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View Poll Results: S65 option or S55 standart ? | |||
YES ... I would choose the S65 if an option at this price would be availiable |
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93 | 45.81% |
NO ... I would choose the standart S55 engine |
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110 | 54.19% |
Voters: 203. You may not vote on this poll |
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06-16-2014, 10:08 PM | #617 | |
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I'm mad because I loved my Euro Deliveries, love the idea of getting another generation of M car, and loved the amazing, soulful, bespoke engines BMW M was offering. I'm mad all that is gone. I'm not a fan of turbo lag, tuned non-M engines being passed off as "M-Power", pedestrian sounds augmented with the stereo (LOL) or short shifting at 5500 RPM, all of which are realities of the new Ms. Mad it's faster? Heck no. I'm embarrassed and surprised it's not faster than it is. Like I said, the diesel Audi was dominating LeMans. Didn't make me want a diesel "performance" car either. I WANTED to want the new M3/M4.
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... a glorious V8 that screamed and hollered as the revs rose and then howled in an orgy of what sounded like BDSM ecstasy as it neared the red line.
Well, you can forget all that. The new car is fitted with a turbocharged straight six. Turbocharging? In an M car? That’s like putting gravy on an ice cream. - Jeremy Clarkson, discussing the S65 and then S55 M3 engines. |
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06-16-2014, 10:13 PM | #618 | |
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06-16-2014, 10:30 PM | #619 | |
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Besides, when the majority of professional and even amateur reviewers lament the lack of throttle response, lack of decent sound and benefits of short shifting, does that not inform us? Is there anyone who believes that more boost and bigger heads / cam timing will improve the throttle response of the already laggy N55? BMW didn't put the 7 second spool up feature on the new M turbos because it was so responsive without it. I'd guess that I WILL end up driving one before my next purchase; as I said, I REALLY wanted to keep my BMW M thing rolling. I'm simply not impressed, between the undetectable yet trumpeted weight reduction to the N55 with a sticker and a tune.
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... a glorious V8 that screamed and hollered as the revs rose and then howled in an orgy of what sounded like BDSM ecstasy as it neared the red line.
Well, you can forget all that. The new car is fitted with a turbocharged straight six. Turbocharging? In an M car? That’s like putting gravy on an ice cream. - Jeremy Clarkson, discussing the S65 and then S55 M3 engines. |
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06-17-2014, 01:29 AM | #620 | |
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However.... Since the new M3 has 4 doors (great as I have 2 new-ish little boys) and is, at least in a straight line, every bit as fast as a 991 C2S, one too may be in my future. There are just many more options to consider competitively today.
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06-17-2014, 03:49 PM | #621 | ||
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Did you stress out when you lost your keyboard when iPhones took over. I'm guessing you did. Tech evolves and generally found to be better once the fear of change subsides. BMW has made the biggest change in the M3 family ever - it will be looked back upon on the future with great fondness. They new the change to turbos, electric steering, etcetera would be highly scrutinized. As such, they had to make a bigger performance change than with any prior generation. Plus, they had to make room for the M2. From the reviews, which are superb, the consensus is about as high as you could expect. Don't over amplify each little niggle. They all have to say something negative. If amplified all of the positives with the same gain as you apply to the negatives, you might just stroke out with joy. |
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06-17-2014, 10:05 PM | #622 | ||||||||||||
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We agree on this.
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Instant throttle response vs. turbo lag = more exciting = better = E9x. No need for stupid stereo fake engine noise because the ACTUAL mechanical sounds are so magnificent = better = E9x. Bespoke engine = more exclusive = better = E9x. So, we don't even close to agree on that point. Quote:
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... a glorious V8 that screamed and hollered as the revs rose and then howled in an orgy of what sounded like BDSM ecstasy as it neared the red line.
Well, you can forget all that. The new car is fitted with a turbocharged straight six. Turbocharging? In an M car? That’s like putting gravy on an ice cream. - Jeremy Clarkson, discussing the S65 and then S55 M3 engines. |
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06-17-2014, 10:15 PM | #624 |
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Again with the personal. Conversation isn't about ME. It's about THE CAR. Stick to THAT conversation.
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... a glorious V8 that screamed and hollered as the revs rose and then howled in an orgy of what sounded like BDSM ecstasy as it neared the red line.
