up.
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      05-21-2014, 10:43 AM   #335
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheIceStormOf06
It looks like Chris Harris is getting his own TV show. Maybe this explains the wait time for the M3/M4 video? Also may explain the white suit!!!


http://m.autoblog.com/2014/05/20/dri...sports-network
the white suit is from the ferrari testarossa video.
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      05-21-2014, 10:44 AM   #336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
my wife has a 135i and it is fun to drive...until you take it to the track and it doesn't handle worth shit and you feel the loss of power up top as well as its weight
Doesn't handle? The only real fault in the 135s handling would be far too soft rear subframe bushings and dampers. You replace those 2 and the car is a champ even without an LSD.
nope. handles like a pig for such a small car i was expecting much more.
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      05-21-2014, 11:06 AM   #337
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imserious View Post
Wow, lots of people take Chris Harris as gospel. I'm certainly a fan, but not a disciple.

Anyways, encouraging review. But it didn't really say anything new. It basically confirms what everyone already knows about the car from the specs. It is going to be a superior performance car to previous M3s, but with a different character. What CH's review does is provide some assurance that the drawbacks (steering, turbos, etc.) are not deal breakers. They are just compromises.

I think what will be really interesting is to start seeing the comparisons with current generation competitors. We know what the M3/4 is. Now how does it compare to the C63, corvette, 911, etc?
I wouldn't say Harris insinuates the engine is a drawback or compromise, he actually states quite the opposite for the most part.

Re the comparisons, Top Gear UK stated it is a better car than the new RS4 and C63.
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      05-21-2014, 11:39 AM   #338
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl L
Quote:
Originally Posted by imserious View Post
Wow, lots of people take Chris Harris as gospel. I'm certainly a fan, but not a disciple.

Anyways, encouraging review. But it didn't really say anything new. It basically confirms what everyone already knows about the car from the specs. It is going to be a superior performance car to previous M3s, but with a different character. What CH's review does is provide some assurance that the drawbacks (steering, turbos, etc.) are not deal breakers. They are just compromises.

I think what will be really interesting is to start seeing the comparisons with current generation competitors. We know what the M3/4 is. Now how does it compare to the C63, corvette, 911, etc?
I wouldn't say Harris insinuates the engine is a drawback or compromise, he actually states quite the opposite for the most part.

Re the comparisons, Top Gear UK stated it is a better car than the new RS4 and C63.
maybe he meant turbo lag/throttle response.

ive been driving in sport mode and its so damn instant. i feel like im in a 458. well sort of.
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      05-21-2014, 02:45 PM   #339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3ryder55 View Post
this car's power delivery is epic. 0-60 in less than 4 secs for a 70k car is unreal, rated some 100hp plus less than the competition putting down the same times.

i was on the S65 bandwagon. still am, but now move with the times.

I-6 to V8= the death of BMW in 2007-2008

V8-I-6TT= the death of BMW in 2013-2014

History repeats. This car is much faster, more fun to drive (from reviews) and subjective I like a balance between noise and power. I always hated how the S65 despite having 414hp lacked that feeling of thrusting me back in my seat. To me, it's a balance, I may have a magnificent sounding car, but I want to FEEL the power. The F8X does just that, which is what I commend BMW for. This thing will destroy the E9X in every performance test.


the solution to it all, get an after market exhaust, to make that S55 roar more. How could you not love that backfire after shifting from 1st to 2nd! sounds so brutal!
i think people do to much generalizing of those who didn't like the V8 at first, then loved it in time. there are still people to this day who like the S54 E46, over the S65 e92.

same will go for with the people who like the V8 over the new turbo 6. and a lot of those people will go and get a different brand car. i know its shocking that other car companies sell fast cars also.

the competition is coming out with new models within 2 years. i wont get to caught up on the F80 performance numbers. i mean we are getting a new C63, RS5, corvettes, CTS-v ect.... not to mention the new mustang GT might have M3 performance out of the box. and you wanna talk about epic ? haha
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      05-21-2014, 04:51 PM   #340
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I don't know about the rest of you, but I want to make one observation on acceleration that I'm truly looking forward to experiencing first hand.

I've owned and driven a variety of 14-15 second quarter mile cars, trapping 95-105mph (somewhere in that range). The slower ones felt slow, the faster ones usually had a satisfying top-end or a rush to redline that was a joy to experience.

My e39 m5 is roughly a 13.2ish 1/4 car at about 107-108mph trap speed. It feels incredibly satisfying to drive with lots of low end torque and mind-bending rush to redline...

All of that being said, I've had the joy of driving or riding along in a few ~118mph+ trap speed/~12.0-12.2 second vehicles. One being a CTS-V coupe.

To me, this is truly another league of vehicle acceleration compared to the jump from 15 to 14 seconds or 14 to 13 second quarter mile times, or 95 to 100 to ~108mph trap speeds.

