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      05-16-2014, 08:25 AM   #23
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First review I've read that states they like the steering in 'Comfort' mode. I'm looking forward to the full review.

This car 'F80' will be the perfect all around car. Fast, great looks, great gas mileage, practical, can pick up the kids from school, take the wife to dinner, and go to the track on Saturday. All for less than $70K if you don't go crazy with options.

I was leaning towards a Z07 Corvette but when you factor all the above into the equation, I think another M3 will be in my garage.

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      05-16-2014, 08:37 AM   #24
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Now I am starting to get enthused because I like Chris Harris's reviews and trust his views more than most of the scribes out there.
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      05-16-2014, 08:47 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW M3 CRT View Post
Can you show me, where he say this ???

For me this sounds more like ... "you must controll the rear axis of the car better to be fast" ... what for him means more fun !?


To me, what he writes here is what I understood to mean that you can control the car more by the throttle than you could before:

Quote:
Real-world, this car is miles quicker than the old E92, and the torque means the rear axle loads up much earlier in a given turn, meaning you have the sensation of controlling the car's attitude with your right foot far more than you did before.
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      05-16-2014, 08:52 AM   #26
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I am glad I ordered mine more than 6 months ago.
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      05-16-2014, 09:22 AM   #27
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Once again I can see that CH values things differently than me. Still looking forward to the full review, they are always entertaining. Unfortunately most of what I see as potential let downs are there in his notes, he just don't care about them, numb steering and all. He mostly praises the engines easy access to power ( low end TQ ) and how it makes it a good DD, if I was looking for that I'd save a lot of money and drive a 335i or a diesel car. An M3 should have an engine that is what he say it hasn't, very special. Let's see if he buys one.

Last edited by solstice; 05-16-2014 at 09:38 AM.
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      05-16-2014, 09:34 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Once again I can see that CH values things differently than me. Still looking forward to the full review, they are always entertaining. Unfortunately most of what I see as potential let downs are there in his notes, he just don't care about them, numb steering and all. He mostly praises the engines easy access to power ( low end TQ ) and how it makes it a good DD, if I was looking for that I'd save a lot of money and drive a 335i or a diesel car. An M3 should be what he say it isn't, very special. Let's see if he buys one.
Uh...

"I think it's a truly special car."
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      05-16-2014, 09:35 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Once again I can see that CH values things differently than me. Still looking forward to the full review, they are always entertaining. Unfortunately most of what I see as potential let downs are there in his notes, he just don't care about them, numb steering and all. He mostly praises the engines easy access to power ( low end TQ ) and how it makes it a good DD, if I was looking for that I'd save a lot of money and drive a 335i or a diesel car. An M3 should be what he say it isn't, very special. Let's see if he buys one.
How did you come up with numb steering from that review? Never once said anything like that. He actually would lead you to believe the steering on the E9x M3 was more numb than the new car. He said you could put the car exactly where you want it. You can't do that with numb steering.
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      05-16-2014, 09:38 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Once again I can see that CH values things differently than me. Still looking forward to the full review, they are always entertaining. Unfortunately most of what I see as potential let downs are there in his notes, he just don't care about them, numb steering and all. He mostly praises the engines easy access to power ( low end TQ ) and how it makes it a good DD, if I was looking for that I'd save a lot of money and drive a 335i or a diesel car. An M3 should be what he say it isn't, very special. Let's see if he buys one.
I can see that there are perhaps a bit of disapointing DD focus in his review (or rather not disapointing as a DD, but that he uses so much space on how good a DD it is).

But, I still see more positives on the overall package also as a track car/fun car. And on the steering I read his review to say that it's probably better than in the E9x?

But after all, it comes down to what he likes. And that isn't necessarily the same as what you like/prefer/emphasise in a car
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      05-16-2014, 09:39 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallshortguy View Post
Uh...

"I think it's a truly special car."
Thanks I ignored that part since earlier he indicates that the engine isn't that special other than the TQ. I updated the part you took issue with.
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      05-16-2014, 09:39 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallshortguy View Post
Uh...

"I think it's a truly special car."

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      05-16-2014, 09:42 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMPowerJ View Post
How did you come up with numb steering from that review? Never once said anything like that. He actually would lead you to believe the steering on the E9x M3 was more numb than the new car. He said you could put the car exactly where you want it. You can't do that with numb steering.
He says it's precise. It mirrors what all of them say. Precise and communicative is not the same. It also loads up well, again not the same a communicative. He doesn't say numb straight out but it's there between the lines so to say.
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      05-16-2014, 09:43 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Thanks I ignored that part since earlier he indicates that the engine isn't that special other than the TQ. I updated the part you took issue with.
I never read that he said the engine wasn't special...

