Bilstein B16 Damptronic Kit - A love/hate relationship.

[slaughter.mode]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Honestly the best combo for running these coilovers as a daily/spirited driving combo is getting an 18 inch setup with 40 profile tires.

I took off the CS EDC coding (reverted back to stock EDC coding) and got 18s with a 40 profile tire and now the ride is 100000000% better. Firm and planted when needed but civil enough in comfort mode that my wife DOESN'T complain anymore. Before with the CS EDC coding and my 19s with 35 profile tires, my wife would not get in my car.

I know changing wheels isn't in the cards for many of you, but it got to a point where I was not enjoying driving my car daily anymore. Taking off the CS EDC coding also helped tremendously.

Changing the wheels are but not on 18s. They're just too small for my liking. I feel the 19s with 35s are going to be the solution for me...especially for traction...these PS4s are great but cannot handle 650whp worth a damn.

[scoale]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Honestly the best combo for running these coilovers as a daily/spirited driving combo is getting an 18 inch setup with 40 profile tires.

I took off the CS EDC coding (reverted back to stock EDC coding) and got 18s with a 40 profile tire and now the ride is 100000000% better. Firm and planted when needed but civil enough in comfort mode that my wife DOESN'T complain anymore. Before with the CS EDC coding and my 19s with 35 profile tires, my wife would not get in my car.

I know changing wheels isn't in the cards for many of you, but it got to a point where I was not enjoying driving my car daily anymore. Taking off the CS EDC coding also helped tremendously.

Plus one on 18s. I had a 2016 w/ 19s and now have a 2018 w/ adaptive and 513 18" wheels. Super compliant. Forum posts indicate the ride gets even better when switching from PSS to PS4. Tire PSI is a real thing too.

[irunalot]

I was thinking going back to the ZCP to see how it is. What difference did you notice?

[jfritz27]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Taking off the CS EDC coding also helped tremendously.

Interesting.... my car has had this coded for a while. Sounds like I should try reverting back to stock (I have a ZCP). Thanks for the tip.

[jfritz27]

Originally Posted by goaty

I can't wait to get my monoballs. I wanted Turner pre-installed ones but they're not available until this summer (lol) so I just ordered up some Millway's. I'm also going to throw in some new lower arms, probably SPL because I want to really get this front end geometry dialed in nicely. Steering has always felt really sloppy on the F8x...probably the whole electronic steering crap.

Yeah, there is definitely a bit more feel through the wheel now -- I wouldn't say a lot, but better than before. My impetus for the monoballs is that on the track with hard braking at end of straight, front would get super darty (aligned with 0 toe) -- anxious to see if this calms it down. I was previously on MP HAS and car would dive a bit as well, so just the added stiffness from the B16 upgrade alone may have been enough to quell it maybe. April can't come soon enough!

[jpy1980]

Originally Posted by jfritz27

Interesting.... my car has had this coded for a while. Sounds like I should try reverting back to stock (I have a ZCP). Thanks for the tip.

Since you just got it installed, you can try running with the CS coding, but after 2 years of running a stiff suspension, I was over it. Worst thing was that it was stiff for the street, but not stiff enough for the track haha. Anyways, I am a lot happier with the stock coding, 18 inch wheels and B16 coils now.

[slaughter.mode]

Here's how my F82 is sitting two or so days post install. Barely 150 miles on it. Again, HRE 20x10 (F) 20x11.5 (R) with PS4 275x30 (F) and 305x30 (R).

[jfritz27]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Worst thing was that it was stiff for the street, but not stiff enough for the track haha. .

I'm curious if you could expand on this a little more as far as your track experience -- in what scenarios do you think it wasn't stiff enough? Body roll in corners?

Since I've had mine installed, on the street, I'm actually concerned (even in Comfort) that it's overdamped to the point of compromising traction on uneven road surfaces (eg, taking curbs, or with more major elevation changes). And I have removed CS coding, and this is on 18" 245/45 snows. And I'm not really slammed, either; in rear, I'd say I'm at about the half-way point from top to bottom thread. The oscillatory thing is clearly no longer an issue, but this aspect concerns me. 1st track day at NJMP Thunderbolt 4/26, so will see.....

