02-25-2021, 10:18 PM | #1 |
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What should my next track car be?
The M3 CS lease will be up at the end of the year, and it's time to get a new track car to replace it. As much as the F80 checks so many boxes, I'm on my second one, so I'd like to try something new. I'm not too worried about lap times since I'm not that fast in the M3 CS anyway, so if a less powerful car is easier to drive and I can learn more, I'm all for it. A GT4 is really what I want, but I think the price is going to get in the way of me really getting to explore my limits on the track. Also, I don't like the G80, so that's out. So far the options in ranked from most to least considered are as follows:
E46 M3 981 CS/GTS GR Supra S2000 Toyota 86 ND Miata E46 M3: Right now the E46 M3 is the top contender for smiles per mile. The relatively low cost won't make me feel as bad if I get it into the gravel or nudge a tire wall etc. Anyone track with them previously? I've never actually even driven an E46 M3 so any info appreciated. My biggest concern is the handling. Pros: Less expensive More money for mods Less worried about biffing it into a tire wall Cheaper to insure I've always wanted an E46 M3 (but I've never driven one) Lighter than the M3 CS(~3200 lbs, is this accurate?) Plenty of cargo room for track gear and wheels Cons: Only 0.89 G on the skid pad, needs some work for handling Heaviest on the list Possible high upfront cost for repairs Reliability issues Not as powerful I've never driven one 981 CS/GTS I love the look, I love the mid-engine layout, and I love the fact that it's a sports car from the ground up. I've always wanted a Porsche I also love the GT4 and this is as close I can get on this list. Pros: Great handling Great engine Great sound Light (~3100lbs) Cons: Not as powerful Expensive for a used car ($50-70k used) Expensive to repair GR Supra My biggest complaint about this car is the lack of a manual. I really want a manual this time since they will likely be extinct. It's just a tad heavy for what I want. My ideal track car is <3300lbs, >300hp, but with a manual this would be at the top of my list. Pros: Most powerful on this list Very low CG High I6T tuning potential Cheaper and faster than the 981 (not counting depreciation) Cons: Automatic A tad heavy Toyota 86 Overall I think just the lack of power is preventing me from getting this. I'm a bit spoiled by the F80, but maybe I'm wrong? I also see a lot of these on the track, and a part of me wants a car that's a bit unique and not as common as the 86. Pros: Proven chassis Handling Cons: Not as powerful Common S2000 Pros: Cheap Slightly faster than the 86 and Miata Cons: Not as sharp handling as the Miata or 86? Not as powerful as the E46 M3 nor the GR Supra ND Miata Pros: Love the looks Handling Proven track toy Lightest car on the list Cons: Least powerful Miata stigma outside of the track Other possible considerations: M2 Competition 997 C2 981 stripper E36 M3 CTR NA1 NSX 944 Turbo Thoughts? Please feel free to make new suggestions!
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02-25-2021, 11:11 PM | #4 |
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02-26-2021, 06:51 AM | #7 |
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Depends what you are looking to prioritise, a lot of your listed cars are great for cheap track miles. Coming from a CS I expect you may be frustrated by the lack of power particularly for overtaking. CS is also nice newer car, doesn't break etc. If you can trailer something there are more options.
Assuming you are driving to/from the track I'd look at - C7 Grandsport Shelby GT350 SS 1LE E92 M3 Lotus Evora I'm biased but if you really want a GT4, get a GT4 😉 |
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02-26-2021, 10:13 AM | #8 |
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Do you need to be able to drive the car on the street? Do you have interest in class-based racing, or just HPDE?
I assume based on your choices that you just want an HPDE car/street car. In that case, if a 981 GT4 is too expensive then maybe grab a 981 S or GTS? I imagine they've suffered some massive depreciation at this point, looks like $40k gets you a 981 Cayman S. Another consideration if you want to stick with BMW is the E92 M3, think you can get a sorted one for $30k-$35k? Drops the cost of a track incident a bit vs the CS or GT4, not a huge degradation in performance potential. Or just go full racecar, Spec Miata, GTS2/GTS3, or whatever class is popular in your region, and get the joy of wheel to wheel racing |
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02-26-2021, 01:46 PM | #10 |
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981 GTS but not gonna lie, been looking at them recently in 6 spd, and they are still pretty pricey (surprisingly so). Maybe it's just COVID pricing in combination with the current Porsche hype.
https://www.sanfranciscosportscars.c...ts-gts-c-1014/ Low miles, stripper like option list but geez 71k??
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02-26-2021, 02:12 PM | #11 | |
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02-26-2021, 02:27 PM | #12 |
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02-26-2021, 02:41 PM | #13 |
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Seriously. Even then, I've seen 981 GT4s still priced at $90-100k... there's a brand new 718 GT4 @ McKenna listed for $106k
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02-26-2021, 04:28 PM | #14 | |
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What is surprising is how close the GR Supra is in numbers to the GT4. It's right between the M3 CS and GT4 in weight. Has the same HP but more torque than the GT4 and they have similar 0-60 and 0-100, skid pad etc. At $20k cheaper the Supra seems like a good alternative with a weight and no manual trade-off. It's such a shame they don't just have it come in a manual.