Once you get into this level of acceleration and raw g-force (at the low-end of speed), you truly enjoy a wholly different visceral body experience.

And as much as I feel like a little kid to admit it, I'm big on that rush. I'm big on mashing my right foot in a daily driver and feeling my body slam back and be held back.

Of all the things that excite me about the new M3 - and there are many - this is really the thing I'm most excited to experience early on. Raw g-forces pressing me back into those lovely seats.
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      05-21-2014, 05:10 PM   #341
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA View Post
I don't know about the rest of you, but I want to make one observation on acceleration that I'm truly looking forward to experiencing first hand.

I've owned and driven a variety of 14-15 second quarter mile cars, trapping 95-105mph (somewhere in that range). The slower ones felt slow, the faster ones usually had a satisfying top-end or a rush to redline that was a joy to experience.

My e39 m5 is roughly a 13.2ish 1/4 car at about 107-108mph trap speed. It feels incredibly satisfying to drive with lots of low end torque and mind-bending rush to redline...

All of that being said, I've had the joy of driving or riding along in a few ~118mph+ trap speed/~12.0-12.2 second vehicles. One being a CTS-V coupe.

To me, this is truly another league of vehicle acceleration compared to the jump from 15 to 14 seconds or 14 to 13 second quarter mile times, or 95 to 100 to ~108mph trap speeds.

Once you get into this level of acceleration and raw g-force (at the low-end of speed), you truly enjoy a wholly different visceral body experience.

And as much as I feel like a little kid to admit it, I'm big on that rush. I'm big on mashing my right foot in a daily driver and feeling my body slam back and be held back.

Of all the things that excite me about the new M3 - and there are many - this is really the thing I'm most excited to experience early on. Raw g-forces pressing me back into those lovely seats.
my evo ix did 11's with 3 passengers. LOL....it does get boring after a while though.
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      05-21-2014, 06:32 PM   #342
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
my evo ix did 11's with 3 passengers. LOL....it does get boring after a while though.
That's because the Evos 7-10 were so weedy looking . You wouldn't have gotten bored of the king. My friend had one when I lived in the UK and I'd have bought it from him were I not back stateside

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      05-21-2014, 07:23 PM   #343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
my evo ix did 11's with 3 passengers. LOL....it does get boring after a while though.
Absolutely. Least dynamic of attributes but still the one I most look forward to experiencing right away
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      05-22-2014, 01:16 AM   #344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl L
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
my evo ix did 11's with 3 passengers. LOL....it does get boring after a while though.
That's because the Evos 7-10 were so weedy looking . You wouldn't have gotten bored of the king. My friend had one when I lived in the UK and I'd have bought it from him were I not back stateside

haha yeah. safly we got the "mirage" in the US
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      05-22-2014, 01:16 AM   #345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
my evo ix did 11's with 3 passengers. LOL....it does get boring after a while though.
Absolutely. Least dynamic of attributes but still the one I most look forward to experiencing right away
i guess thats all some ppl care about. i like hard braking better than acceleration lol
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      05-22-2014, 01:46 AM   #346
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
my evo ix did 11's with 3 passengers. LOL....it does get boring after a while though.
Absolutely. Least dynamic of attributes but still the one I most look forward to experiencing right away
i guess thats all some ppl care about. i like hard braking better than acceleration lol
I respect that, but you'll find that 99.99 percent of the population prefers the feeling of speeding up in a car, e.g., racing from a dig or a roll for a specified distance or to a specified speed, to the feeling of slowing down in a car.

On a related note, this is also the reason you rarely see guys in modded Honda Civics lining up next to each other at a constant 60 mph, honking three times, and then stopping as hard as possible to see who has the fastest deceleration. If you and I band together though, we could make one hell of a Fast and the Furious 8.
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      05-22-2014, 01:53 AM   #347
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Totally agreed. I had a tuned EVO IX running about 25psi of boost as well.

Accelerating hard feels good but after I while I wouldn't even bother as I become desensitise to the G force and the car starts feeling slow.

It's the control and feel of the car that gets me excited. Not 11s 1/4 or 12s 1/4 time because in the end they are all irrelevant to how much enjoyment I got out from a car.

If I want to be king of the street I would have chosen a GTR instead.
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      10-11-2014, 01:30 PM   #348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M4 JTD View Post
Chris's notes ahead of the video release:

Engine
Weird noise to begin with. No word of a lie, I laughed out loud when trying to define it - all I could think was 'mapped 335d'. It's less musical, lower frequency and less clearly straight-six than the M235i I'm currently driving. At first I didn't like it much, then it became a non-issue and after thrashing around a circuit for a while I almost liked it. But it's a million miles from the E46 and E92. Would I buy an everyday car on the basis of noise? Probably not. Radio 4 and ZZ Top will always overcome.

