M4 vs. Cayman GTS

[pkimM3r]

Originally Posted by 48Laws

I can smell the clutch through my screen wth is driving??

why would you say that?

heel toe downshifts sounds better in manual!!

[half man half amazin]

Originally Posted by M4 BAT

I don't need 4 seats and still pick an M4 over a Cayman GTS as my daily driver!
The Cayman GTS is a superb handling car, but will leave you hungry for more power & torque...

Exactly! I drove the Cayman S last week and it reminded me of the e92 with the lack of torque. Great car, but not a lot of creature comforts, and torque definitely makes me smile 😊

[pkimM3r]

a Cayman, e9x M3, s2k, (ferrari), gt3....none of these cars are used properly at the low end and putt putting around. I bet my e90m is just as fast off the line as the n55 and other turbo bmw engines. I still don't understand these lack of torque comments. Are you guys driving in 4th gear at 2k rpms going 35mph???

[Rambler]

Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3

a Cayman, e9x M3, s2k, (ferrari), gt3....none of these cars are used properly at the low end and putt putting around. I bet my e90m is just as fast off the line as the n55 and other turbo bmw engines. I still don't understand these lack of torque comments. Are you guys driving in 4th gear at 2k rpms going 35mph???

+1 - My question to all the torque whiners is on what occasion in daily driving is 295 lb ft not enough or lacking, especially with the gearing in dct? Let me answer for you, there isn't one.

[RMB]

The Cayman GTS sounds and looks great. I can't wait to see what they come up with for the supposed Cayman GT4 (or whatever they will call it) that has recently been seen testing.

[SupremePower3335]

I am having a similar conflict about the Cayman VS the ///M4.

I admit that I am a BMW fanboy

However, I drive a E90 ///M Sport and for now we are keeping that..my wife drives it..I was really looking at the Cayman S ( I cannot afford or justify a 911 S). I even attended the PCar track event when they introduced the Cayman..HOWEVER when I saw the new ///M4 I was completely taken with it..other than the IPAD type screen and the lack of colours offered in it I like everything..

PROS for the Cayman

• I don't have kids and wont have any so I don't need a backseat
• It's a PORSCHE!!
• Awesome handling
• Really nice interior
• Many colours offered
• Screen is in the right place
• Unique vehicle many people do not have Cayman

CONS for the Cayman

• Higher finance rate
• HP is limited to 310bhp
• add a number of options in you are in 911 territory so it can get pricey quick
• no CF roof
• Maint could be very expensive
• Its a TRUE sports car not DD that you can also use like a sports car

PROS for the ///M4

• Styling is very aggressive
• Improved Interior - especially the new seats
• Gobs of BHP and low end torque
• BMW offers good rates or at least better than PORSCHE
• Its a ///M - unique vehicle
• Its a DD that doubles as sports car

CONS for the ///M4

• Completely new car and engine - issues with new MY
• It's a large coupe..
• Lack of colour choices
• Too much BHP meaning cannot use in the street - have the same issue with E90
• Many more options are included

So there you have it and why I am confused...When I price them out in Cdn $$$ they are pretty close..on the Cayman though I am not looking at many features because as I mentioned the Cayman can get up there in $$$ real quick..

I am interested in your comments and viewpoints..

PS When I do give up the E90 I will be looking at the F30 Sedan..

PPS I could wait for the ///M2

[pkimM3r]

Originally Posted by Rambler

+1 - My question to all the torque whiners is on what occasion in daily driving is 295 lb ft not enough or lacking, especially with the gearing in dct? Let me answer for you, there isn't one.

dude, the last +5lbft make it or BREAK IT.

[pkimM3r]

Originally Posted by SupremePower3335

I am having a similar conflict about the Cayman VS the ///M4.

I admit that I am a BMW fanboy

However, I drive a E90 ///M Sport and for now we are keeping that..my wife drives it..I was really looking at the Cayman S ( I cannot afford or justify a 911 S). I even attended the PCar track event when they introduced the Cayman..HOWEVER when I saw the new ///M4 I was completely taken with it..other than the IPAD type screen and the lack of colours offered in it I like everything..