Here is his conclusion:

And I still think the powertrain feels special enough for an M car.
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      05-16-2014, 09:45 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330 View Post
I can see that there are perhaps a bit of disapointing DD focus in his review (or rather not disapointing as a DD, but that he uses so much space on how good a DD it is).

But, I still see more positives on the overall package also as a track car/fun car. And on the steering I read his review to say that it's probably better than in the E9x?

But after all, it comes down to what he likes. And that isn't necessarily the same as what you like/prefer/emphasise in a car
Exactly, I can see what he values most and it differs to what I value most in a car like an M3. No surprise, it's the same with most cars he reviews, so I know he is not a good source for me when it comes to his subjective ratings. I still enjoy his reviews. I also know that I'm n a minority where he is the god of reviewers for many here, to each their own.
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      05-16-2014, 09:45 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
He says it's precise. It mirrors what all of them say. Precise and communicative is not the same. It also loads up well, again not the same a communicative. He doesn't say numb straight out but it's there between the lines so to say.
Well, at least it gives enough feedback for the driver to feel confident

This is not steering to savour, but it gives the driver instant confidence
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      05-16-2014, 09:46 AM   #37
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Light steering... boy that scares me. It scared me miles away from a regular F30. If it doesn't provide a proper, heavy weighed BMW feedback... I am truly scared.
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      05-16-2014, 09:47 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Exactly, I can see what he values most and it differs to what I value most in a car like an M3. No surprise, it's the same with most cars he reviews, so I know he is not a good source for me when it comes to his subjective ratings. I still enjoy his reviews.
Fair enough. In this day and age of Chris Harris worship, it's probably good to remind ourselves that his preferences might not be everyone elses
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      05-16-2014, 09:48 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP View Post
Light steering... boy that scares me. It scared me miles away from a regular F30. If it doesn't provide a proper, heavy weighed BMW feedback... I am truly scared.
Did he say it had light steering?

He mentioned that as a problem on the E46 M3 though...
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      05-16-2014, 09:50 AM   #40
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Well, this was the review many were waiting for and if this doesn't persuade people to not write this car off*, then nothing will.

I especially liked this line:

Quote:
Leave it in comfort. The other two settings simply add weight, and I disliked them both. The 3 Series electric steering rack has been comprehensively re-engineered for this car, at vast expense. Does it feel like a conventional hydraulic rack? Nope. Is it exceedingly accurate? Yes. And the world really does have a short memory if it cites the last two M3s as being steering paragons. The E46 was light but accurate, the E92 lacked initial response off-centre. Neither were great.
This is not steering to savour, but it gives the driver instant confidence, and that is a brilliant trick when allied to all that front axle grip. For a big car, you can place the M3 with uncanny accuracy.
....as it mirrored the points I was trying to make in these two posts:

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...g#post15928716

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...w#post15958808


* ....and if you missed the sarcasm, saying "not write this off" was extremely tongue in cheek. This is a fantastic review. Clearly prefers this car over E90 AND the C63 507 (which he drives). Y'all shouldn't be 'dreading' this car or apprehensive, but you should be excited

go on.

try being excited.

its ok.

it will be our little secret.....
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      05-16-2014, 09:50 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330 View Post
Well, at least it gives enough feedback for the driver to feel confident

This is not steering to savour, but it gives the driver instant confidence
Yes, so do most steerings so today and I'm not concerned about that. It's about making the car feel alive. No one curious why the 1M got so much more passionate praise while it has a very similar engine but likely a worse chassis? I bet the steering has a lot to do with it even if many don't immediately connect the dots.
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      05-16-2014, 09:51 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
numb steering and all.
I have to admit that when I first got my E92, I didn't find the steering feedback that great. When I dialed-in a fair bit more camber up front (with the installation of GC camber plates), it totally changed the steering feel. The feedback was increased significantly, I can now feel everything the front tires are doing and the steering is alive in my hands. I increased the camber to better manage tire wear at the track, but the improved steering feel was a very welcome side benefit.

Maybe we will also be able to improve the steering feedback on the F8X with more camber. That would be an easy fix .
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      05-16-2014, 09:52 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330 View Post
Originally Posted by @ASAP

Light steering... boy that scares me. It scared me miles away from a regular F30. If it doesn't provide a proper, heavy weighed BMW feedback... I am truly scared.

....

Did he say it had light steering?

He mentioned that as a problem on the E46 M3 though...
No.

He didn't.

He said comfort was lighter than sport and sport + and he thought they added unnecessary weight.
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      05-16-2014, 09:53 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Thanks I ignored that part since earlier he indicates that the engine isn't that special other than the TQ. I updated the part you took issue with.
np, just wanted to make sure there weren't misunderstandings

Although to be fair he did mention the response was pretty special for a turbo engine.
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