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12-10-2019, 07:55 PM | #45 | |
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12-10-2019, 08:11 PM | #46 | |
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I was talking cars with my colleagues, some of whom own BMWs at this point in time. They were all raving about how great the M5 is and how I'm stupid for desiring the M2 over it. Needless to say, they are not traditional car enthusiasts. More just professionals with a high income potential who want the sweetest looking car possible. They had no idea what an E, F, or G-chassis was; what steering feedback is, what "tail happy" means, etc." It really hit me that I truly am in a minuscule minority of BMW clients.
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12-10-2019, 08:16 PM | #47 |
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With my student loans I'm going to defer on the M2/Boxster plans and strongly consider the Giulia for my next DD. The Giulia 4-cylinder looks sweet with the right color/wheels, it has more than adequate power, leases are strong, and the refreshed model's interior is good enough. Ultimately the driving experience comes first for me. I just can't connect with any of the German "sport" sedans. It's sad because I strongly prefer the German interiors, build quality, and overall ownership experience. Then you have Lexus who won't for the life of them redesign the IS/RC.
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12-10-2019, 08:23 PM | #48 |
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I still wonder if all the complaints about the rear end are just due to the DCT. Having a manual transmission forces you to modulate yourself after every shift. You shift, THEN feed in the throttle as power builds. You get instant feedback of how power and grip are building in relation to your throttle and clutch work. Whereas in a DCT, you feed in throttle, THEN the car does . . . something? On gear change and throttle uptake, there's a disconnection between your foot and the power to the rear wheels as the car is making decisions and engaging clutches for you. Even if you are pulling the paddles, you aren't forced to modulate the throttle with every shift as you are in a 6MT.
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12-10-2019, 08:45 PM | #49 |
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Not impressed, the reviewers keep contradicting themselves.
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12-10-2019, 08:52 PM | #50 | |
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If you haven't driven one, the test drive will spoil you and make you feel worse about any other compact sports sedan you drive. It really is a good car, good luck if you go for one!
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12-10-2019, 09:24 PM | #51 |
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I wonder if it'll be harder to become part of the m club in the future. I feel most here have driven or owned an m car in the past and can really point out the improvements or driven many other sport cars.
I'm currently trying to sell my m3 since it's difficult to take it to an island. But as I get offers for it and drive it everyday, I can't stop doubting my decision to sell it. I keep fantasizing about keeping and making it work on the island. My point is...I saw this review within the hour of it being posted on YouTube. I too felt let down since I love the channel and I thought he was gonna finish with how amazing the f8x generation is. In the end I felt the conclusion was the F8x generation is for newbie m posers. People that can afford a luxury sports car but aren't hardcore enthusiasts that can "feel" the soul of a car. Maybe I haven't driven enough older generations or sports cars in general....but damn! My m3 makes me climax every time I get on a highway merge. Rippin through the gears with my DCT makes me feel like a frickin F1 driver. On paper it's the most refined and powerful m3 to date. I'm sure it'll change, but what's the grading rubric these days for an m3? Seems to be getting tougher every generation... |
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12-10-2019, 09:58 PM | #53 |
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the car market being flooded with everything fast now due to the reliability of forced induction versus sports cars being distant from other vehicles has caused reviews like this. I liked the review but he was kind of all over the place. Like he contraindicates himself a lot, like make a decision. the tone of the video was as if he was driving a fucking hearse. Lastly he's so apathetic; like suffering from some serious first world problems LOL.
The M car driven without traction control is sure to cause some drama. With it on sure its a neutered product no doubt. IDK why the hellcat was brought up; the M roasts the tires just as well. The e90 has way better steering feel; and honestly I don't feel that fast in the f8x; yet my passengers do. The f80 steering has always never been right for me but I'm used to it now. But this is how cars are now. A 4 door sedan with a stick is the reason I didnt look twice at anything else. Kill the manual and I likely would be in an older car. Idk why people are holding onto the past. I wish they still made v10 sticks; I dont care if teslas dust me off the line. BMW just doesn't make distant cars anymore they are all the same x1,2,3,4,5,6,7 with their m40i variants and M variants m850i, m8 the fuck m340, m3 the day of the actual M car is dead I believe. Nonetheless the f8x is one the the most best styled vehicles that still allows you to row gears. all the new BMWs and new sports cars are way too over styled and busy. But whatever people expect too much its just a car lol |
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12-10-2019, 10:41 PM | #55 | |
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Although I'll say I didn't like the stock ZCP engine tune that much, and feel the CS tune is absolutely perfect for this car, should have been in the car from day 1. It adds the necessary zing/drama/frenetic character that the ZCP is possibly missing. I simply don't see what else has 4 doors, can be driven daily year long from work to Home Depot, to sport practice etc and enjoyed absolutely brutally on the racetrack, without the slightest hiccup or mechanical drama. It is at its best when driven aggressively over 7/10ths so if you don't do that, perhaps you find it a bit sterile? I don't know, I simply love it...
