BPM
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   BMW M3 and BMW M4 Forum > BMW F80 M3 / F82 M4 Forum > F80 M3 / M4 Pricing, Ordering, European Delivery

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      04-07-2015, 05:53 PM   #155
Powaup
Brigadier General
Powaup's Avatar
United_States
1100
Rep
3,653
Posts

Drives: M235i
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: San Francisco, CA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2015 BMW M4  [5.00]
Here is a link to a lease calculator that I think will be very useful for this thread: http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/att...4&d=1391667449
__________________
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 06:19 PM   #156
macagain
Private
7
Rep
54
Posts

Drives: '14 435i xdrive MSport
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Denver, CO

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MFNATIK View Post
My friend did this with his 528i. Bought it for less than the residual. I haven't heard it happening for M cars but I'm sure others may chime in.
Any idea if from dealer or BMWFS directly?
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 06:36 PM   #157
doug_999
Brigadier General
doug_999's Avatar
1577
Rep
3,203
Posts

Drives: 2018 M3/2011 1M
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Chicago, IL

iTrader: (0)

Great post OneRib! Best full lease explanation out there and now we can just link back to here when people ask questions. One minor clarification

When you turn your car in, the dealer can buy the car on the spot from BMWFS (as you noted, they get a better price than the residual). In that case, they can sign off on the car as is and you are free and clear (sometimes an advantage vs. waiting for the final BMW inspection).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mako View Post
I think this might depend on what State you live in though, in Illinois for instance the new tax law taxes a lease on the down payment plus monthly payments. So I read this as "fees" like acquisition fee, doc fees, DMV fees are not a "deposit" so if paid up front there should be no tax on them (7% for me) but if I roll them into the lease, then I would be charged 7% tax on them! seems silly to roll something in and have to pay taxes because of that, other states might be different.
Mako, I believe the law is
"tax will be based on each lease payment (plus related fees and charges)"

So no advantage to not rolling in (although my dealer normally makes me pay the doc fees and DMV fees outside of the lease anyway).
__________________
2018 M3, Mineral White, 6 speed, ZCP, loaded sans CCB
2011 1M, Black loaded sans sat radio
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 06:47 PM   #158
MRCUR
Lieutenant Colonel
MRCUR's Avatar
United_States
799
Rep
1,771
Posts

Drives: 2018 M3 CS & 2019 X3 M40i
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: PA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by macagain View Post
Any idea if from dealer or BMWFS directly?
If you're doing a lease buyout, you're paying BMWFS directly since they own the car. Dealers do not own leased cars. If you're trading in the car to a dealer, they will take care of the buyout with BMWFS (just as they would if you had a loan on a car and were trading it in).
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 06:59 PM   #159
Victor G
New Member
2
Rep
25
Posts

Drives: 2011 BMW 335i
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: MI

iTrader: (0)

Great post. Thank you!!
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 07:28 PM   #160
F80NJM3
Colonel
F80NJM3's Avatar
United_States
1754
Rep
2,142
Posts

Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: NJ/NY

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Very valuable information especially for 1st time buyers. Nice work OneRib
__________________
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 07:48 PM   #161
davezaristo
Private First Class
United_States
14
Rep
96
Posts

Drives: 15 M3 - AW/Sakhir Orange
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: SF, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRib View Post
Some states like CA just charge tax on your monthly payment or the depreciated amount of the car while in the lease term (it all means the same thing). This rate can be the same as the sales tax or a specialized rate that is different for sales tax.
PA for example has a 6% sales tax but charges 9% tax on every lease payment (higher in Philadelphia or Allegheny County).

Other states charge sales tax on the whole sale price of the vehicle. I think Texas does this. For this reason leasing is not desired. BMW has combated this by creating owners choice which gives a temporarily low initial payment with a lump sum at the end. I circumvents the lease tax and still allows the buyer to walk away before the lump sum is due.

Taxes vary too much from state to state for me to be accurate or knowledgeable about every state.
I am in CA and that makes me wonder why I have to pay an upfront tax when taxes have already wrapped into the monthly payment..and the funny thing is that I got two similar quote and while most of the numbers being equal, the quote with additional discount off MSRP is $100 higher on upfront tax, which i can't seem to understand how it was calculated...
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 07:53 PM   #162
Mr.SugarSkulls
Brigadier General
Mr.SugarSkulls's Avatar
No_Country
2818
Rep
3,245
Posts

Drives: BMW i8
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Long Beach, CA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2016 BMW F13 M6  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by davezaristo
Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRib View Post
Some states like CA just charge tax on your monthly payment or the depreciated amount of the car while in the lease term (it all means the same thing). This rate can be the same as the sales tax or a specialized rate that is different for sales tax.
PA for example has a 6% sales tax but charges 9% tax on every lease payment (higher in Philadelphia or Allegheny County).

Other states charge sales tax on the whole sale price of the vehicle. I think Texas does this. For this reason leasing is not desired. BMW has combated this by creating owners choice which gives a temporarily low initial payment with a lump sum at the end. I circumvents the lease tax and still allows the buyer to walk away before the lump sum is due.

