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      03-09-2020, 06:45 PM   #155
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Originally Posted by jmg View Post
Welcome! The big bit me about a year ago! I'm still learning a lot but it's a lot of fun and challenging. My $0.02 based on my past year's experience:

1) I don't know much about that particular track but it shouldn't be getting spongy after just one 4-6 lap session. Is DSC on? M Dynamic? These will tend to heat up the brakes if you are constantly breaking traction as they will be constantly being used to correct your trajectory. As a beginner, for me, the DSC light was definitely blinking more than it should have been! Maybe use that blinking light as a guide that you are asking the car/tires to do too much at that particular moment. Eventually you will want to turn DSC completely off at some point and you will find your lap times decrease if you knew how to dance on the limits of your car. Be safe, don't be afraid to dial it down and get your lines and technique down. Don't be pressured into breaking lap times.

2) I've never heard of Akebono. Pagid, PFC, Ferodo, are popular. I've heard really good things about Endless being an excellent street/track pad.

3) It depends on the tires, but with stock MPSS I like to stay below 38 hot. Are you using a gauge or the iDrive? Use a quality gauge. IDrive is okay, but should only be used as a quick reference.
JMG - thanks for your reply. All my nannies were on. I did not think about those using a lot of breaking but I understand that they do. I have no problem with letting the car dance so next time I will go DSC off. Right now setting track records is no where remotely ner what I am trying to do, just having fun and finding my limits.

Ferodo DS2500 is the route I think I am going along with high temp fluid.

I used a gauge to check cold pressure but used iDrive when done my laps and entering the parking area. I was on the brakes hard in a few places on the track. One long straight that where I would hit 120 and then on the binders to slow to 60 for a sharp 90 degree right. I am hooked and will try for at least 6 track days this year.
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      03-11-2020, 08:21 AM   #156
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Stock pads yes. As mentioned my car is bone stock. I don't see where pad's would cause a spongy pedal thought. It had longer travel telling me it would be i boiled my fluid. I will change pads regardless. thank you
The BMW fluid is DOT4 and works just fine. "Upgrade" if you want, but pads were the problem here not fluid. Castrol or Motul could be used if that makes you feel more comfortable.

To be specific I ran 40PSI hot on ZCP 20in wheels w/MPSS and OE 19inch w/RE71Rs.
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      03-11-2020, 10:45 AM   #157
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Originally Posted by OhioRiderAaron View Post
The BMW fluid is DOT4 and works just fine. "Upgrade" if you want, but pads were the problem here not fluid. Castrol or Motul could be used if that makes you feel more comfortable.

To be specific I ran 40PSI hot on ZCP 20in wheels w/MPSS and OE 19inch w/RE71Rs.
Thanks, Pads are in my near future. Now to decide on which ones to go with.....
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      03-11-2020, 12:41 PM   #158
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Great information. Camber Plates are for sure in my near future. Right now my main focus is Driver Mods, handling and Safety. Doing some more track days with an instructor and better braking I see as a must do now. Camber Plates later this summer. I like the suggestion of the chalk line. Will do that for sure.
Camber plates will Save your tires.

My $0.02 is use DSC OFF and go slow to get used to it
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      03-11-2020, 01:24 PM   #159
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Camber plates will Save your tires.

My $0.02 is use DSC OFF and go slow to get used to it
I found MDM to be useful for the first session. I could see in the future I might use MDM for the first couple of laps at the start of each day, just to prevent any cold tire cold track stupidity on my part. Otherwise turn it off ASAP, it'll save your rear brakes, it'll force you to be more gentle with the throttle, and it'll dramatically drop lap times.
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      03-11-2020, 02:10 PM   #160
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Originally Posted by Gomeler View Post
I found MDM to be useful for the first session. I could see in the future I might use MDM for the first couple of laps at the start of each day, just to prevent any cold tire cold track stupidity on my part. Otherwise turn it off ASAP, it'll save your rear brakes, it'll force you to be more gentle with the throttle, and it'll dramatically drop lap times.
My $0.02 based on my experience is that those cold laps where the car is moving around more is actually really valuable to get used to sliding the car through corners and catching oversteer etc etc

Using aids would rob you of that valuable learning at slower speeds.