[ntg44]

Originally Posted by jfritz27

I'm curious if you could expand on this a little more as far as your track experience -- in what scenarios do you think it wasn't stiff enough? Body roll in corners?

Since I've had mine installed, on the street, I'm actually concerned (even in Comfort) that it's overdamped to the point of compromising traction on uneven road surfaces (eg, taking curbs, or with more major elevation changes). And I have removed CS coding, and this is on 18" 245/45 snows. And I'm not really slammed, either; in rear, I'd say I'm at about the half-way point from top to bottom thread. The oscillatory thing is clearly no longer an issue, but this aspect concerns me. 1st track day at NJMP Thunderbolt 4/26, so will see.....

I wouldn't sweat it until you take it on the track yourself. Everyone has different abilities and preferences on suspension. For example, JPY wrote moving back to 18s with 40 sidewall tires and changing getting rid of CS coding helped immensely. I had this exact same configuration on my base M3 and it was still way too unbearable for me. My wife got motion sickness after 5 minutes in the car, and I probably would have too if I wasn't driving. Also, the pogoing if you floor it and hit the smallest bump - oh boy. Hold on.

Regarding mellowing out after a few miles, I'm not so sure I agree. I had mine on for about 1500 and it got no better. After 1500 miles I just about had enough of it because as JPY wrote, I too was avoiding driving my M3 because the B16D was directly interfering me enjoying the car.

About the only good thing I have to say about B16D is the steering feel/feedback for me was much better and that the TC intervention was almost nonexistent in comparison to stock. Both much appreciated benefits, but not worth the abysmal ride the other 99% of the time.

F80 suspension is such a fickle thing. Out of all the sports cars/sedans I've owned, I never felt I had to modify the suspension, and never thought I'd want to change out my M3's. After 3 iterations I had enough and just sold it, was sick of spending money on something that I'd probably never get right for my tastes. For God's sake, my current STI is more sorted than my F80 was, and they came out the exact same time. Except it costs half the price.

[jfritz27]

Originally Posted by ntg44

I wouldn't sweat it until you take it on the track yourself. Everyone has different abilities and preferences on suspension. For example, JPY wrote moving back to 18s with 40 sidewall tires and changing getting rid of CS coding helped immensely. I had this exact same configuration on my base M3 and it was still way too unbearable for me. My wife got motion sickness after 5 minutes in the car, and I probably would have too if I wasn't driving. Also, the pogoing if you floor it and hit the smallest bump - oh boy. Hold on.

Regarding mellowing out after a few miles, I'm not so sure I agree. I had mine on for about 1500 and it got no better. After 1500 miles I just about had enough of it because as JPY wrote, I too was avoiding driving my M3 because the B16D was directly interfering me enjoying the car.

About the only good thing I have to say about B16D is the steering feel/feedback for me was much better and that the TC intervention was almost nonexistent in comparison to stock. Both much appreciated benefits, but not worth the abysmal ride the other 99% of the time.

F80 suspension is such a fickle thing. Out of all the sports cars/sedans I've owned, I never felt I had to modify the suspension, and never thought I'd want to change out my M3's. After 3 iterations I had enough and just sold it, was sick of spending money on something that I'd probably never get right for my tastes. For God's sake, my current STI is more sorted than my F80 was, and they came out the exact same time. Except it costs half the price.

Thanks for this, and your prior input on the kit. Yes, want to give it a proper chance. And similarly, I haven't noticed any real difference after ~700 miles or so. I may raise height a bit in front and see if that does anything.

[jpy1980]

Originally Posted by jfritz27

I'm curious if you could expand on this a little more as far as your track experience -- in what scenarios do you think it wasn't stiff enough? Body roll in corners?