Taxes vary too much from state to state for me to be accurate or knowledgeable about every state.
I am in CA and that makes me wonder why I have to pay an upfront tax when taxes have already wrapped into the monthly payment..and the funny thing is that I got two similar quote and while most of the numbers being equal, the quote with additional discount off MSRP is $100 higher on upfront tax, which i can't seem to understand how it was calculated...
You and me both- especially that first point. Is that legal?

Btw OP- thank you so much for this post, that must have taken you a while, so your efforts are appreciated!
__________________
I'm always sunny, hunny.
Appreciate 1
      04-07-2015, 08:02 PM   #163
jzmundy
Major
jzmundy's Avatar
558
Rep
1,206
Posts

Drives: G01
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC

iTrader: (6)

Incredibly useful post - thanks, OP!
__________________
Then - 2001 E53, 2005 E85, 2007 E92, 2013 E82, 2017 F80
Now - 2016 F15, 2020 G01
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 08:22 PM   #164
OneRib
Colonel
United_States
1078
Rep
2,448
Posts

Drives: 2015 AY M3
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: PA

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by davezaristo View Post
I am in CA and that makes me wonder why I have to pay an upfront tax when taxes have already wrapped into the monthly payment..and the funny thing is that I got two similar quote and while most of the numbers being equal, the quote with additional discount off MSRP is $100 higher on upfront tax, which i can't seem to understand how it was calculated...
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSugarSkulls View Post
You and me both- especially that first point. Is that legal?

Btw OP- thank you so much for this post, that must have taken you a while, so your efforts are appreciated!

I may be wrong about California. PLEASE double check your state rules via the state government site or something similar. I am not an accountant and I can't be positive about any specific state's tax rules.
__________________
2013 E92 M3 LMB (gone but not forgotten)
2015 AY F80 M3 ED 7/9/15 Drop off 7/20/15 Redelivery 8/25/15
My AY M3 ED
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 08:25 PM   #165
Mr.SugarSkulls
Brigadier General
Mr.SugarSkulls's Avatar
No_Country
2818
Rep
3,245
Posts

Drives: BMW i8
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Long Beach, CA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2016 BMW F13 M6  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRib
Quote:
Originally Posted by davezaristo View Post
I am in CA and that makes me wonder why I have to pay an upfront tax when taxes have already wrapped into the monthly payment..and the funny thing is that I got two similar quote and while most of the numbers being equal, the quote with additional discount off MSRP is $100 higher on upfront tax, which i can't seem to understand how it was calculated...
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSugarSkulls View Post
You and me both- especially that first point. Is that legal?

Btw OP- thank you so much for this post, that must have taken you a while, so your efforts are appreciated!

I may be wrong about California. PLEASE double check your state rules via the state government site or something similar. I am not an accountant and I can't be positive about any specific state's tax rules.
No worries my man, I'm not quoting you when I speak to my CA/ it did make me curious though, so I'll simply ask for my curiosities sake.
__________________
I'm always sunny, hunny.
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 09:13 PM   #166
Gastoys
First Lieutenant
9
Rep
343
Posts

Drives: 2013 BWM 335i M Sport sapphire
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Greater Seattle Area

iTrader: (0)

Other cool part about leases is that if the car is ever severely damaged resulting in a salvage title after repaired by authorized shop BMW is the salvage title holder, not you.
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 09:46 PM   #167
Thrak
Private
8
Rep
68
Posts

Drives: YMB/SO M4
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: FL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Powaup View Post
Yes, it would be harder to get rid of a lease if you have lots of money in cap cost reduction because the new leasee would be required to make a lump payment for the total value of cap cost reduction left on the lease.
Not sure if I understand this part. If I put down, for example, $10,000 in cap cost reduction, that would lower my payment by a significant amount. In my particular case, it would drop my payment from $913 to $648.

Why would there be a cap cost reduction left if I already paid $10k up front? Or are you saying that in order to not waste a significant amount of money, I'd be advised to ask anyone taking over the lease to pay me a pro-rated portion of the $10k in order to keep their monthly payment at the $648?
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 10:05 PM   #168
phoenixbmwlife
Brigadier General
phoenixbmwlife's Avatar
United_States
1164
Rep
3,606
Posts

Drives: M235i & G30 540i
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Boynton Beach

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW/M235i  [0.00]
Best thread in a long while. Well written and I agree with everything written. Good Job!
__________________
Lack of money is not the problem. It is merely a symptom of what's going on inside of you! - T Harv Eker

Follow me on IG https://www.instagram.com/phoenixbmwlife/
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 10:30 PM   #169
TrqAdct
Private
22
Rep
69
Posts

Drives: F10 535d
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: NYC

iTrader: (0)

Great info OP! Agree with you an all accounts. Thanks for posting.