Also the bmw electronic aids are pretty crap and give you a correction even when you donít need it, which sucks for learning. Itís truly a nanny and not a coaching aid
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      03-12-2020, 06:49 AM   #161
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Originally Posted by Gomeler View Post
I found MDM to be useful for the first session. I could see in the future I might use MDM for the first couple of laps at the start of each day, just to prevent any cold tire cold track stupidity on my part. Otherwise turn it off ASAP, it'll save your rear brakes, it'll force you to be more gentle with the throttle, and it'll dramatically drop lap times.
In reality, DSC mostly uses the front brakes...
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      03-12-2020, 06:36 PM   #162
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Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
In reality, DSC mostly uses the front brakes...
I have MDM on while driving on track, and my rear RSL29 pads are wearing faster than fronts. High pitch sound with warm pads usually means MDM is intervening (I don't look to the dashboard blinking lights, unless I'm on straight).
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      03-13-2020, 08:50 AM   #163
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Originally Posted by dim635csi View Post
I have MDM on while driving on track, and my rear RSL29 pads are wearing faster than fronts. High pitch sound with warm pads usually means MDM is intervening (I don't look to the dashboard blinking lights, unless I'm on straight).
If you're seeing rear bias wear you are over driving the backend (esp. if you have a newer M with the updated MDM and istep). More modulation of throttle and you can play within the boundaries of the system (which isn't great but not the worse either).
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      03-13-2020, 10:51 AM   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioRiderAaron View Post
If you're seeing rear bias wear you are over driving the backend (esp. if you have a newer M with the updated MDM and istep). More modulation of throttle and you can play within the boundaries of the system (which isn't great but not the worse either).
DSC/MDM applies the front brakes to correct oversteer and the rear brakes to correct understeer. Traction control is mostly managed by directly limiting the engine power output.

So if he is excessively using his rear brakes with DSC/MDM, I have to speculate that he is entering corners too hot.
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      03-13-2020, 12:11 PM   #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gomeler View Post
I found MDM to be useful for the first session. I could see in the future I might use MDM for the first couple of laps at the start of each day, just to prevent any cold tire cold track stupidity on my part. Otherwise turn it off ASAP, it'll save your rear brakes, it'll force you to be more gentle with the throttle, and it'll dramatically drop lap times.
I do plan to run DCS off next track day. will leave MDM on till more comfortable.
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      03-13-2020, 12:48 PM   #166
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
DSC/MDM applies the front brakes to correct oversteer and the rear brakes to correct understeer. Traction control is mostly managed by directly limiting the engine power output.

So if he is excessively using his rear brakes with DSC/MDM, I have to speculate that he is entering corners too hot.
Or, maybe he is entering corners just right in a 4 wheel side, and the electronics are blocking him from good lap times

Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioRiderAaron View Post
If you're seeing rear bias wear you are over driving the backend (esp. if you have a newer M with the updated MDM and istep). More modulation of throttle and you can play within the boundaries of the system (which isn't great but not the worse either).
Are you taking about the MDM in a GTS or CS? I had Euro MDM in my F80 and it still intervened a lot unnecessarily. Especially on the corner entry where it would grab apply some brakes to "correct" a slip angle that I wanted
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      03-13-2020, 12:56 PM   #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz View Post
Or, maybe he is entering corners just right in a 4 wheel side, and the electronics are blocking him from good lap times
Ya, right

If it were the case though, DSC/MDM would still be applying more front brakes and not more rear brakes...
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      03-14-2020, 12:46 PM   #168
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Ya, right

