Recommended Jump Starter?

[michaelalex17]

So... very interesting update. I reached out to NOCO customer support and they said the product is not compatible with lithium ion batteries. I wrote back and said that it has lithium ion in the name how could it not work and their reply was that the product itself has a lithium ion battery in it not that it works with lithium ion batteries. Aside from the confusing marketing I seem to be back to square one

[michaelalex17]

So basically if the battery in my car dies I'm screwed?

[aboulfad]

Originally Posted by michaelalex17

So basically if the battery in my car dies I'm screwed?

sorry, but did you read in details the posts in this thread? Sure there are always conflicting opinions on forums, but one must apply common sense. What did BMW say about that topic in the earlier linked technical docs from ISTA? And when you call BMW road assistance, what do you think they have in their trucks?

A jump starter is a tool to apply a voltage for a very brief moment of time to aid the engine to crank... once the engine starts and the jump starter is disconnected, it's the car's alternator and battery management systems that take care of charging. So you have three choices, buy any good normal jump starter, ask another car to jump start your car, or call BMW road assistance in case of need and refuse their service when they show up with a typical lead acid battery jump starter... :

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by aboulfad

sorry, but did you read in details the posts in this thread? Sure there are always conflicting opinions on forums, but one must apply common sense. What did BMW say about that topic in the earlier linked technical docs from ISTA? And when you call BMW road assistance, what do you think they have in their trucks?

A jump starter is a tool to apply a voltage for a very brief moment of time to aid the engine to crank... once the engine starts and the jump starter is disconnected, it's the car's alternator and battery management systems that take care of charging. So you have three choices, buy any good normal jump starter, ask another car to jump start your car, or call BMW road assistance in case of need and refuse their service when they show up with a typical lead acid battery jump starter... :

I reached out to NOCO and their customer support specifically told me not to use their jump starter on a lithium ion battery so I can't just buy any jump starter

[aboulfad]

Originally Posted by michaelalex17

I reached out to NOCO and their customer support specifically told me not to use their jump starter on a lithium ion battery so I can't just buy any jump starter

I read what you posted above, your only remaining choice is to ask a semaritan to jump start your car with their vehicle in case your battery sleeps. Keep a pair of jump start cables handy and not inside your trunk obviously...

[whitefrs]

Get yourself a NOCO battery charger
Amazon has the best prices.

If you wont use it for more than 2 days, hook it up

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by whitefrs

Get yourself a NOCO battery charger
Amazon has the best prices.

If you wont use it for more than 2 days, hook it up

Can't use a charger because I live in an apartment building and there are no outlets in the garage

[whitefrs]

Originally Posted by michaelalex17

Can't use a charger because I live in an apartment building and there are no outlets in the garage

Ahh that sucks man
This thing really brings batteries from the death

[M-Powah]

It sounds like you should just go start your car for 30 minutes every few weeks like I do. I also live in an apartment complex with underground parking. Every 3 weeks last year I went and started my car for about 30 minutes and shut it off. No issues on my end and on winter #2.

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by M-Powah

It sounds like you should just go start your car for 30 minutes every few weeks like I do. I also live in an apartment complex with underground parking. Every 3 weeks last year I went and started my car for about 30 minutes and shut it off. No issues on my end and on winter #2.

I just thought of another issue unless I am missing something. If the battery dies how am I supposed to get into the trunk to jump start it? There is no manual key hole on the trunk...

[2kaccordocoupe]

Originally Posted by michaelalex17

I just thought of another issue unless I am missing something. If the battery dies how am I supposed to get into the trunk to jump start it? There is no manual key hole on the trunk...

The car has jump points under the hood, you don't need access to the trunk to jump it.

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by 2kaccordocoupe

The car has jump points under the hood, you don't need access to the trunk to jump it.

Ahh makes sense thank you!

[2kaccordocoupe]

Originally Posted by michaelalex17

Ahh makes sense thank you!

No prob. Pop the hood you'll see the positive post under a red cap on the passenger side of the car next to the windshield washer reservoir fill.