Well, you can forget all that. The new car is fitted with a turbocharged straight six. Turbocharging? In an M car? That’s like putting gravy on an ice cream. - Jeremy Clarkson, discussing the S65 and then S55 M3 engines. |
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06-17-2014, 10:25 PM | #625 |
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06-18-2014, 06:17 AM | #626 | |
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You are however being at bit harsh on some of the points you bring. Yes, the S55 will need to be short shifted. But at 7000~7300rpm, not at 5500rpm. While it might not be as special as the S65, the S55 is a bespoke engine, not a tuned N55. Almost every component in the engine is unique. Yes, a tuned FBO N55 can make as much power, but for how long? After one lap it either heat soaks or goes in limp mode. That is where the ///M engineering went. I am still a bit wary about throttle response and the overall feel of the engine. As for sound, to be honest, when I first got my E92, I preferred the sound of my old stock S54. I just loved how this engine screamed its lungs out at WOT nearing redline. The S65 sounded monotone almost video gamish in contrast. Three successive things I did drastically improved the sound of the car, MPE, K&N and BPMSport tune. Now the sound is pure bliss. I barely use the stereo anymore. I keep getting compliments for how good the car sounds from neighbors, track buddies or techs at the dealer. I am pretty sure the S55 will never match this. I think the chassis will be fabulous though on this latest gen, and for me, this is very important. I guess I will know for sure in a few weeks when I get mine. If I don't like it, I will just sell it and move on to something else ![]() Last edited by CanAutM3; 06-18-2014 at 08:57 AM.. |
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06-18-2014, 02:28 PM | #627 |
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Kurt I do understand your sentiment and it's true S65 has much better sound (worst of all you can't turn off the fake sound on S55 engine), but S55 has better performance&economy and it's lighter package overall.
If you ask me it's good they are very different so everyone can choose what he likes. |
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06-18-2014, 10:00 PM | #628 | |||||||||
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I'm not at all anti-technology or old school. I just happen to like the sound of high RPMs and the responsiveness of the S65. Quote:
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"Oh yea, well, I have a better RADIATOR!". LOL. Quote:
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... a glorious V8 that screamed and hollered as the revs rose and then howled in an orgy of what sounded like BDSM ecstasy as it neared the red line.
Well, you can forget all that. The new car is fitted with a turbocharged straight six. Turbocharging? In an M car? That’s like putting gravy on an ice cream. - Jeremy Clarkson, discussing the S65 and then S55 M3 engines. |
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06-18-2014, 10:40 PM | #629 | |||||
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I could not care less if an FBO 335 passes me on the highway, that is not where I like to enjoy speed. On the track though, doing 30+ minute sessions, I want an engine that will be able to last the whole session and give me its full power all the way through. Tuned FBO N54/N55s just can't do that. Even my track buddies that run 1Ms complain about loss of power on hot days. I don't think this will be an issue with the S55. Quote:
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06-19-2014, 11:01 AM | #630 |
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Someone hasn't seen the S55 stock and tuned dyno yet...
The only thing that's outrunning a tune S55 is an RB N54... That's before the S55 even touches any other type of fuel... I am stunned by the S55 so far.
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06-19-2014, 04:50 PM | #631 |
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06-19-2014, 06:08 PM | #632 |
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06-19-2014, 06:28 PM | #633 |
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06-19-2014, 07:12 PM | #634 |
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I say these three, 3L, inline six, same bore spacing, turbo Bimmer engines are NOT "incredibly" different. Slightly different turbo configuration, different tune. Otherwise, same basic thing. Same exact displacement, same number of cylinders, about the same redline, all turbos. It's not like I said it was the same as the (magnificent) S65 or S85 engines. This is just another 3L turbo BMW engine. You could put a tune on your X3 engine and it would be about the same thing.
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06-19-2014, 07:46 PM | #635 | |
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06-19-2014, 10:33 PM | #636 | |
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Compare 18+ psi on a 3.0L, the 4.0L displacement of the naturally aspirated V8 is a joke. I mean seriously if you're going to talk about magnificent V8s BMW is not the company you should reference. The S55 is superior to both N54 and N55, closed deck (like the RB26 and 2JZ), has twin-wire arc spayed iron/carbon coating instead of liners, bore and stroke are different as are pistons and more importantly rods and crankshaft. Its hardly just an engine with a different turbo configuration and different tune. |
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06-20-2014, 01:27 AM | #637 | |
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My biggest problem with these new trubo engines is the sound, or lack there off. The screaming sound of the S65 with a aftermarket exhaust is half the reason i wanted one. I put up with the lack of low end power to have a 8400RPM engine that sounds pretty sick. i would say there are more people like you than me. Most just want the power. |
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06-20-2014, 02:50 AM | #638 | |
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From an race engine like characteristic of the S65 they changed to the torque orientated characteristic of an one-for-all-engine - sure an improvement for daily drivers but an great loss of engine spirit, uniqueness and fun. Overall the new M3/M4 is really the "best M3 ever" but despite of its engine an not because of its engine ... the rest of the car is so much better than all precessors, that the engine doesn´t count in terms of car performance. AND only stupid 335i(only)-Fanboys will think, that the engine and powerdelivery characteristic of the S65 was like it is, because BMW M couldn´t produce an NA engine with high low end torque like the C63 AMG or Ford Mustang engine. Its all about the engine philosophy of BMW M -> "Rennsporttechnik (und -Motoren!) in Straßenfahrzeugen" ... and for all who can´t handle such an car properly there was the perfect and diverent characteristic 335i - the S65 has enough low end torque to be an good daily driver, but no single Nm more than needed, because on track only hp, linear power delivery and driveability counts and not high low end torque. |
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