Added Ohlins R&T, First impressions

[tke743]

I got these installed a few weeks ago and my biggest worry was the spring rates (F - 515lbs/inch and R - 1087lbs/inch) impact on WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor). Turns out I had nothing to worry about.

Running on the crappy roads around me at 15 clicks from full hard is smoother then the stock adaptive in comfort. Car is more controlled and doesn't get unsettled by a few bumps in a row. The impacts no longer get to the cabin. There is one caveat which I'll discuss in a minute.

I have not had them on track yet, so I can't comment there yet.

As to the caveat, these are still high spring rates, so if you hit a very sharp bump it can be jarring. As an example lets say the transition on a highway from freshly grated pavement to a bridge at the old road level. We are talking about a 2" sharp bump. No damping magic can cover up 2 inches of compression and having to dissipate that with 1087lbs/inch springs. The impact is jarring, but the car immediately settles. The stock adaptive would not settle that quickly.

[parabmw]

How much is it lowered? Any pics?

[chetrickerman]

Smoother than stock? I'm surprised

[x.shell]

Originally Posted by chetrickerman

Smoother than stock? I'm surprised

Just give him a few months. Crashing over bumps get old pretty quickly. Ohlins RT dampers are pretty good, but those spring rates are ridiculous.

[FlyingLow78]

Originally Posted by exo-shell

Just give him a few months. Crashing over bumps get old pretty quickly. Ohlins RT dampers are pretty good, but those spring rates are ridiculous.

This. I highly recommend these, but with softer spring rates. Thankfully, there are lots of options for going softer.

[tke743]

Originally Posted by parabmw

How much is it lowered? Any pics?

About 3/4 of an inch. I'll get pics when I get back home from a trip.

Originally Posted by exo-shell

Just give him a few months. Crashing over bumps get old pretty quickly. Ohlins RT dampers are pretty good, but those spring rates are ridiculous.

I was worried about that, but it crashes less than the stock over everything but the most severe bumps. The roads around be are terrible, but most of it is in the 1/2 inch or less range. With those the Ohlins is less harsh then stock. On the big ones (over an inch) then the Ohlins crash more.

Originally Posted by FlyingLow78

This. I highly recommend these, but with softer spring rates. Thankfully, there are lots of options for going softer.

Yes, I was looking at that and decided to go with the stock ones first. I can change that later if I have to. So far so good.

[tke743]

Originally Posted by parabmw

How much is it lowered? Any pics?

Pics added. I still say it crashes less than stock over all bumps less than 1/2 inch. Over 1/2 inch and physics take over, we'll call it abrupt. My wife agrees. Still haven't had it on track.

[JamesGames]

How much are you lowered in front? Can't imagine with that very minor drop and amount of spring travel you still have, that it would be stiff - but I guess that 1200lb rear spring rate isn't too forgiving..

[tke743]

Originally Posted by JamesGames

How much are you lowered in front? Can't imagine with that very minor drop and amount of spring travel you still have, that it would be stiff - but I guess that 1200lb rear spring rate isn't too forgiving..

About .75 inches front and back. Rear rate is 1087lb, and trust me that's firm enough.

[knightarmor]

Originally Posted by tke743

Pics added. I still say it crashes less than stock over all bumps less than 1/2 inch. Over 1/2 inch and physics take over, we'll call it abrupt. My wife agrees. Still haven't had it on track.

Looks good. What's the wheels/ tire size specs?

[swagon]

Originally Posted by tke743

Pics added. I still say it crashes less than stock over all bumps less than 1/2 inch. Over 1/2 inch and physics take over, we'll call it abrupt. My wife agrees. Still haven't had it on track.

What rear spoiler is that? Looks bigger than m performance

[tke743]

Originally Posted by knightarmor

Looks good. What's the wheels/ tire size specs?

Apex SM-10
18x10.0 Front (ET25) - 275/35/18 MPSS
18x11.0 Rear (ET44) - 295/35/18 MPSS
Note that with the Ohlins I need to run a 5mm spacer up front to clear the suspension. I run the same rims (separate set) on track with 275/35 and 305/35 R compounds.

Originally Posted by swagon

What rear spoiler is that? Looks bigger than m performance

It is the M-performance piece. Came on the car from the dealer along with the lip. Looking at the M3 CS stuff to replace it.

