10-20-2020, 06:25 PM | #68 |
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I think you are right. Wish I knew this prior to buying it. Terrible to own a high powered sporty car and be scared to mash the throttle to redline a couple gears. I am hardily even putting the pedal down 3/4 of the way. What a disaster. No idea what I’d replace it with. It’s a shame bc it’s a great middle of the road car. Maybe a G
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10-20-2020, 06:38 PM | #69 |
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@matty088 All people need is warranty and not tune up to 50K miles, then get the hub fix and go nuts. In both cases you can drive your car 100%.
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10-20-2020, 06:39 PM | #70 | |
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10-20-2020, 07:04 PM | #71 | |
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I think these cars need a tune badly. In stock form I think the car isn’t that fast and is rather numb. I think a tune wakes the car up enough to make it exhilarating despite all the nannies and computer assisted stuff. It’s almost mandatory to have stage 1 tune in my view. Then once u do that you are playing with fire and you can’t go back. Once you do it. You over stepped the warranty and flashing back won’t matter. I am complaining a bit too much about it tonight. But I think it’s warranted. I am going to do a CBC and try to enjoy the car. But even that is annoying. 1) most shops won’t do them and 2) no one even knows if it helps. The lack of clarity around this issue, the cost of a preventive mod, and the cost of a total failure ruined this platform for a moderate enthustis like me who enjoy tinkering with their cars but don’t want to make them a full blown race car. So I think in time these cars are going to get hurt in the resale market. Most disagree and point to issues with other generations but this by far the biggest issue for any gen and is a really a plague for them. I know you guys don’t like hearing it. But search your feelings.... you know it’s true |
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10-20-2020, 07:36 PM | #72 | |
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Modding any performance car beyond stock performance and expecting warranty to cover it is not realistic. Modding the car with a tune leads to shortened life spans if the car is driven hard. My other performance cars in my past, when you tuned them, you are rolling the dice on turbo failures etc. Look at the E92M3, it was rod bearings and you weren't able to tune for more power after that. For other turbo cars, it was the transmission, turbos etc that would fail. What I'm saying is that once you deviate from stock, something will rear its ugly head in terms of failure. It's just not reasonable to expect to mod and be bullet proof. Even in stock form, I don't quite agree with what you're saying. The car is already fast in stock form, in most cases, putting power greater than what it specced for. So when is enough? Never it seems. So if I have a stock 500+ hp M5, I need to mod it to 'wake it up'? And if I get x car, I should/must mod as if there is headroom? My point is that at a certain juncture, you have to decide what is enough. If you decide to push the limit and then build in the budget to strengthen the car. I think that all of us have to just accept the fact that the crank hub is a weak point that BMW should address. My real issue is that they should provide a fix for owners who want to pursue it at a discounted cost. |
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10-20-2020, 07:46 PM | #73 | |
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10-20-2020, 08:17 PM | #74 | |
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So I think all of what you are saying is accurate but it’s not really relevant or applicable to the real world. Losing an engine due to stage1 software modifications is total bullshit. And it CAN NOT be justified. Spending 4000 as a preventive mod on a very mild street car is also bullshit. let’s call it what it is. If you want to make 700 hop and need to bullet proof the engine and that costs bog bucks. . Fine. Makes sense. But this is not what CH is about. There is a design flaw and if you touch the car with performance enhancing modifications you are exacerbating an already bad situation. And I for one think history will not be kind to these cars. My opinion. Regarding “wake up” the statement. These cars are known to be sleepy fast. Meaning they are very refined and have lots of tech assistance. It’s not a raped ape. Given that I think it’s alittle boring in stock form. The stage 1 tune totally made the car fun. It’s still not a beastly feel but it puts u back jn the seat enough to be exhilarating. Last edited by matty088; 10-20-2020 at 08:23 PM.. |
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10-20-2020, 08:19 PM | #75 |
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10-20-2020, 08:44 PM | #76 | |
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Note that some of the failures are just timing fixes, not complete engine meltdowns. From what I've read, the meltdowns tend to be highly tuned cars. I took the poll that was done a while back and just did simple statistics to see what the fail rate was: I was going to play with the numbers a little more but that's ok, I'm open to sharing this with anyone who reads it. Because of the smaller sample size of tuned cars, I didn't split between DCT/Manual or year. Stock: 3% failure rate (out of 555 cars) 450-500whp tune: 11% (out of 227 cars) 500-550whp tunes: 19% (out of 149 cars) 550+ whp tunes: 33% (out of 90 cars) If you focus on just manual vs. dct (tuned cars only), Manual: 22% fail rate (out of 146 cars) DCT: 18% fail rate (out of 320 cars) Takeaway: if you do a light tune, you'd be silly not put on a CBC, or as Clint would say "You feeling lucky today?" Assuming the cost of a motor is 15-20K, if you're going to light tune, you need at the minimum, a budget of $1- 1.5k (based on the general probability of failure, so a CBC is probably a good way to go about it. If you do the VTT complete solution, and I've checked, you can get it done for about 3K. The pinned solution is slightly more ~3-3.5K. Remember the IMS bearing on the early 997s? That was an 8% fail rate and there was class action on that. This is 3% on stock cars. Last edited by CT_M3; 10-21-2020 at 07:33 PM.. |
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10-20-2020, 09:07 PM | #77 |
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I saw someone on a kies video with a M4 GTS that bought a brand new DME.. assuming to flash that one, so I imagine if you flashed a brand new DME.. your car broke down, you swapped back to the original DME.. would that be undetectable? helluva an effort to go through but worth it.