If it were the case though, DSC/MDM would still be applying more front brakes and not more rear brakes...
Too be honest I do not have enough track time with this car to know if I am too hot entering the corners, I suspect that may be the case since I am breaking as late as possible and getting on the binders pretty hard. Next time I will maybe lift a bit earlier and try for more even controlled braking with a goal to carry more exit speed. Also will run with DSC off but MDM on.
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      03-14-2020, 05:26 PM   #169
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Originally Posted by jkronq View Post
Too be honest I do not have enough track time with this car to know if I am too hot entering the corners, I suspect that may be the case since I am breaking as late as possible and getting on the binders pretty hard. Next time I will maybe lift a bit earlier and try for more even controlled braking with a goal to carry more exit speed. Also will run with DSC off but MDM on.
The DSC even in MDM doesn't like trail braking at all, that might be whats chewing up your rear brakes. Maybe it's better on the F8x generation but on the E9x the only way to drive with MDM was braking in a straight line. Like someone else said, try turning everything off. These cars are very natural and balanced, stay smooth on entry and ease in the throttle more conservatively on exit and you should have no issues.
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      03-16-2020, 07:26 AM   #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz View Post
Or, maybe he is entering corners just right in a 4 wheel side, and the electronics are blocking him from good lap times



Are you taking about the MDM in a GTS or CS? I had Euro MDM in my F80 and it still intervened a lot unnecessarily. Especially on the corner entry where it would grab apply some brakes to "correct" a slip angle that I wanted
No I am talking about the newer versions of istep. Euro MDM is crap compared to what is on the newer CS, ZCP's, and newer M's. EDC and MDM were much improved based on my experience after trying 2016 ZCP MDM/EDC, Euro MDM, 2019 istep MDM/EDC, and then CS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Montaver View Post
The DSC even in MDM doesn't like trail braking at all, that might be whats chewing up your rear brakes. Maybe it's better on the F8x generation but on the E9x the only way to drive with MDM was braking in a straight line. Like someone else said, try turning everything off. These cars are very natural and balanced, stay smooth on entry and ease in the throttle more conservatively on exit and you should have no issues.
It can withstand minor trail braking without destroying brakes.
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      03-17-2020, 07:35 PM   #171
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Originally Posted by OhioRiderAaron View Post
No I am talking about the newer versions of istep. Euro MDM is crap compared to what is on the newer CS, ZCP's, and newer M's. EDC and MDM were much improved based on my experience after trying 2016 ZCP MDM/EDC, Euro MDM, 2019 istep MDM/EDC, and then CS.
Interesting! Do you have any links that explore what changed with the newer isteps? For a 2016 M3 ZCP, would you recommend getting the DSC module updated and coded to an M3 or M4 CS config?
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      03-18-2020, 11:14 AM   #172
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Interesting! Do you have any links that explore what changed with the newer isteps? For a 2016 M3 ZCP, would you recommend getting the DSC module updated and coded to an M3 or M4 CS config?
You can find some of that information in the "coding" section of this forum, that's where I learned from. If you dig into the system you can figure out which parameters changed, but I can't remember off the top of my head.

I would recommend asking your dealer to update your "istep" software to the latest version then see what you think and if needed code in the CS settings. I was able to get my dealer to do the update for free since I complained of the "headunit resetting itself," but they may try and charge you if they can't find a good reason to update it. Even if I had to pay I would have, esp. after experiencing the newer version. FYI I believe dealers have an internal name for the "istep" so they may not know what you're talking about at first.
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      04-07-2020, 09:02 PM   #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioRiderAaron View Post
You can find some of that information in the "coding" section of this forum, that's where I learned from. If you dig into the system you can figure out which parameters changed, but I can't remember off the top of my head.

I would recommend asking your dealer to update your "istep" software to the latest version then see what you think and if needed code in the CS settings. I was able to get my dealer to do the update for free since I complained of the "headunit resetting itself," but they may try and charge you if they can't find a good reason to update it. Even if I had to pay I would have, esp. after experiencing the newer version. FYI I believe dealers have an internal name for the "istep" so they may not know what you're talking about at first.
Wouldnít that cause a problem with BM3? There is some traffic that the 2020 SW encryption hasnít been cracked.

I was running the CS engine map but recently switched to stage 1.
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      04-09-2020, 11:02 PM   #174
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Wouldnít that cause a problem with BM3? There is some traffic that the 2020 SW encryption hasnít been cracked.

I was running the CS engine map but recently switched to stage 1.
Sorry I honestly do not know. You might have better luck asking those in the modification or coding sub.
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