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02-27-2021, 10:52 PM | #16 |
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Had an E46 M3 that I tracked for about 2 years or so. You really can't beat the feel of the car and it makes the perfect amount of power in such a linear fashion which ups the send factor on track for sure. If you want to get better at racetrack things it's such a good platform. I wouldn't worry about the handling haha that G number probably comes from some magazine review prior to the tire compound revolution. I assure you that you can easily get the car up over 1.00g on street tires haha. Unfortunately the downside of the car is you really have to wring it out to get it moving so around town you will miss that instant hit of boost from the F8X that makes you grin.
I've been following the GR Supra pretty closely and the 2021 is just an absolute animal, it has a faster time than the M2C (on the same tires mind you) at Lightning Lap and you get all the feel of the BMW in what I think is a better all around package with more curb appeal. Not sure if you know of Jackie Ding but he has turned one into probably one of the 3 fastest "Street" Time Attack cars in the Nation in only like 2 years of development. Also, they look soooo good with aero... |
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02-28-2021, 04:00 AM | #17 | ||
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02-28-2021, 06:10 AM | #18 | |
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You've been driving automatic FR cars for the past few years. - Are you getting bored of front-engined, rear-drive cars or do you still want to keep mastering your skills with this layout? Do you want to use your left leg? - It seems to me you do. A car without auto rev-match and with great pedal placement would be ideal for perfecting your heel-toe downshifts. What's the purpose of the tracktool? - Most of the cars on your list are modern street cars. Want a race car you drive to the circuit? A capable DD (again)? What are the tracks you go to? - Slow, fast, long sweepers, tight bends? You've been leasing your cars. - Do you want a brand new car with warranty that you won't be able to modify extensively or an older car you can (i.e. will have to) wrench on? The third point is crucial because some of the suggested cars are old and will require lots of attention. Maintenance and mods. 1. Base 981 and 997 didn't have LSD as standard and vast majority were not optioned with them. Mod$ needed, then. 2. 944 is an old dog that I would not touch even with a 6ft pole. 3. Old NSX is a garage queen that shall not be abused. 4. CTR - specify which gen? And it's a FWD hatch. All your other cars are RWD. 5. E36 M3 - would look for an already track-prepped specimen to abuse 6. M2C - not very dissimilar to your F80, is it? Stock E46 is not 3,200 lbs, it's more like 3,500 lbs... So you'd probably feel the need to get it on a diet. Stock suspension components will be tired if you don't find a clean track-prepped car. That brings us to my third point - do you wanna wrench and/or pay a shop to work on your 20-year old cars? Supra and 981 CS/GTS are to me very nice dual-duty cars that I'd take to the track a couple times a year whilst keeping mostly stock. Something you've been doing with your F80. Not something I'd call a track car, really. Miata and S2000 are rag tops. All your other choices are coupes. if I were you, I'd look for a lighter, cheaper vehicle you can modify to suit your needs. S2000 is an amazing raw car that can bite you hard on the limit. From the cars listed, though, a used BRZ/86 would be the choice. It's pretty new yet simple. More of a momentum car as opposed to your current torque monster. Then supercharge it once you feel like you've outgrown the car. Or an already-modified E36 if you wanna go old school.
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02-28-2021, 03:38 PM | #19 | |||||||||
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Not daily driven Two or three high performance driving events a month (one track day, 1 or 2 autocrosses) It will be my 4th car in my garage Driven to and from the track, not trailered Some curb appeal for Cars and Coffee and canyon runs with friends Quote:
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The M3 CS was initially going to be driven to work a few times a week and perhaps fit my family for some weekend getaways, but I no longer commute, and after modding, my wife says it's too loud and too rough (lol) so the 4 door is no longer a requirement. I no longer need a capable DD, a coupe is fine, and now I am open to racing seats and even more aggressive suspension etc. Quote:
Big Willow & Fontana are fast tracks with a big sweepers Buttonwillow is a good all around track with fast corners, one medium sweeper and some tight bends Streets of Willow is a bit more technical than Big Willow Adams Motorsports Park is slow with tight narrow bends, similar to an autocross I also do autocrosses Quote:
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I've always wanted a convertible, which is why those are in there. I might be open to a Boxster, but honestly I like the 981 couple look much much more. Quote:
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02-28-2021, 06:10 PM | #20 |
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All understandable.
If it's a fourth car and there's no commute, I'd go all in then. Half cage (wouldn't do full cage as you'll be street driving), proper seats, etc. Since you're open to a lot of options, maybe you could have a look on Turo and see if there any of the cars available for rent for, like, a day? Will definitely get a feel for the car on your local roads. And at a track day, ask someone to get a ride. At my last event, people were hopping from one car to another! I'm an awful passenger and I don't trust strangers so I definitely missed out on some cool cars... Belive the schtick with the BRZ at launch was that it fits four tires. E36/E46 would fit a set too, I believe. Those cars would also be ideal for your canyon runs with mates. Look up "garagewelt" on IG, the two dudes running this small apparel biz drive S54 E36s and one of them owns an F80 alongside an E46 M3 in a Clubsport spec. I'm sure they'd be happy to give you a ride or some info straight from the hourse's mouf regarding those chassis. 🤙🏻
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03-01-2021, 03:01 PM | #21 | |
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Also Hoosiers are overrated just run A052 or RT660. |
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