Since I've had mine installed, on the street, I'm actually concerned (even in Comfort) that it's overdamped to the point of compromising traction on uneven road surfaces (eg, taking curbs, or with more major elevation changes). And I have removed CS coding, and this is on 18" 245/45 snows. And I'm not really slammed, either; in rear, I'd say I'm at about the half-way point from top to bottom thread. The oscillatory thing is clearly no longer an issue, but this aspect concerns me. 1st track day at NJMP Thunderbolt 4/26, so will see.....

What NTG wrote above really hits home. What actually helped even more is lowering the PSI to about 29-30 cold. That's actually the PSI of the tires that I use when I go on track. haha.

Key point is that it is stiff, but tolerances vary from individuals. There are times I do wish I had a softer suspension, but I know I may regret it once I hit the track again. Yet, I'm not sure how much more I can go to the track with 2 little ones taking up a lot of my time.

Your 1st track day is on 4/26? Is this your FIRST track day or first for the season? If so, don't take my comment of sport+ being too soft. I tend to drive my cars aggressively and like stiff stiff suspension at track days. Not sure if you were ever in the JDM scene back in the early 2000s, but back then I had Tein coils for my old track car which I turned up the damping to 16 clicks, ALL THE TIME. I used to like stiff cars, but now I only like them on track. haha. If this is your first time, ever, on track with the F80, esp with the B16D suspension, then you'll have fun. It's more than capable. If you feel comfort is too much on the street, try lowering the tires a psi or so.

[jfritz27]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

What NTG wrote above really hits home. What actually helped even more is lowering the PSI to about 29-30 cold. That's actually the PSI of the tires that I use when I go on track. haha.

Key point is that it is stiff, but tolerances vary from individuals. There are times I do wish I had a softer suspension, but I know I may regret it once I hit the track again. Yet, I'm not sure how much more I can go to the track with 2 little ones taking up a lot of my time.

Your 1st track day is on 4/26? Is this your FIRST track day or first for the season? If so, don't take my comment of sport+ being too soft. I tend to drive my cars aggressively and like stiff stiff suspension at track days. Not sure if you were ever in the JDM scene back in the early 2000s, but back then I had Tein coils for my old track car which I turned up the damping to 16 clicks, ALL THE TIME. I used to like stiff cars, but now I only like them on track. haha. If this is your first time, ever, on track with the F80, esp with the B16D suspension, then you'll have fun. It's more than capable. If you feel comfort is too much on the street, try lowering the tires a psi or so.

Thanks bud... first track day for the season, this will be my 3rd full year. I plan to do a more detailed write up as I've set some solid baselines at my local track last season, with the rest of the setup basically unchanged.

[jpy1980]

Originally Posted by jfritz27

Thanks bud... first track day for the season, this will be my 3rd full year. I plan to do a more detailed write up as I've set some solid baselines at my local track last season, with the rest of the setup basically unchanged.

Ah you'll have a blast. It was definitely a set up from when I had just the swift springs and the OEM EDC. As long as youre not trying to eek out every .01 seconds, you're gonna have a great time.

Haha, maybe afterward, after being on Sport+ the whole time on track, you'll go back to comfort and say "ahhhhh so comfy!"

Have fun and be safe! can't wait to read your review!

[slaughter.mode]

It's been a good month and some change on the B16s, they are definitely settled. I have the front to the bottom and the rears in the middle. I gotta say, it's a rough ride but you can't have it all. I have zero complaints. I just added some Millway monoballs to the front thrust arms. I plan on some sphericals for the rear lower arms as well. I also upgraded to some 20" LMRs (20x9.5 F and 20x11 R). I re-used my PS4 275x30x20s and 305x30x20s and it's flush and zero rub. Loving the whole setup.

[stevehifi]

Just a comment on my end about the b16d on track. Overall I have to say it's not bad, but a couple issues with it:
- sport plus setting seems to run way too much high speed compression and lacks enough low/high speed rebound.
- the spring rates on the setup are much too soft for track use
- you can't lower the setup too much, you'll hit bump stops too easily when hitting berms. (Probably because of too soft springs)
- rolls too much(again spring rates too soft)

Overall I think the shocks are excellent, but the edc preconfigured settings are inadequate. The spring rates are ok for the street but too soft for track use.