The negative is a bolt attached to the body a bit further down towards the headlights. I'm describing it off memory but if you look for your self under the hood or check the owners manual it also tells you all about it. Can't miss it.

[Zermatt]

Originally Posted by michaelalex17

So... very interesting update. I reached out to NOCO customer support and they said the product is not compatible with lithium ion batteries. I wrote back and said that it has lithium ion in the name how could it not work and their reply was that the product itself has a lithium ion battery in it not that it works with lithium ion batteries. Aside from the confusing marketing I seem to be back to square one

It is because lithium batteries are especially prone to thermal runaways - more so than AGM and Lead Acid batteries. If you do end up getting a battery jump starter, I highly recommend the RavPower RP-PB053 currently on sale on Amazon for $60.

This unit is better than the NOCO and many others because its composition is LiFePO4 rather than the more common Lithium Ion. LiFePO4 is what our F8x batteries have because they can safely operate in high temperature environments. - Important if you want to keep your battery pack in your car during the summer or like myself, using it to power my DashCam when in parking mode and charging while the vehicle is running. (This unit has more capacity and is far cheaper than the CellLinkB or BlackVue Power Magic battery packs)

[chris719]

Originally Posted by Zermatt

It is because lithium batteries are especially prone to thermal runaways - more so than AGM and Lead Acid batteries. If you do end up getting a battery jump starter, I highly recommend the RavPower RP-PB053 currently on sale on Amazon for $60.

This unit is better than the NOCO and many others because its composition is LiFePO4 rather than the more common Lithium Ion. LiFePO4 is what our F8x batteries have because they can safely operate in high temperature environments. - Important if you want to keep your battery pack in your car during the summer or like myself, using it to power my DashCam when in parking mode and charging while the vehicle is running. (This unit has more capacity and is far cheaper than the CellLinkB or BlackVue Power Magic battery packs)

Does this pack actually work to jump a dead car for you? There are quite a few 1 star reviews that claim it doesn't hold a charge or work at all.

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by Zermatt

It is because lithium batteries are especially prone to thermal runaways - more so than AGM and Lead Acid batteries. If you do end up getting a battery jump starter, I highly recommend the RavPower RP-PB053 currently on sale on Amazon for $60.

This unit is better than the NOCO and many others because its composition is LiFePO4 rather than the more common Lithium Ion. LiFePO4 is what our F8x batteries have because they can safely operate in high temperature environments. - Important if you want to keep your battery pack in your car during the summer or like myself, using it to power my DashCam when in parking mode and charging while the vehicle is running. (This unit has more capacity and is far cheaper than the CellLinkB or BlackVue Power Magic battery packs)

I don't think it matters that the battery in the unit is LiFePO4. Does that make it compatible with jump-starting our car? I had given up on this search because everyone said there are no jump starter packs that work with the M3/M4

[Zermatt]

Originally Posted by chris719

Does this pack actually work to jump a dead car for you? There are quite a few 1 star reviews that claim it doesn't hold a charge or work at all.

You have a valid concern about the 23% 1-star ratings on it however Ive had good success with mine. Typically I shy away from items that have over 10% 1-star ratings. At least RavPower has a long and generous warranty.

While Ive used it to jump start the car a couple times, my primary use for this is a battery pack for my Dash Cam and bought it because its internal LiFePO4 battery vs the far more common Li-ion battery. Its connected to charge from the car's ACC +12v.

[Zermatt]

Originally Posted by michaelalex17

I don't think it matters that the battery in the unit is LiFePO4. Does that make it compatible with jump-starting our car? I had given up on this search because everyone said there are no jump starter packs that work with the M3/M4

In a general sense you are correct, it doesn't really matter when it comes to jump starting or for that matter, providing x amount of power.

If you intend to store a jump start battery back in your vehicle in the summer months, definitely go with one that has LiFePO4 because it can be safely stored in a high temp environment whereas Li-ion batteries become a fire hazard in high temps as well as likely subjecting it to a shorter life span.

