Michelin Pilot Sport 4S

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by CigarPundit

Thanks much! I’m being told by EAS that there is a generic 295 PS4S now in addition to the (M0) that is wider than the 285. I’m going to confirm this, but if so, I’ll go with the 295.

I do not see a 295/35R19 generic PS4S listed on TireRack, maybe it will come soon. Note that a generic 295 will likely be optimized around a 10.5" wide wheel, so it will not necessarily be optimal on the stock 10" wide rear wheels. Depending how much more tread width the 295 has over the 285, it might still be better to go with the 285.

[gatorfast]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

I do not see a 295/35R19 generic PS4S listed on TireRack, maybe it will come soon. Note that a generic 295 will likely be optimized around a 10.5" wide wheel, so it will not necessarily be optimal on the stock 10" wide rear wheels. Depending how much more tread width the 295 has over the 285, it might still be better to go with the 285.

Isnt the 265/35 tire that you and many others are running on the fronts optimized for a 9.5" wheel?

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by gatorfast

Isnt the 265/35 tire that you and many others are running on the fronts optimized for a 9.5" wheel?

I run the 265/35R19(M0) PSS from the AMG GT-S which has a 9" wide front wheel. I did my research .

[ByeFelicia]

Anyone here on 295/30/19's and rub?

Im on a BBS LM 19x10 et 25 with that spec above and on swift springs and rub on highway dips and undulations. Hoping it's just the fender liner

Want to continue to run this aggressive tire and have seen people run the same thing in a 20' spec...

[CigarPundit]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

I do not see a 295/35R19 generic PS4S listed on TireRack, maybe it will come soon. Note that a generic 295 will likely be optimized around a 10.5" wide wheel, so it will not necessarily be optimal on the stock 10" wide rear wheels. Depending how much more tread width the 295 has over the 285, it might still be better to go with the 285.

I’m putting the tires on 9.5” fronts and 10.5” rears. I’m not seeing the generic 295 listed either. I’ve followed up with EAS on this and will likely run the 285 for the bigger contact patch if there is, in reality, no generic 295 available when I pull the trigger in about a month or so. Thanks again!

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by CigarPundit

I’m putting the tires on 9.5” fronts and 10.5” rears. I’m not seeing the generic 295 listed either. I’ve followed up with EAS on this and will likely run the 285 for the bigger contact patch if there is, in reality, no generic 295 available when I pull the trigger in about a month or so. Thanks again!

Aha, that changes things! IMO 265-285/35R19 is the ideal PS4S combo for your setup until they come up with a generic 295

[gatorfast]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

I run the 265/35R19(M0) PSS from the AMG GT-S which has a 9" wide front wheel. I did my research .

Makes sense

So if one were to stick with the generic tires and not the AMG specific tires, would it be preferred to stay with a 255/35 front made for a 9" wheel and a 285/35 rear made for a 10" wheel? I realize this would move away from the oem size by increasing the circumference of the rear only, but would that be better than using a 265/35 on the front which would keep the front/rear circumference ratio (when paired with the 285/35 rear) but be "squished" on a 9" wheel when it is made for a 9.5" wheel?

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by gatorfast

Makes sense

So if one were to stick with the generic tires and not the AMG specific tires, would it be preferred to stay with a 255/35 front made for a 9" wheel and a 285/35 rear made for a 10" wheel? I realize this would move away from the oem size by increasing the circumference of the rear only, but would that be better than using a 265/35 on the front which would keep the front/rear circumference ratio (when paired with the 285/35 rear) but be "squished" on a 9" wheel when it is made for a 9.5" wheel?

It's actually quite more complex than this. As with any other aspect of chassis tuning, it's all a question of compromise and what aspect one wants to favor relative to another.

In general terms, a tire with a wider contact patch will offer more total dry grip but less aquaplaning resistance while a tire with less bloated sidewalls will offer sharper handling response. It all depends what aspect one wants to favor.

[gatorfast]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

It's actually quite more complex than this. As with any other aspect of chassis tuning, it's all a question of compromise and what aspect one wants to favor relative to another.

In general terms, a tire with a wider contact patch will offer more total dry grip but less aquaplaning resistance while a tire with less bloated sidewalls will offer sharper handling response. It all depends what aspect one wants to favor.

Understood. But taking out the compromise between grip and handling, is the importance of keeping the front/rear circumference measurements consistent for purposes of DSC interference more important than using a tire designed for a certain wheel width?

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by gatorfast

Understood. But taking out the compromise between grip and handling, is the importance of keeping the front/rear circumference measurements consistent for purposes of DSC interference more important than using a tire designed for a certain wheel width?

That decision is also part of the overall compromise. In my case, by going with a 265-295/35R19 combo, I decided to slightly compromise the DSC/ABS calibration in favor of more optimized tires for dry grip and handling. By going with slightly larger diameter rear tires, it should theoretically yield less DSC intervention during acceleration, which for me is a good thing.

[CigarPundit]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Aha, that changes things! IMO 265-285/35R19 is the ideal PS4S combo for your setup until they come up with a generic 295

I contacted Michelin directly and was told there are no production plans to bring out a generic 295/35/R19, so 285it is.

[CigarPundit]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

The 265-295/35R19 combo is exactly the size I presently have on my M4, albeit in PSS, so definitely no issue.

Okay last question: why did you stick with PSS instead of going with the PS4S? I’m wondering what else you may know that I don’t!