PROS for the Cayman

• I don't have kids and wont have any so I don't need a backseat
• It's a PORSCHE!!
• Awesome handling
• Really nice interior
• Many colours offered
• Screen is in the right place
• Unique vehicle many people do not have Cayman

CONS for the Cayman

• Higher finance rate
• HP is limited to 310bhp
• add a number of options in you are in 911 territory so it can get pricey quick
• no CF roof
• Maint could be very expensive
• Its a TRUE sports car not DD that you can also use like a sports car

PROS for the ///M4

• Styling is very aggressive
• Improved Interior - especially the new seats
• Gobs of BHP and low end torque
• BMW offers good rates or at least better than PORSCHE
• Its a ///M - unique vehicle
• Its a DD that doubles as sports car

CONS for the ///M4

• Completely new car and engine - issues with new MY
• It's a large coupe..
• Lack of colour choices
• Too much BHP meaning cannot use in the street - have the same issue with E90
• Many more options are included

So there you have it and why I am confused...When I price them out in Cdn $$$ they are pretty close..on the Cayman though I am not looking at many features because as I mentioned the Cayman can get up there in $$$ real quick..

I am interested in your comments and viewpoints..

PS When I do give up the E90 I will be looking at the F30 Sedan..

PPS I could wait for the ///M2

///M2 should be a fun car!

[FTS]

Originally Posted by SupremePower3335

I am interested in your comments and viewpoints..

Let me chime in with few minor items that may not be worth much:

• I personally prefer the Cayman's exterior design, I think, but the M3/4 is growing on me.
• Maintenance costs are not very high at all, they are in the 'normal' range and comparable to any car, but not free.
• I am not sure why a CF roof may be important, but it does not need it as it is comparably quite light in weight overall.
• I would not classify Cayman as a sports car first, it really is a DD with strong sporty characteristics.
• Porsche brakes are better than BMW brakes, steel-to-steel and CCB-to-CCB.
• A Cayman will cost about $10K more comparably optioned than an M3/4; however, getting $6 to 9K discounts on a Cayman S (not the GTS) is quite reasonable and if you go for one on the lot you can probably get close to $11K.
• The interior... it is a matter of personal taste of course, but the BMW interior is looking better to me, particularly in full leather, but may be I have been driving Porsches for a little too long of time.
• BMW ED is a better program than than Porsche's.
• Cayman's sport exhaust sound is just superb, but beware of the interior engine sound, which is dreadful as RPMs increase (this is strictly a personal note, many disagree with me)
• Avoid as many electronic supplements as you can with a Porsche.
• Windscreen on Porsches are very thin (save weight and cost), plan on replacing them every other year or 18 months, or protect it with 3M cover
• I have not actually checked for the 981, but I don't think they moved to multi-link rear suspension yet, partly to keep the handling separation from the 911. For DD and street driving, it does not matter of course.
• Cayman interior is very usable from a storage perspective.
  Porsche's use primarily aluminum, hence repair costs for accidents are probably higher than BMW, but do not know this for a fact. I was astonished to find out that replacing my GT3's front bumper with OEM would cost me $6500 (it is because it says GT3 on it, not because it is made of aluminum )
• At the same time, the chassis construction is quite modular, changing/replacing fenders, chassis braces, etc. are less labor intensive
• Porsche parts across models are easily interchangeable from transmission, engine, suspension, body panels, etc. This creates interesting possibilities

I hope this helps in some ways.

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by SupremePower3335

I am having a similar conflict about the Cayman VS the ///M4.

I admit that I am a BMW fanboy

However, I drive a E90 ///M Sport and for now we are keeping that..my wife drives it..I was really looking at the Cayman S ( I cannot afford or justify a 911 S). I even attended the PCar track event when they introduced the Cayman..HOWEVER when I saw the new ///M4 I was completely taken with it..other than the IPAD type screen and the lack of colours offered in it I like everything..

