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      02-20-2014, 08:09 PM   #1
syl2121201
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CCB or aftermarket Brembo brakes?

I was considering the bmw CCB, since I really want big 6/4 piston brake on the new m4, and I will maybe do several track days per year. Is it worth the 8000+ bucks, or just get some after market brakes with the steel rotor? Any advice for the quantity and pricing for these brakes?
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      02-20-2014, 08:10 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syl2121201
I was considering the bmw CCB, since I really want big 6/4 piston brake on the new m4, and I will maybe do several track days per year. Is it worth the 8000+ bucks, or just get some after market brakes with the steel rotor? Any advice for the quantity and pricing for these brakes?
Well BBK 6 piston F and R are about the same price as the CCBs
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      02-20-2014, 08:13 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonymiabmw View Post
Well BBK 6 piston F and R are about the same price as the CCBs
Not when it comes time to replace those CCB rotors.
You can get StopTech ST60/St40 for around $5,000, or even less. Brembo's are usually around $1,500 more.
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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      02-20-2014, 08:16 PM   #4
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If you care about performance, CCBs.
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      02-20-2014, 08:17 PM   #5
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CCB is absolutely the way to go. Capitalize the cost of the brakes in the price of the car. Get something that's been tested and will work perfectly. BBK is hard to get perfect the first time.

I think the option will only end up costing USD $6900 or less.
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      02-20-2014, 08:19 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonymiabmw View Post
Well BBK 6 piston F and R are about the same price as the CCBs
Not when it comes time to replace those CCB rotors.
You can get StopTech ST60/St40 for around $5,000, or even less. Brembo's are usually around $1,500 more.
Actually I will get the steel rotors when the CCB rotors run off. So I guess it's worth to get the CCB.
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      02-20-2014, 08:19 PM   #7
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We have a thread about this/similar to this already. Search is your friend.
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      02-20-2014, 08:23 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gee-m-w View Post
CCB is absolutely the way to go. Capitalize the cost of the brakes in the price of the car. Get something that's been tested and will work perfectly. BBK is hard to get perfect the first time.

I think the option will only end up costing USD $6900 or less.
I think you have it backwards. CCB is hard to get right the first time... just ask the Porsche guys who bought first gen CCB. The BBK's are pretty much just a new mounting bracket and that's it. Brembo, StopTech, AP all have hundreds of different calipers and they'll find one that matches up well with the stock master cylinder.

OP said he's going to track it, which will signficantly shorten the life of the rotor. You'll also be limited on what pads you can use. Porsche guys who used other track pads ruined their CCB rotors much faster than the ones who used the Porsche track pads.

.
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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      02-20-2014, 08:27 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gee-m-w
CCB is absolutely the way to go. Capitalize the cost of the brakes in the price of the car. Get something that's been tested and will work perfectly. BBK is hard to get perfect the first time.

I think the option will only end up costing USD $6900 or less.
Thought it said 8.5k on the price list they realesed?
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      02-20-2014, 08:30 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post
I think you have it backwards. CCB is hard to get right the first time... just ask the Porsche guys who bought first gen CCB. The BBK's are pretty much just a new mounting bracket and that's it. Brembo, StopTech, AP all have hundreds of different calipers and they'll find one that matches up well with the stock master cylinder.

OP said he's going to track it, which will signficantly shorten the life of the rotor. You'll also be limited on what pads you can use. Porsche guys who used other track pads ruined their CCB rotors much faster than the ones who used the Porsche track pads.

.
I really could not disagree more. The amount of time BMW puts into getting the noise, vibration and harshness (NVH) perfectly developed with pads and rotors should not be discounted. Yes, you can physically bolt anything to the suspension. Even finding a race pad that won't squeal like a city bus on the street is quite difficult. It's all luck. If you're not lucky, you end up redoing the brakes a few times until you get it right. My BMW was a mess - the dust boots would shred and the pad wear sensors would melt every time I went out, dash lit up like a christmas tree. I got the Audi right the first time but it cost me $5,000 and a few nervous outings to the track where I wasn't sure if the car was going to perform.

There's two kinds of tracking. There's the weekend warrior, non competitive stuff you do with BMW CCA in HPDE events. This is perfect for CCB. Then there's competition cars like the GT3 Cup and the M235i club race. These cars do not have VIN numbers and are not street cars. While having CCB on racecars is great, those cars are $200,000, the engine mileage is measured in hours like a boat, and they require about $50k in spare parts to keep running properly. In these cases unless you have another $50k laying around you skip the CCB.

The Pagid RSC1 will be one level more abrasive than the BMW factory pad. This is the pad you want to run. The stock pads should last about 4 weekends. These are endurance pads and will last 8 weekends or more.

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Last edited by gee-m-w; 02-20-2014 at 08:35 PM..
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      02-20-2014, 08:34 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonymiabmw View Post
Thought it said 8.5k on the price list they realesed?
They were like $7500 Canadian. Each US option price is about 10-15% lower.
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      02-20-2014, 08:36 PM   #12
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Says $8150 is that final?
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      02-20-2014, 08:37 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gee-m-w View Post
They were like $7500 Canadian. Each US option price is about 10-15% lower.
Our price in the U.S. for CCB's is $8,150.
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      02-20-2014, 08:51 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Our price in the U.S. for CCB's is $8,150.
Sorry for the poor communication on my part. Invoice price on that option should land right around $6930. The options are 15% discount to MSRP, which is $6927.