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10-20-2020, 09:14 PM | #78 | |
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A floored M DCT shifting is one of the most Beautiful sounds I have ever heard.... Previous: 1999 Prelude SH, 2002 C5 Corvette, 2017 Civic Si, 2010 Tundra, too many motorcycles to list and too dangerous, The M4 is my bike riding on fours |
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10-20-2020, 09:35 PM | #79 | |
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CS is almost like stock, almost a stage 0.5, so I'd expect around 3% |
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10-20-2020, 10:15 PM | #80 | |
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10-20-2020, 10:40 PM | #81 |
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was trying to isolate installation error, figured they would take extra care installing those crank hubs
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A floored M DCT shifting is one of the most Beautiful sounds I have ever heard.... Previous: 1999 Prelude SH, 2002 C5 Corvette, 2017 Civic Si, 2010 Tundra, too many motorcycles to list and too dangerous, The M4 is my bike riding on fours |
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10-20-2020, 10:54 PM | #82 |
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think Gintani explained it well, the 2 piece crank hub served bmw well in the past tried and true, though with modern engines the hub has hit its max.
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A floored M DCT shifting is one of the most Beautiful sounds I have ever heard.... Previous: 1999 Prelude SH, 2002 C5 Corvette, 2017 Civic Si, 2010 Tundra, too many motorcycles to list and too dangerous, The M4 is my bike riding on fours |
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10-21-2020, 08:30 AM | #83 |
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Didn't take it to dealer, my friend is a tech at bmw however and told me he warrantied an m4 with the same problem, I just decided to not go to dealer
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10-21-2020, 08:50 AM | #84 | |
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I kind of wonder how much you actually know about older M's because you say you're not willing to fork $4k to bulletproof the S55, but the cost to bulletproof an E46 M3 is as much as that for stock power levels at this age and mileage. It's not if, but when, and then you are playing with fire on the E46 M3 as well. VANOS and rod bearings are time bombs if you don't deal with them (I own a Z4M, so this is on my to do list). Not sure I'd say it costs "nothing" to deal with just the engine. And dealing with the subframe, while it's a pretty common process now, is not something I'd be able to do in my garage by myself. So I don't see how E46 M3 repairs are palatable for you, but not the $4k for the S55. I think this might be more of the case that this isn't the right car for you and your goals, rather than this car being the "worse M car to date" and having a horrible resale. If anything, this car seems very stout for an M if you just leave everything alone.
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10-21-2020, 09:45 AM | #85 | |
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You are comparing a car thats been driven and maybe driven hard for 100k miles versus one that has 10k miles and is brand new. What is the basis for disagreement. The CH issue is a straight disaster for the this platform. In my opinion it literally ruins the car and i bet once they pop up more commonly on BAT youll see lots of people staying away and the market price will be pretty bad. Vanos going at 100k is a giant nothing. are you arguing that CH is no biggie compared to the e46 inherit problems that show up after 15-20 years? That is crazy. Are you arguing the cost to bulletproof a car that is brand new with very mild upgrades is comparable to the cost to bring an OLD car back to new? Neither make any sense. Last edited by matty088; 10-21-2020 at 09:53 AM.. |
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10-21-2020, 10:10 AM | #86 | |
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So essentially, you're saying the difference between the 2 is that one is used and you can get a used S54 for less than the price of a new S55 from the dealership. 1) If you are willing to play Russian roulette with your warranty and your S55, that's on YOU 2) If you're willing to play Russian roulette with an F8x out of warranty, but not willing to spend an extra $4k? That's also on you. No different than if you want to gamble and take an S54 to 100k miles and not drop a dime on preventatively changing out parts. As an owner of multiple M's, S52 + S54 + S65, I'm all to well aware of what it costs to keep these engines running, yet alone modding them. Hell, you do know this is also from the same guys that made the S85 right? My point of contention is the part I highlighted in your post in bold. You think that people that can afford to buy cars on BaT will all run away because of the CH issues on modded cars? Doubtful. Like I said, so far, I've only seen the CH issue (once again, I wouldn't be concerned if stock) and leaking intercooler issue as the 2 biggies on this platform. That hardly makes it the worst M car to date as you say, considering there are FAR more maintenance heavy S engines out there. I can name you many engines that scare me more than the S55.
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10-21-2020, 10:11 AM | #87 | ||
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Clearly you don't know what you are talking about. Plus, very few SCH lead to full engine replacement and most just need a timing repair which is MUCH cheaper. Also, I had 2 e46s and both had failed VANOS early in life. One at 15k miles and the other at 26k miles. Thank god I was stock so warranty covered it because that repair is not cheap. I think you are looking at the past with rose colored glasses. I guess people just don't realize that manufacturers are not in the business of building cars you can mod to all hell and then pay for your failed engine because of such mods. In fact, I don't know of any business that does that. Crazy how business works. For the stock failures, that sucks, but the error rate is likely no higher than any past M car.
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10-21-2020, 10:26 AM | #88 | |
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People are getting 30k bills for anew engine installed. Last edited by matty088; 10-21-2020 at 10:39 AM.. |
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