PROS for the Cayman

• I don't have kids and wont have any so I don't need a backseat
• It's a PORSCHE!!
• Awesome handling
• Really nice interior
• Many colours offered
• Screen is in the right place
• Unique vehicle many people do not have Cayman

CONS for the Cayman

• Higher finance rate
• HP is limited to 310bhp
• add a number of options in you are in 911 territory so it can get pricey quick
• no CF roof
• Maint could be very expensive
• Its a TRUE sports car not DD that you can also use like a sports car

PROS for the ///M4

• Styling is very aggressive
• Improved Interior - especially the new seats
• Gobs of BHP and low end torque
• BMW offers good rates or at least better than PORSCHE
• Its a ///M - unique vehicle
• Its a DD that doubles as sports car

CONS for the ///M4

• Completely new car and engine - issues with new MY
• It's a large coupe..
• Lack of colour choices
• Too much BHP meaning cannot use in the street - have the same issue with E90
• Many more options are included

So there you have it and why I am confused...When I price them out in Cdn $$$ they are pretty close..on the Cayman though I am not looking at many features because as I mentioned the Cayman can get up there in $$$ real quick..

I am interested in your comments and viewpoints..

PS When I do give up the E90 I will be looking at the F30 Sedan..

PPS I could wait for the ///M2

You have good points on CONS and PROS, but I'm a little confuse! 310HP is CONS for Cayman and 425 HP is CONS for M4 so what are you looking for?
As you said maybe M2 is the best choice for you since it must have 365-375HP

[YellowMellow]

Originally Posted by half man half amazin

Exactly! I drove the Cayman S last week and it reminded me of the e92 with the lack of torque. Great car, but not a lot of creature comforts, and torque definitely makes me smile ��

Creature comforts - what specifically were you referring to that the Cayman lacks vs the M4?
The Cayman is a true 2-seat sports car vs a sporty 2-door w/4 seats

[YellowMellow]

IMHO, I think its comparing oranges vs tangerines - there are a lot of similarities in terms of each cars goals but their DNA is totally different

The Cayman S is already a superior track/handling sports car and I can only imagine what the GTS will be like.

By the way, Porsche's are one of the best daily driving cars around I have the '11 C4S and I use it as my daily and its awesome. My wife drives her '11 M3 vert and its nice. The M3 suspension is not as sophisticated as the 911 but it does fine for DD and occasional fun.

I'm sure the new M4/M3 will be great all around cars but the Cayman GTS is probably a couple of notches above when it comes to handling.

If the rumors are true, I'd take the M2 over the M4 any day.

[SupremePower3335]

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

You have good points on CONS and PROS, but I'm a little confuse! 310HP is CONS for Cayman and 425 HP is CONS for M4 so what are you looking for? As you said maybe M2 is the best choice for you since it must have 365-375HP

What I mean is that 310 is "slow" when compared to the over 400bhp of the ///M4 BUT a number of folks say think that the 310 is good and come to think of it I have it in my E90 and I cannot use it..As for why that is a CON in the ///M4 but it cannot be used in day to day driving..Now I'm confused

I guess what I am asking is 310bhp enough and I answered my own question..

Originally Posted by YellowMellow

Creature comforts - what specifically were you referring to that the Cayman lacks vs the M4? The Cayman is a true 2-seat sports car vs a sporty 2-door w/4 seats

I like techy things in ///M4 such as the HUD, sport settings, M track info etc..again these are nice to haves but not a MUST

Originally Posted by YellowMellow

IMHO, I think its comparing oranges vs tangerines - there are a lot of similarities in terms of each cars goals but their DNA is totally different The Cayman S is already a superior track/handling sports car and I can only imagine what the GTS will be like.
By the way, Porsche's are one of the best daily driving cars around I have the '11 C4S and I use it as my daily and its awesome. My wife drives her '11 M3 vert and its nice. The M3 suspension is not as sophisticated as the 911 but it does fine for DD and occasional fun. I'm sure the new M4/M3 will be great all around cars but the Cayman GTS is probably a couple of notches above when it comes to handling. If the rumors are true, I'd take the M2 over the M4 any day.

Thx, this is the kinda of feedback I am looking for..I cannot have both so I need to pick one...frankly its hard to move away from BMW..I've never had a ///M before..