I add things up as invoice and then add a "dealer profit" at the end before tax. Probably $3000.
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      02-20-2014, 09:19 PM   #15
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brembos are over priced. just get front 6pot ap racing bbk. dont really need 4pot rear. majority of stopping force during hard braking comes from front end anyway. 3500 well spent. good to go
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      02-20-2014, 09:40 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ixse View Post
brembos are over priced. just get front 6pot ap racing bbk. dont really need 4pot rear. majority of stopping force during hard braking comes from front end anyway. 3500 well spent. good to go
I went this route on the S4. It's pretty perfect. It's about $3000 for the kit, plus tax and shipping. Then you have to spend $350 on the pads for the front. At the same time you'll spend another $300 on the rear pads. You'll end up ordering stainless steel lines for the rear also. Then you're in for the installation and the brake fluid, and bedding the pads. The job is $5000 when it's "done".

If you can order this from the factory, get better braking, less weight, etc. it's a no brainer to spend the $7k. It could theoretically even increase resale.
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      02-20-2014, 09:45 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gee-m-w
Quote:
Originally Posted by ixse View Post
brembos are over priced. just get front 6pot ap racing bbk. dont really need 4pot rear. majority of stopping force during hard braking comes from front end anyway. 3500 well spent. good to go
I went this route on the S4. It's pretty perfect. It's about $3000 for the kit, plus tax and shipping. Then you have to spend $350 on the pads for the front. At the same time you'll spend another $300 on the rear pads. You'll end up ordering stainless steel lines for the rear also. Then you're in for the installation and the brake fluid, and bedding the pads. The job is $5000 when it's "done".

If you can order this from the factory, get better braking, less weight, etc. it's a no brainer to spend the $7k. It could theoretically even increase resale.
God your making want to pull the trigger on CCBs now
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      02-20-2014, 10:03 PM   #18
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CCB or aftermarket Brembo brakes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by syl2121201 View Post
I was considering the bmw CCB, since I really want big 6/4 piston brake on the new m4, and I will maybe do several track days per year. Is it worth the 8000+ bucks, or just get some after market brakes with the steel rotor? Any advice for the quantity and pricing for these brakes?
I say neither.

IMO, the base iron brakes with good race pads (and maybe better fluid) is the better option.

As others have stated, there is another thread with plenty of good discussions on the topic.

If you plan to track significantly like I do, there simply is no business case for the CCBs. Feedback form other makes is that CCBs don't last much longer than iron rotors when used at the track. Except for PF08 pads, I run a completely stock brake setup (even the fluid) on my E92 and never encountered brake fade. I track my car at the rate of 18-20 track days per season and my E92 has 5 seasons under it's belt. I have changed 2 sets of front rotors and my rears are due this spring for a total cost of $2500 in rotors. The CCBs are a $8500 option in Canada, so even if they last the full 6 years (which they most likely won't), they are still significantly more expensive.

Further, when going with CCBs, you are stuck with having to run 19" tires. There are far less choice in 19" r-comps and they are significantly more expensive than 18". So you also need to factor in the increased cost of tires.

Now if you go with the CCB option and switch to iron rotors, consider the lost performance of the significant weight addition (increased unsprung and rotational mass). The CCB callipers are much heavier than the base callipers and the replacement iron rotors will be significantly heavier than the base OEM iron rotors due to their increased diameter.

The CCB might offer a slight performance advantage. But for me, it is not worth the extra cost.

Last edited by CanAutM3; 02-21-2014 at 06:48 AM..
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      02-20-2014, 10:09 PM   #19
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You have two options for 19" DOT legal R compound tires. The inexpensive choice is Toyo R888 at about $300 a tire. The expensive choice is Dunlop Sport Maxx Race at around $600 a tire, which is the OEM equipment on the new GT3.

You're best off passing on the Pirelli P Zero Corsa System and the Pilot Sport Cup (which is shaved to something absurd like 5/32). These two tires cost you more per mile to run than gasoline by a significant margin. It's like $1 per mile driven. $3000 and it lasts 3000 miles.

Most people (me included) do just fine on Pilot Super Sports, which should be the OEM equipment.

The downside of putting race pads on an M3 with drilled rotors is they will make a ton of embarrassing noise on the street, whether you go with Performance Friction or Pagid. Swapping pads is a huge pain the ass and is a big compromise with pad bedding (you never really get a good bond between the rotor and the pad if you always switch them). With the CCB it's one pad for everything.
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      02-20-2014, 10:11 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gee-m-w View Post
You have two options for 19" DOT legal R compound tires. The inexpensive choice is Toyo R888 at about $300 a tire.
Yes, but that tire totally sucks

And even then, it is still cheaper in 18" size...
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      02-20-2014, 10:15 PM   #21
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Yes, but that tire totally sucks

And even then, it is still cheaper in 18" size...
I'm telling you, once you go 380mm BBK you never go back. 19" is the new 18". The tire manufacturers will start making more 19" R comp sizes for the Porsche, BMW, Audi and other models.
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      02-20-2014, 10:19 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gee-m-w View Post
I'm telling you, once you go 380mm BBK you never go back. 19" is the new 18". The tire manufacturers will start making more 19" R comp sizes for the Porsche, BMW, Audi and other models.
380mm is not a BBK for the F8X. 380mm is the size of the base steel rotors...
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