Rotors Keep Warping!!! HELP!!

[michaelalex17]

Hello,

I have an M3 and during the last 2 years I have gone through 4 sets of rotors. This is not an issue with pad deposits, the shop is testing the run-out and they are warping. The first two sets were replaced under warranty. The third set I paid out of pocket. then I set thats it and bought Ferado DS2500 pads and Stoptech aero rotors and within three months they have just warped as well. I am not tracking the car and am driving it no different than I have driven any other car I have ever owned. I am not driving aggressively and holding my foot on the brakes when I stop or braking through puddles or anything.

The shops made sure that the wheels were torqued properly and that there were no issues with the hubs. The shop (which is very reputable can't figure out why this keeps happening).

Has anyone else had this problem? Or does anyone have any idea what could be causing this and how to fix it? I can't enjoy the car and want to sell it over this problem.

Thank you!

[NYG]

What shop are you going to?

I have horrific problems with my brakes (stock rotors/calipers with PFC pads) and I only managed to warp one set of fronts after an entire season of thermal destruction at the track.

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by NYG

What shop are you going to?

I have horrific problems with my brakes (stock rotors/calipers with PFC pads) and I only managed to warp one set of fronts after an entire season of thermal destruction at the track.

The first three sets that warped were all handled by the dealer. The last set is the only one I have done through an independent shop.

[michaelalex17]

Also they way you have driven without warning them is exactly how the car was meant to be driven so my street driving style shouldn't be causing the rotors to keep warping which is why I think something suspension related or something else is causing this to happen but figured would come here for advice because I can't figure it out.

[Shadow2]

How many miles are you getting before they warp? Where do you park the car(indoor or outside)? Frequency of washing? OEM wheels or aftermarket? Sorry just spitballing here, strange issue...

[Encanto]

There is no warping by itself, or by just turning around.

Have the dealer taken a look at the calipers? I mean, aftermarket rotors at the four corners warping as well means that something mechanical is warping them somehow if no constant abuse or repeatable extreme changes of temperature are causing it.

A firmware update would be another thing to look for. These brakes have a dry out function that gently apply the brakes if rain is detected to keep rotors as dry as possible, and it has a brake force prep in case of sudden stops require more force from booster than the brake pedal being pressed in by the driver is translating. These functions are controlled by firmware. Any of these functions can exert more braking pulses if malfunctioning, all the time, every time you drive, and they are designed to be imperceptible to the driver.

This requires troubleshooting, not constant replacement.

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by Shadow2

How many miles are you getting before they warp? Where do you park the car(indoor or outside)? Frequency of washing? OEM wheels or aftermarket? Sorry just spitballing here, strange issue...

Spit ball away! That's why I posted! Getting probably like 500 miles on a set. OEM wheels. No spacers. Wash the car once a month or so. Parked in an indoor parking garage.

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by Encanto

There is no warping by itself, or by just turning around.

Have the dealer taken a look at the calipers? I mean, aftermarket rotors at the four corners warping as well means that something mechanical is warping them somehow if no constant abuse or repeatable extreme changes of temperature are causing it.

A firmware update would be another thing to look for. These brakes have a dry out function that gently apply the brakes if rain is detected to keep rotors as dry as possible, and it has a brake force prep in case of sudden stops require more force from booster than the brake pedal being pressed in by the driver is translating. These functions are controlled by firmware. Any of these functions can exert more braking pulses if malfunctioning, all the time, every time you drive, and they are designed to be imperceptible to the driver.

This requires troubleshooting, not constant replacement.

Fronts are warping only, rears are fine. Interesting idea on the firmware idea. Worth a shot! The rotors are definitely warped they are testing the runout and they are warping.

[Nanometer]

Could be your break in process as well. But also check bushings, control arms for play, wheel bearings, anything that would prevent rotors from sitting flush. Also just spitballing.

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by Nanometer

Could be your break in process as well. But also check bushings, control arms for play, wheel bearings, anything that would prevent rotors from sitting flush. Also just spitballing.

I am doing the standard warm the brakes up a bit to not give them thermal shock then 60-10mph about 10 times then driving for like 30 minutes without touching the brakes. Have done this same thing on all my cars and never had a problem. I think you suspension ideas are all good ones. Going to make sure the shop checks those specific components over again. Thanks!

[Racer20]

What do you use to clean the wheels? I used to use the stuff that dissolves iron (sonax, iron-X, etc.) on my Mini Cooper and was constantly fighting brake judder. My guess is that it did messed up the layer of pad material that's supposed to be on the rotors somehow and left an uneven surface. When I stopped using that stuff I stopped having problems.