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by CigarPundit

Okay last question: why did you stick with PSS instead of going with the PS4S? I’m wondering what else you may know that I don’t!

For me, it was mostly a question of economics and timing.

I also believe that the PS4S improvement over the PSS is grossly overstated on the forums, mostly because folks compare worn/aged PSS to brand new PS4S. Naturally, a brand new tire will be much better than a worn/aged one. When I replaced my worn 295/35R19 PSS with new ones, I felt a massive improvement in grip with the exact same tire

Don't get me wrong, the PS4S are an improvement over the PSS, but not as significant as most folks report. I installed PS4S on my wife's S4 last year replacing her worn PSS, so I do have first hand experience with the PS4S. I find the most signifcant area of improvement are in wet grip and road noise. They are alslo less expensive and apparently last longer. However, dry grip and responsivness improvements are marginal IMO.

On my M4, I only needed to replace the rear. The available PS4S only offered narrower tread widths than the 295 PSS I was using and I wanted to avoid mismatched front-rear tires, hence why I decided to stick with the PSS. With the 265(M0)-295(*)/35R19 PSS, I had a setup that worked very well for me, so why mess with it.

[CigarPundit]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

For me, it was mostly a question of economics and timing.

I also believe that the PS4S improvement over the PSS is grossly overstated on the forums, mostly because folks compare worn/aged PSS to brand new PS4S. Naturally, a brand new tire will be much better than a worn/aged one. When I replaced my worn 295/35R19 PSS with new ones, I felt a massive improvement in grip with the exact same tire

Don't get me wrong, the PS4S are an improvement over the PSS, but not as significant as most folks report. I installed PS4S on my wife's S4 last year replacing her worn PSS, so I do have first hand experience with the PS4S. I find the most signifcant area of improvement are in wet grip and road noise. They are alslo less expensive and apparently last longer. However, dry grip and responsivness improvements are marginal IMO.

On my M4, I only needed to replace the rear. The available PS4S only offered narrower tread widths than the 295 PSS I was using and I wanted to avoid mismatched front-rear tires, hence why I decided to stick with the PSS. With the 265(M0)-295(*)/35R19 PSS, I had a setup that worked very well for me, so why mess with it.

Thanks. I really want a 295 in the rear, both for the bigger tread patch and, if I’m being honest, the look of the wider rubber in the rear. The debate I’m having with myself right now I whether I’m willing to forego a 295 in order to get the PS4S. I’d like to get the better wet grip, reduced road noise, and longer tread life of the PS4S, but it’s a close call for me when the price of admission is staying with a 285.

LOL, first world problems...I’m agonizing over 10mm of rubber on the ass end of my M3

[hellokitty]

Originally Posted by CigarPundit

Thanks. I really want a 295 in the rear, both for the bigger tread patch and, if I’m being honest, the look of the wider rubber in the rear. The debate I’m having with myself right now I whether I’m willing to forego a 295 in order to get the PS4S. I’d like to get the better wet grip, reduced road noise, and longer tread life of the PS4S, but it’s a close call for me when the price of admission is staying with a 285.

LOL, first world problems...I’m agonizing over 10mm of rubber on the ass end of my M3

I just gave up and went ahead to order 265/30/20 and 285/30/20.

It arrived yesterday. It's a FAT tire

[hellokitty]

285/30/20

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by hellokitty

I just gave up and went ahead to order 265/30/20 and 285/30/20.

It arrived yesterday. It's a FAT tire

The 285/30R2 PS4S is indeed a “fat” tire. Much more so than the 285/35R19.

[CigarPundit]

I realize this is a shot in the dark, but if anyone has side by side photos of the PS4S 285/35-R19 and PSS 295/35-R19 showing the relative widths, or even photos of these two tires on a car from the back, I would be grateful to see them.

[Justin.AutoTalent]

Originally Posted by CigarPundit

I realize this is a shot in the dark, but if anyone has side by side photos of the PS4S 285/35-R19 and PSS 295/35-R19 showing the relative widths, or even photos of these two tires on a car from the back, I would be grateful to see them.

Probably not the best photos, but Arcades has 285/35/19 P4S and Oreganoflow has 295/35/19 P4S..... Both on BBS FI-R. Maybe they can contribute a couple pics



My customer Mark's M is no longer on the forums but has the 295/35/19 PSS, also on BBS FI-R

A few pics he shared with me of his old ride

[CigarPundit]

Originally Posted by Justin.AutoTalent

Probably not the best photos, but Arcades has 285/35/19 P4S and Oreganoflow has 295/35/19 P4S..... Both on BBS FI-R. Maybe they can contribute a couple pics

Thanks Justin! Those are actually really interesting photos because, to me, the beefy look of those tires looks better on a lowered car (and on grey), where they blend in, than on stock ride height (and on blue), where they really pop.

[hellokitty]

285/30/20 works like a champ. New tires and a better alignment = hooks in 2nd finally!

Warmer temps definitely help. Worth the upgrade just for the additional comfort alone.

[mattkim85]

switched over from 305/30/19 MPSS to 285/30/20 MP4S (rears) and I can finally hook on 2nd without engaging TC at full throttle Sport+/S3. just like the previous post, I'm sure the higher temps helped, but I was never consistently able to full throttle it without engaging TC with the wider MPSS. I'm extremely happy with the switch.