[tke743]

Finally got her on track for an extended period of time. Ended up at 6 clicks front and 4 clicks back and she is dead neutral handling. Neutral with the MPSS for the rain and the Toyo RR's for the dry. With the stock adaptive it was pushing everywhere.

To those above that say I will get tired of crashing over bumps. Yes it is annoying, but I'm willing to sacrifice some NVH for a neutral car on track. Moved to the stock 18" sized tires for the street and the extra sidewall helps quite a bit.

[bracer]

No way it's not riding on the bump stops in the rear with the way the Ohlins are designed for our car. Take a pic of the shock, specifically the distance between the end of the housing and the start of the bump rubber. I bet it's less than 3/8".

[tke743]

Originally Posted by blackey

No way it's not riding on the bump stops in the rear with the way the Ohlins are designed for our car. Take a pic of the shock, specifically the distance between the end of the housing and the start of the bump rubber. I bet it's less than 3/8".

The picture is a bit deceptive. I still have a 15mm rake, rear to front. It isn't as low as you think. I was able to take the "bump" at turn 2a at Tamworth without any drama. If I was on the bump stops I would have been off. I have about 3.5" of travel, but to take a pic of that I would need the car lifted with the suspension under load. I don't have a lift like that at home.

That said the rear ride height is determined by the spring perch and I did get a shot of that.

[x.shell]

Originally Posted by tke743

The picture is a bit deceptive. I still have a 15mm rake, rear to front. It isn't as low as you think. I was able to take the "bump" at turn 2a at Tamworth without any drama. If I was on the bump stops I would have been off. I have about 3.5" of travel, but to take a pic of that I would need the car lifted with the suspension under load. I don't have a lift like that at home.

That said the rear ride height is determined by the spring perch and I did get a shot of that.

Agreed. On the Ohlin RT, the spring perch height and shock body height is independently adjustable. So plenty of piston travel is available.

The Ohlins RT I'm running on my STI has plenty of thread to maximize adjustability of the shock piston travel no matter how much or little I decide to lower the car.

OP, I'm glad you're enjoying it on track. I still think that rear spring rate would kill me as a daily, but the damper travel should be perfectly fine assuming it was properly adjusted.

[bracer]

I'll bet you $50 if you take off the dust boot there is less than 1/2" travel between the bumpstop on the shock and the shock body. I was surprised when I looked at mine and I wasn't as low as you are. The spring adjuster really isn't the issue. There is plenty of travel there, but the shock is a very different story. And that's with the shock threaded all the way up in the housing BTW as there is adjustment there, but the rear shock body is simply too long.

Sorry I know I'm coming off a bit strong. I generally love Ohlins, I've had them on several cars, but on the F8x platform they did a pretty poor job. The issue is the shock bodies are simply too long. I "think" they took the body from the E92 (or some other car) and just reused them with new hardware. This made the housings too long, but was easy for them. To combat the issue they used very high spring rates so the shocks don't bottom out as quickly. We all complained about the super high spring rates (Remember they were 1300lbs/in to start), but those of us who changed to 900's in the rear found out it didn't ride any better. The reason is there isn't any travel before the bumpstop engages, and the bumpstop spring rate is what you really are getting.

I've included a picture from the set I had. With full travel you can see the rears have just about 1.75" of travel maximum (area marked with the two red lines). As soon as you compress a spring which is inboard of the shock (so the shock will travel farther than the spring) you can see what's going to happen. The shock is going to sit on the bumstop.

[x.shell]

Originally Posted by blackey

I'll bet you $50 if you take off the dust boot there is less than 1/2" travel between the bumpstop on the shock and the shock body. I was surprised when I looked at mine and I wasn't as low as you are. The spring adjuster really isn't the issue. There is plenty of travel there, but the shock is a very different story. And that's with the shock threaded all the way up in the housing BTW as there is adjustment there, but the rear shock body is simply too long.