[jpy1980]

Originally Posted by stevehifi

Just a comment on my end about the b16d on track. Overall I have to say it's not bad, but a couple issues with it:
- sport plus setting seems to run way too much high speed compression and lacks enough low/high speed rebound.
- the spring rates on the setup are much too soft for track use
- you can't lower the setup too much, you'll hit bump stops too easily when hitting berms. (Probably because of too soft springs)
- rolls too much(again spring rates too soft)

Overall I think the shocks are excellent, but the edc preconfigured settings are inadequate. The spring rates are ok for the street but too soft for track use.

Finally someone mirrors what I’ve been saying all the time! Still fun but too soft for the track. I wish DSC came out with a controller for something like this.

Oh and I just got the dreaded chassis malfunction again. I’m so over it!

[slaughter.mode]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Finally someone mirrors what I’ve been saying all the time! Still fun but too soft for the track. I wish DSC came out with a controller for something like this.

Oh and I just got the dreaded chassis malfunction again. I’m so over it!

These are classified as 'street performance' which is why I got them...definitely better than stock for the track but not track enough for the track.

Maybe I got lucky but haven't had any malfunction errors yet...I hope I didn't just jinx myself.

[jpy1980]

Originally Posted by the_ghost

These are classified as 'street performance' which is why I got them...definitely better than stock for the track but not track enough for the track.

Maybe I got lucky but haven't had any malfunction errors yet...I hope I didn't just jinx myself.

Oh most definitely, you're correct. These are street coilovers, yet they were "tuned" on the nurburgring, which should translate well into the road courses that I go to. Anyways, its fine for what it is, but I think I am just particularly bitter because of these issues I'm having.

[slaughter.mode]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Oh most definitely, you're correct. These are street coilovers, yet they were "tuned" on the nurburgring, which should translate well into the road courses that I go to. Anyways, its fine for what it is, but I think I am just particularly bitter because of these issues I'm having.

Don't blame you. Maybe they can swap out the parts under warranty? EAS is really helpful in my experience thus far.

[jpy1980]

Originally Posted by the_ghost

Don't blame you. Maybe they can swap out the parts under warranty? EAS is really helpful in my experience thus far.

Yea I've been going to Kevin for this issue. They actually took apart my rear suspension to look for the error, but they said everything is fine on their end...Just emailed him again to see what my next recourse is...

The only issue with Bilstein is that when I spoke with them, they want me to take off the suspension and send it back to them before any warranty work gets done...they need to diagnose and approve...can't have my car out that long for some dumb coilovers hahah...we will see what Kevin says...if the shock is blown, then I may just switch to static like KWs...or maybe ST XTAs since they are the same as KWs but cheaper and I'm tired of buying stuff for the car now hahah UGH! =)

BTW if youre in SoCal, we should go for a drive sometime soon! (when my car is fixed)

[slaughter.mode]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Yea I've been going to Kevin for this issue. They actually took apart my rear suspension to look for the error, but they said everything is fine on their end...Just emailed him again to see what my next recourse is...

The only issue with Bilstein is that when I spoke with them, they want me to take off the suspension and send it back to them before any warranty work gets done...they need to diagnose and approve...can't have my car out that long for some dumb coilovers hahah...we will see what Kevin says...if the shock is blown, then I may just switch to static like KWs...or maybe ST XTAs since they are the same as KWs but cheaper and I'm tired of buying stuff for the car now hahah UGH! =)

BTW if youre in SoCal, we should go for a drive sometime soon! (when my car is fixed)

That's wild. I'd just ask for a new unit and have them swap it out and send that back. Let me know! I'm always down to roll.

[jpy1980]

Originally Posted by the_ghost

That's wild. I'd just ask for a new unit and have them swap it out and send that back. Let me know! I'm always down to roll.

haha I already asked and they said that I have to go through the place I purchased it. The place I purchased it needs to fill out a form and send my parts to Bilstein for review. If I were a starving 20 year old, maybe I'd go that route, but now that I'm older and with family, can't have my car gone that long...bummer.