Performance
Scorching. The manual will hit 100mph in nine seconds dead, the DCT in 8.7 seconds. It hardly feels turbocharged and the torque is all-consuming. Real-world, this car is miles quicker than the old E92, and the torque means the rear axle loads up much earlier in a given turn, meaning you have the sensation of controlling the car's attitude with your right foot far more than you did before.

Throttle response.
I didn't have any problem with the throttle response. In comfort the throttle is long and a little lazy - normally I like that, but the shorter sport and sport-plus settings worked better in this car for me. In the latter the speakers mess around with the intake noise some more. Compared to, say, an E46 you lose a tiny amount of instant zap, but considering it has two turbochargers, you can take several stabs mid-corner to trim your line and the response is always there. It's worth revving out to 7,500rpm too.

More engine..
Proper M engine, turbos and all? Yup Fuel economy at a cruise is miles better than before - a genuine 30mpg - whereas I used to see 19mpg in my E92. The M3 badly needed some range, it now has it. This is perhaps the most important improvement over the outgoing V8.

Is the motor special enough? For a quick track blast and a few hours on the road, to impress a few hacks? Probably not, especially in light of the deranged V8 model's zap and DTM blare beyond 7,500rpm. But for everyday use, the torque, the sheer speed and the range make the new gizzards - for me - far more appealing.

Colleagues have given it real flak, with the insinuation that it isn't special (dry sump, forged crank anyone?) but I'd buy this car because of the motor, not in spite of it.

Chassis
Flipping good.

Steering
Leave it in comfort. The other two settings simply add weight, and I disliked them both. The 3 Series electric steering rack has been comprehensively re-engineered for this car, at vast expense. Does it feel like a conventional hydraulic rack? Nope. Is it exceedingly accurate? Yes. And the world really does have a short memory if it cites the last two M3s as being steering paragons. The E46 was light but accurate, the E92 lacked initial response off-centre. Neither were great.

This is not steering to savour, but it gives the driver instant confidence, and that is a brilliant trick when allied to all that front axle grip. For a big car, you can place the M3 with uncanny accuracy.

Gearbox
I only drove a DCT, and the manual would need to be somewhere near a late NSX in shift quality to persuade me to not have the two-pedal car. The dual-clutch is fast, smooth in town, gives extra fuel economy and it just suits the power and torque delivery of the motor. Fast shifts give a decent exhaust crack too.

Brakes
We had the optional carbon ceramics, which will make prospective owners look away because they're too expensive. Well, BMW is talking about 7,000 for them, and they're plain superb. If I was going to use this car as intended, I'd have them, and normally I always advise the cheaper steel option. I'm saying that partly because with the standard Super Sport rubber and those ceramic stoppers, you have something instantly track-able.

Cabin
Single piece front seats are spot-on. Steering wheel still too thick, hi-fi very good, iDrive still baffling. Just the right amount of bespoke touches to make it feel that much more special than an F30 3 Series. Incidentally, geeks like me are rejoicing that this car gets its own internal designation - F80. The coupe is F82.

Looks
Not mine to judge really. But if the M3, in that baby blue colour (which is actually a metallic on closer inspection) isn't the best looking M3 since the 1990 Sport Evolution, then I'll call all those E46 CSL owners Jessies. Actually, the CSL is a belting looking thing, isn't it. Look, the F80 has such a sexy rear axle set-down on the road, that people like us will point and grin at them.

Would you?
Absolutely. I loved my E92, but it was surprisingly limited as my daily driver. Opportunities to enjoy that motor beyond 7,000 were predictably limited, the lack of torque left you exposed to turbo hot hatches and, well, you know my thoughts on the range.

This car rights all of those wrongs. In isolation, the motor gets blown into next week by the current C63 507 for pure noise and theatre, but on the road the BMW's fuel consumption and massive torque would swing it for me. Sounds boring, but that's what matters in a daily driver.Not to mention the transmission which makes the Merc's feel pretty antiquated now. And I still think the powertrain feels special enough for an M car.

The rest of the package is BMW M at its best. I think it's a truly special car. It made me smile for the two days that I drove it. When the video comes out in the next few weeks, watch the section where we talk through the level of modification over standard 3er. This car is 50 per cent new.

It's a blinder. I'll have the saloon, the dampers, the big brakes, the DCT, and probably the baby blue. So exactly the car I drove on the launch then.

Chris


Read full notes here:
http://www.pistonheads.com/news/defa...?storyId=30002
Great review .
Having driven both e92 andf80 m3 I much prefer this newer model with the torque from the turbos and the handling is fabulous .
It is a little similar to the Porsche 993 model bing air cooled and struggling with front end grip as opposed to the developed 997 which is a huge improvement but not to everybody's taste
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