Sorry I know I'm coming off a bit strong. I generally love Ohlins, I've had them on several cars, but on the F8x platform they did a pretty poor job. The issue is the shock bodies are simply too long. I "think" they took the body from the E92 (or some other car) and just reused them with new hardware. This made the housings too long, but was easy for them. To combat the issue they used very high spring rates so the shocks don't bottom out as quickly. We all complained about the super high spring rates (Remember they were 1300lbs/in to start), but those of us who changed to 900's in the rear found out it didn't ride any better. The reason is there isn't any travel before the bumpstop engages, and the bumpstop spring rate is what you really are getting.

I've included a picture from the set I had. With full travel you can see the rears have just about 1.75" of travel maximum (area marked with the two red lines). As soon as you compress a spring which is inboard of the shock (so the shock will travel farther than the spring) you can see what's going to happen. The shock is going to sit on the bumstop.

You're right! That is very little travel. What a strange design choice. The proportions of the body and piston travel is completely off. I wonder what's going on in the internals that the shock body needs to be so long.

My previous statement was based on the official image that Ohlins put on their website for the F80 RT kit (attached below). It seems that their official photo and the real kit you have are different.

https://www.ohlins.com/product/road-...2014-2017-f80/


Your hypothesis as to why they chose the incredibly stupid spring rate at launch doesn't seem unreasonable. Makes a lot of sense actually. What I don't get is why on earth has so many of these reputable suspension companies royally screwed up their product dev for this platform? KW (no surprise there), Eibach, Swift, Ohlins.

[bracer]

Tell me about it. I'm on my 3rd coilover kit, but super happy with what I have now. I noticed the same on the pictures that are out there. The housing (really front and rear) need to be about 1" shorter.

[tke743]

Originally Posted by blackey

I'll bet you $50 if you take off the dust boot there is less than 1/2" travel between the bumpstop on the shock and the shock body. I was surprised when I looked at mine and I wasn't as low as you are. The spring adjuster really isn't the issue. There is plenty of travel there, but the shock is a very different story. And that's with the shock threaded all the way up in the housing BTW as there is adjustment there, but the rear shock body is simply too long.

Sorry I know I'm coming off a bit strong. I generally love Ohlins, I've had them on several cars, but on the F8x platform they did a pretty poor job. The issue is the shock bodies are simply too long. I "think" they took the body from the E92 (or some other car) and just reused them with new hardware. This made the housings too long, but was easy for them. To combat the issue they used very high spring rates so the shocks don't bottom out as quickly. We all complained about the super high spring rates (Remember they were 1300lbs/in to start), but those of us who changed to 900's in the rear found out it didn't ride any better. The reason is there isn't any travel before the bumpstop engages, and the bumpstop spring rate is what you really are getting.

I've included a picture from the set I had. With full travel you can see the rears have just about 1.75" of travel maximum (area marked with the two red lines). As soon as you compress a spring which is inboard of the shock (so the shock will travel farther than the spring) you can see what's going to happen. The shock is going to sit on the bumstop.

Not coming off strong. It is always good to check for all of our sakes.

Mine (in the box) didn't look like yours. It looked much closer to the photo below. Out of the box (I didn't take pics) it had about 5" of stroke when set to the 500mm length recommended. My droop is less than 2 inches, hence my belief that there should be 3 inches there. I will try to get some better shots this weekend if I can.

That said the "hump" in 2a at Tamworth is severe and if I was able to take that, I'm not on the bump stops. If I was on the bump stops, the chassis would have unsettled (and come off the ground), it didn't.

Originally Posted by exo-shell

https://www.ohlins.com/product/road-...2014-2017-f80/

[tke743]

When did you have yours installed? I wonder if they changed design when they changed their recommended spring rate (M2 release). As you can see below, they changed the install specs entirely between the original release and the M2 one. (Note the M2 rear spring is 30mm shorter then the original M3 one, hence the change from 10mm spring height adjuster setting to 40mm)

[tke743]

blackey I have just over 2.5 inches of travel with the suspension fully loaded before the bumpstops. My dust covers are in place, but using the pinch method I can find the bottom of the piston housing and the top of the bumpstops. It's just over two and a half inches between them.

Regrettably, I can't both be checking and taking a picture at the same time while laying on the ground under the car. My lift lifts the chassis, which would give us no real information worth noting. If I had one that lifted at the wheels we could check and I would remove the dust boot. But this moment this the best I've got.

Who installed yours? Could there been an issue in the install? If the shock housing was set in correctly, there wouldn't be much in the way of travel.