Originally Posted by FTS

Let me chime in with few minor items that may not be worth much:

• I personally prefer the Cayman's exterior design, I think, but the M3/4 is growing on me.
• Maintenance costs are not very high at all, they are in the 'normal' range and comparable to any car, but not free.
• I am not sure why a CF roof may be important, but it does not need it as it is comparably quite light in weight overall.
• I would not classify Cayman as a sports car first, it really is a DD with strong sporty characteristics.
• Porsche brakes are better than BMW brakes, steel-to-steel and CCB-to-CCB.
• A Cayman will cost about $10K more comparably optioned than an M3/4; however, getting $6 to 9K discounts on a Cayman S (not the GTS) is quite reasonable and if you go for one on the lot you can probably get close to $11K.
• The interior... it is a matter of personal taste of course, but the BMW interior is looking better to me, particularly in full leather, but may be I have been driving Porsches for a little too long of time.
• BMW ED is a better program than than Porsche's.
• Cayman's sport exhaust sound is just superb, but beware of the interior engine sound, which is dreadful as RPMs increase (this is strictly a personal note, many disagree with me)
• Avoid as many electronic supplements as you can with a Porsche.
• Windscreen on Porsches are very thin (save weight and cost), plan on replacing them every other year or 18 months, or protect it with 3M cover
• I have not actually checked for the 981, but I don't think they moved to multi-link rear suspension yet, partly to keep the handling separation from the 911. For DD and street driving, it does not matter of course.
• Cayman interior is very usable from a storage perspective.
  Porsche's use primarily aluminum, hence repair costs for accidents are probably higher than BMW, but do not know this for a fact. I was astonished to find out that replacing my GT3's front bumper with OEM would cost me $6500 (it is because it says GT3 on it, not because it is made of aluminum )
• At the same time, the chassis construction is quite modular, changing/replacing fenders, chassis braces, etc. are less labor intensive
• Porsche parts across models are easily interchangeable from transmission, engine, suspension, body panels, etc. This creates interesting possibilities

I hope this helps in some ways.

Great points to consider, thank you!

[Rambler]

Originally Posted by SupremePower3335

What I mean is that 310 is "slow" when compared to the over 400bhp of the ///M4 BUT a number of folks say think that the 310 is good and come to think of it I have it in my E90 and I cannot use it..As for why that is a CON in the ///M4 but it cannot be used in day to day driving..Now I'm confused

By the way, the Cayman GTS will have 340hp (325 for Cayman S) vs. 310 . So a little closer to your sweet spot.

[SupremePower3335]

Originally Posted by Rambler

By the way, the Cayman GTS will have 340hp (325 for Cayman S) vs. 310 . So a little closer to your sweet spot.

Yeah but its also 12K more

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by FTS

Windscreen on Porsches are very thin (save weight and cost), plan on replacing them every other year or 18 months, or protect it with 3M cover

I hope this helps in some ways.

Great post, surprised about this one though, you've obviously many years feedback so take it a red. Interesting, certainly adds to the ownership costs.

[YellowMellow]

99.99% of the population can't take a standard sedan like a Honda Accord, Fusion, Camry, etc to its limits let alone a 300hp+ car. And the majority of the time if the car has a ton of horsepower, you can't take advantage of it on a regular basis in DD.

[SupremePower3335]

Originally Posted by YellowMellow

99.99% of the population can't take a standard sedan like a Honda Accord, Fusion, Camry, etc to its limits let alone a 300hp+ car. And the majority of the time if the car has a ton of horsepower, you can't take advantage of it on a regular basis in DD.

yep - exactly my point. I am leaning towards the ///M BC its what I know and love..Porsche are nice just not sure of them as a DD..

[Romo]

Oh man what a car, what a brilliant car it is.........

I`m definitely going to buy one, think I`ll keep the 1M for DD and the Porker for pure driving fun........

Had some thoughts on buying an M4, but that is over, all over........

[visualguy]

The two things I don't like about the Cayman are the excessively noisy cabin (the tire noise is particularly annoying), and the low ground clearance (99mm with PASM vs 121mm on the M4).

[Romo]

Originally Posted by visualguy

The two things I don't like about the Cayman are the excessively noisy cabin (the tire noise is particularly annoying), and the low ground clearance (99mm with PASM vs 121mm on the M4).

So with the above mentioned sports chassis the ground clearance is dropping annother 10mm?

Anybody some thoughts on PASM vs the Sports chassis?

[Imola3]

Originally Posted by Romo

Oh man what a car, what a brilliant car it is.........

I`m definitely going to buy one, think I`ll keep the 1M for DD and the Porker for pure driving fun........

Had some thoughts on buying an M4, but that is over, all over........

That makes two of us. I'm sold.