Note that rotors don't actually warp. 99% of the time it's a pad deposit issue related to temperature or or a caliper problem. If the layer of pad material on the rotor is uneven, that will show runout as well.

[pbar]

This isn't the exact article I was looking for (there was one on the Essex parts site), but seems to be very similar.

https://www.apcautotech.com/getmedia...c-8-2018_1.pdf

Again, they point out that uneven deposits show up as run-out variation. But they do also mention some causes, including the way the rotor is mounted to the hub surface. Wonder if there is something uneven there?

[CanAutM3]

It is very unlikely that your rotors are warped. Uneven pad deposit display the exact same symptoms as warped rotors down to the runout being out of spec. Most shops are not familiar with the concept of uneven pad deposit and it is way easier for them to blame it on the rotors and install a new set.

[SflBimmer8484]

Bad control arm bushings will cause this but I feel like you would feel it when braking/ driving. Check them on a lift.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Andrew@ActiveAutowerke

Bad control arm bushings will cause this but I feel like you would feel it when braking/ driving. Check them on a lift.

Could you elaborate on the causal link ?

[SflBimmer8484]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Could you elaborate on the causal link ?

Vibrations would be the a cause but the control arms seem to take a beating so honestly I would look for stuck pistons at this point causing excessive heat.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Andrew@ActiveAutowerke

Vibrations would be the a cause but the control arms seem to take a beating so honestly I would look for stuck pistons at this point causing excessive heat.

OK, I see. Cause for the vibration, not the "warped" rotors.

[TRZ06]

I went thru this hell on my previous M3.

What BMW won't tell you is they just choose a crappy combo material. The rotor material and pad material do not play nice together.

I went thru 4 complete sets of pads and rotors in my 3 year lease , all under warranty and every time it would go away when new and come back after about 1K miles.

I tried the lemon law route, but BMW decided they would fight it and the attorney didn't have the balls to take them in, so I ended up living with it until the lease was up.

I'm 2000% happier with my 2SS 1LE

BTW, others are correct, the rotors are stout, it's not them warping. It's just a bad marriage of materials.

[MannyM5]

I am having the same issue as the OP. Last year I had rotors replaced under warranty. This year after only 2 light track days the vibration is back and I am out of warranty. I used a sanding block on the rotors in attempt to clean off uneven pad deposits, but that did not work either. I plan to have a shop inspect my calipers next to see if I have any issues with pistons.. Pad wear seems even though.

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

It is very unlikely that your rotors are warped. Uneven pad deposit display the exact same symptoms as warped rotors down to the runout being out of spec. Most shops are not familiar with the concept of uneven pad deposit and it is way easier for them to blame it on the rotors and install a new set.

The shop I am going to builds Porsche race cars and initially thought the issue was caused by pad deposits. But no matter what I do the vibration doesn't go away. If I drive around for like a week just going super easy on it no change, if I go out and try to re-bed the brakes no change. The vibration will not go away.

If it is deposits I'm not sure why they won't go away, but equally as important I'm not understanding why it is happening. I have had 6 cars in the past and drive exactly the same and have never had this issue. I know people that drive their M3's harder than me and know people that drive their M3's like grandmas and neither group have had this issue.

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by TRZ06

I went thru this hell on my previous M3.

What BMW won't tell you is they just choose a crappy combo material. The rotor material and pad material do not play nice together.

I went thru 4 complete sets of pads and rotors in my 3 year lease , all under warranty and every time it would go away when new and come back after about 1K miles.

I tried the lemon law route, but BMW decided they would fight it and the attorney didn't have the balls to take them in, so I ended up living with it until the lease was up.

I'm 2000% happier with my 2SS 1LE

BTW, others are correct, the rotors are stout, it's not them warping. It's just a bad marriage of materials.

Interesting thank you. But I also warped a set of OEM pads with a set of Ferado DS2500 pads.

[michaelalex17]

Originally Posted by MannyM5

I am having the same issue as the OP. Last year I had rotors replaced under warranty. This year after only 2 light track days the vibration is back and I am out of warranty. I used a sanding block on the rotors in attempt to clean off uneven pad deposits, but that did not work either. I plan to have a shop inspect my calipers next to see if I have any issues with pistons.. Pad wear seems even though.

The curse of the 2015 Yas Marina Blue strikes again!