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12-10-2019, 10:45 PM | #56 | |
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Every is entitled to there opinion, but if you look on YouTube it is a never ending line of non-professional journalists who like to say word for word what every other YouTube’er is saying (not connected, no soul, sterile). In a few years that opinion will flip to how much better it is than the newer version. |
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12-11-2019, 12:41 AM | #58 | |
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Everything is either not driver focused, or it's too much power period, too much power for the street, too expensive to buy, or too expensive to maintain out of warranty. He's got too much experience at the track, so everything is boring or stupid on the street, and why would you pay for something stupid on the street? And why would you pay a premium at the track when you could have built a race car that's even better? I'm glad I don't have enough track/race experience to find driving on the street boring. |
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12-11-2019, 12:56 AM | #59 | |
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+1. I had two E9X M3s and they felt like GTs compared to the F80 (although I miss the induction wail under WOT). |
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12-11-2019, 02:21 AM | #60 | |
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12-11-2019, 03:01 AM | #61 | ||
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Many of us aren't new to M3's, so I often wonder who the posers and neophytes are that some reviewers (...and certain members of this forum) refer to. With reference to life, you can't really resonate with an era in which you weren't alive or were too young to appreciate. Somebody who is in their early twenties can't really shoot the shit with me about the days before cell phones. You can't fault a newer owner because he/she wasn't alive when the E30 M3 was homologated, thus, negating a value attachment. For me personally it was the E36 M3 that sparked my interest in BMW's (...the way it drove sold me!!), but being a teenager when that car was available made it unattainable. Enter stage left the 2001 E46 M3. I was making enough money to finally move into an ///M. That car was more or less my starting point in terms of ///M reference. Eight ///M cars and a bunch of BMW's later, the F82 is my favorite of them all. I wouldn't take any of the older M3's over it. Does that make me part of the fringe rather than the core?!? I don't know that I can be considered fringe when I've been driving M cars for about two decades; about as long as it was realistically and financially feasible to do so, and what amounts to half of my life. |
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12-11-2019, 03:44 AM | #62 |
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Minn19 and any other CS owners lurking here who might have owned the E9X and a "normal" F8X does anyone else feel a lot more steering feel with the CS super thick steering wheel?
I wouldn't call it amazingly engaging where I feel every single bump and little rock in the road but I have noticed a lot more feedback. I am not sure if this is purely down to the steering wheel itself or the fact the M4CS is particular is a lot more stripped down anyway and coupled with the noise etc your mind just gets the placebo effect of better steering feel? If it is simply due to the numbness of the standard leather steering wheel then there's hope yet for all the F8X owners who want to "feel the road" as you can just change out the wheel itself. Also saying the above with my E92s my first car was a 2008 manual and I am 100% certain that car had a MUCH thicker steering wheel than my 2013 DCT. But I have never been able to find any solid data on there being 2 types of stock steering wheels offered for the E92. |
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12-11-2019, 04:20 AM | #63 | |
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I feel that most that complain about the F8X are the ones who have not taken the time to learn how to drive it properly. Hence the dichotomy in this review: they complain about too much drama in the same sentence they complain about lack of drama ; saying it does everything too easily to be exiting while complaining that the rear steps out if you don't manage the throttle (with skinny winter tires on ). I've done well over 100 track days with the F8X and I certainly don't feel it is a handful on track. The chassis is super responsive and predictable and the S55's pull is very strong while being easy to modulate, which makes it a real joy to drive on track. But you do need to DRIVE it.
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12-11-2019, 04:25 AM | #64 | |
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I did not find the steering feel of my previous E92 M3 to be that great in stock form either. It improved when I installed GC plates and dialed in more camber and caster, but it still was not stellar.
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12-11-2019, 07:13 AM | #65 | |
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Last edited by minn19; 12-11-2019 at 09:03 AM.. |
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12-11-2019, 07:45 AM | #66 | |
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If all these things are balanced, the car does exactly what your brain expects and you get the sense that you can "feel" the steering. If one of those behaviors is not balanced with the others, your brain gets conflicting signals and it's not as easy to tell what the car is doing or going to do. The challenge for engineers is that humans are inherently but subconsiously very sensitive to small changes in these behaviors and don't even realize it . . . just like you don't realize all the brain and muscle coordination it takes just for you to walk down the street. Getting one thing just a little bit "off," or having the production parts (tires, shocks, bushings, etc.) vary a bit from the ones you used to calibrate the car can result in the steering feel being significantly worse than intended. During development, EVERY part on the car is a prototype and hasn't stabilized into it's production-level performance (tire compound, bushing stiffness, damper behavior, etc.) so it's very difficult, and even impossible in some cases to get the nuance of ride and steering feel right for the initial launch of a car. Even if it's perfect when the engineers are finished tuning, The production car will likely be different in some way when they start rolling off the line. It's VERY common for cars to be recalibrated for ride and steering (and other things) 3, 6, 12 months after launch, and that's why something like a CS can be significantly better than the base car with seemingly "the same" parts. Changing the steering wheel will not improve the issue, but swapping the full CS suspension made a significant improvement in my car.
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