I speculate that the manufactures of these battery jump-start packs are putting warning labels not to use on vehicles with Lithium batteries because of the risk of a thermal run-away and its associated liability to their company. While lead acid batteries can also theoretically experience a thermal run-away, the risk is more negligible. Between a Li-ion and a LiFePO4 battery, the latter is better because of its more stable than Li-ions at higher temps.

The BMW LiFePO4 batteries have a fair bit of protection circuitry to protect the vehicle and the battery itself (eg short circuit, over temp, under and over voltage cut-off switches) which is a good thing considering how expensive they are to replace.

IMHO, I wouldn't be concerned about jump starting my M3 with a battery pack or another vehicle as directed by the Operator's Manual. The overabundance precaution I would take would be to minimize the time the battery pack (in jump-start mode) is connected to the vehicle to minimize the risk of a thermal runaway. So as soon as the car starts up, I would immediately disconnect the battery pack.

Its worthwhile to note (per BMW technical F8x battery bulletin) that our LiFePO4 batteries should NOT be charged with voltages greater than 14.0. Hence why typical (lead-acid) battery chargers either wont work or will cause damage to our batteries (which also precludes any fast-charging). Be sure to use a battery charger that can be set to a LiFePO4 charging mode.

I suspect the battery's over voltage disconnect switch is bypassed during jump-starting because the manual doesn't delineate any special specs of the vehicle being used to jump start. So, if given the option, I would opt to jump start with my LiFePO4 battery back as opposed to my older BMW with a lead acid battery (charging circuit @ 14.8V when engine is running).

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by Zermatt

In a general sense you are correct, it doesn't really matter when it comes to jump starting or for that matter, providing x amount of power.

If you intend to store a jump start battery back in your vehicle in the summer months, definitely go with one that has LiFePO4 because it can be safely stored in a high temp environment whereas Li-ion batteries become a fire hazard in high temps as well as likely subjecting it to a shorter life span.

I speculate that the manufactures of these battery jump-start packs are putting warning labels not to use on vehicles with Lithium batteries because of the risk of a thermal run-away and its associated liability to their company. While lead acid batteries can also theoretically experience a thermal run-away, the risk is more negligible. Between a Li-ion and a LiFePO4 battery, the latter is better because of its more stable than Li-ions at higher temps.

The BMW LiFePO4 batteries have a fair bit of protection circuitry to protect the vehicle and the battery itself (eg short circuit, over temp, under and over voltage cut-off switches) which is a good thing considering how expensive they are to replace.

IMHO, I wouldn't be concerned about jump starting my M3 with a battery pack or another vehicle as directed by the Operator's Manual. The overabundance precaution I would take would be to minimize the time the battery pack (in jump-start mode) is connected to the vehicle to minimize the risk of a thermal runaway. So as soon as the car starts up, I would immediately disconnect the battery pack.

Its worthwhile to note (per BMW technical F8x battery bulletin) that our LiFePO4 batteries should NOT be charged with voltages greater than 14.0. Hence why typical (lead-acid) battery chargers either wont work or will cause damage to our batteries (which also precludes any fast-charging). Be sure to use a battery charger that can be set to a LiFePO4 charging mode.

I suspect the battery's over voltage disconnect switch is bypassed during jump-starting because the manual doesn't delineate any special specs of the vehicle being used to jump start. So, if given the option, I would opt to jump start with my LiFePO4 battery back as opposed to my older BMW with a lead acid battery (charging circuit @ 14.8V when engine is running).

Thank you for the very helpful information. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, I, unfortunately, live in an apartment building and the garage does not have any outlets so leaving the car on any kind of trickle charge is basically out of the question. That is why I wanted a jump starter just in case it died after the winter months

Thank you

[FSociety]

michaelalex17 did u find anything for us that are living in garage with no outlets?

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by FSociety

michaelalex17 did u find anything for us that are living in garage with no outlets?

I got the Noco jump starter I mentioned on the first page in case I ever need it in a pinch, but haven't ever used it.

[FSociety]

Originally Posted by michaelalex17

I got the Noco jump starter I mentioned on the first page in case I ever need it in a pinch, but haven't ever used it.

I've been thinking of getting the same one or just a portable AC outlet since I have their other lithium charger already.