I've been wondering about one thing regarding purchasing extra miles. Does the residual get adjusted automatically in case you buy extra miles?
In other words, if your original residual is say $30k...few months before your lease end you buy $2000 with of miles (because you are over)..is your new residual $28k now?
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 11:14 PM   #170
gvega702
Private First Class
gvega702's Avatar
28
Rep
137
Posts

Drives: 2004 BMW 325i Premium | Sport
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Las Vegas

iTrader: (0)

Great post and will be useful for a guy like me one day if I choose to lease
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 11:22 PM   #171
OneRib
Colonel
United_States
1078
Rep
2,448
Posts

Drives: 2015 AY M3
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: PA

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrak View Post
Not sure if I understand this part. If I put down, for example, $10,000 in cap cost reduction, that would lower my payment by a significant amount. In my particular case, it would drop my payment from $913 to $648.

Why would there be a cap cost reduction left if I already paid $10k up front? Or are you saying that in order to not waste a significant amount of money, I'd be advised to ask anyone taking over the lease to pay me a pro-rated portion of the $10k in order to keep their monthly payment at the $648?
Yes exactly. A lease amounts to paying for the depreciation of the vehicle while in your hands (+interest and fees). How you decide to pay it is up to you. You could essentially put the whole lease cost down in one up front payment and drive around for free. If you did that and halfway through he lease wanted out, you would want a prorated amount back. You wouldn't want the person taking the lease over to drive around for free. The one taking over the lease would not want to pay you anything. The lease holder has less leverage because they are on the hook for the lease term unless someone agrees to take it over.

So in your example the $10k is your money you used to help finance borrowing the vehicle for a set period. You would want the prorated amount back if you don't use the vehicle for the whole time. Now you have to find someone willing to give it to you. If you put no money down, its just a matter of taking over the monthly payment.
__________________
2013 E92 M3 LMB (gone but not forgotten)
2015 AY F80 M3 ED 7/9/15 Drop off 7/20/15 Redelivery 8/25/15
My AY M3 ED
Appreciate 0
      04-07-2015, 11:25 PM   #172
OneRib
Colonel
United_States
1078
Rep
2,448
Posts

Drives: 2015 AY M3
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: PA

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TrqAdct View Post
Great info OP! Agree with you an all accounts. Thanks for posting.

I've been wondering about one thing regarding purchasing extra miles. Does the residual get adjusted automatically in case you buy extra miles?
In other words, if your original residual is say $30k...few months before your lease end you buy $2000 with of miles (because you are over)..is your new residual $28k now?
No change to the residual. By buying extra miles you are evening out the residual value on your end before turning the car in. It only makes sense to buy miles if you plan on walking away from the car at lease end. If you are going to buy it or the dealer agrees to buy it from BMWFS, then you wouldn't want to buy the extra miles.
__________________
2013 E92 M3 LMB (gone but not forgotten)
2015 AY F80 M3 ED 7/9/15 Drop off 7/20/15 Redelivery 8/25/15
My AY M3 ED
Appreciate 1
      04-07-2015, 11:27 PM   #173
flyga3
Geboren zu Fahren!
flyga3's Avatar
United_States
10
Rep
377
Posts

Drives: F25 X3
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Scottsdale, AZ

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Awesome thanks for sharing!
__________________
2011 F25 X3 2.8 (in service)
2009 E90 328i (retired)
2007 E92 335i (retired)
2005 R53 MINI Cooper S (retired)
2002 E53 X5 3.0 (retired), 1999 E46 328i (retired)
Appreciate 0
      04-08-2015, 04:18 AM   #174
BGM
Colonel
United Kingdom
50
Rep
2,397
Posts

Drives: F20 M140i
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Farnborough, UK

iTrader: (0)

that "money factor" nonsense is ridiculous..

why not just use interest rates?
__________________
Now: F20 M140i
Prev: F21 118d, E92 325d
Appreciate 0
      04-08-2015, 06:25 AM   #175
r3zon8
Banned
United_States
22
Rep
270
Posts

Drives: F82 AW
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Miami, FL

iTrader: (2)

Send a message via AIM to r3zon8
Slap this puppy on your laptop next time you lease. Instructions are in the second sheet. Enjoy!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jlksj80qwx0v7pi/regm.xls?dl=0

There's a nice list of crowd-sourced lease rates/residual for most makes/models on ridewithg.com

Invoice prices are all on edmunds.com

With those 3 things you'll be unstoppable. Well not really, but at least a VERY knowledgable consumer and sales managers will appreciate that. If they don't shop elsewhere or try an auto broker like best buy auto leasing in NY.
Appreciate 0
      04-08-2015, 06:33 AM   #176
OneRib
Colonel
United_States
1078
Rep
2,448
Posts

Drives: 2015 AY M3
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: PA

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by r3zon8 View Post
Slap this puppy on your laptop next time you lease. Instructions are in the second sheet. Enjoy!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jlksj80qwx0v7pi/regm.xls?dl=0

There's a nice list of lease rates/residual for most makes/models on ridewithg.com
That website used to be fantastic, but it became too popular and his source was "strongly encouraged" to stop providing numbers. Now its just a collection of self reported deals. Not all models and lease scenarios are listed every month.
__________________
2013 E92 M3 LMB (gone but not forgotten)
2015 AY F80 M3 ED 7/9/15 Drop off 7/20/15 Redelivery 8/25/15
My AY M3 ED
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:33 PM.




f80post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST