Reported SCH due to engine design flaw while using CBC?

[Ed_rx7]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

Wow. This website needs to be added to the main post. Very informative.

We have a developed a crank bolt capture plate, which differs from those already available on the market. If your car has shown no issues to date and is running fine, then this is a good first step. This is enough for many vehicles and we provide a 12 month warranty on the part.








I just watched the whole video. They took a part the whole engine and still did not install a keyed crank hub. It goes to show if a keyed crank hub is even necessary or if vendors on this forum is blowing it out of proportion.



Like I said above, no one here is arguing that SCH doesn't exist. We are trying to figure out if CBC is sufficient and so far data has showed there are less SCH (if any) with CBC than with a VTT spline lock.

Also, I know 10 F80/F82 owners and only 1 spun their hub but he was on E85. I have stage 2 BM3 with FBO with stock CH and no SCH. YMMV?



Unless there is concrete evidence and not "I don't know the exact details" about someone with a SCH with CBC, I refuse to believe a spline lock is even necessary.

Why are vendors who sell or install crank hub upgrades so adamant in telling the community how important a keyed crank hub or spline lock? $100 part + $500 in labor vs $700 part + $3000 in labor. Go figure..

Why would anyone have confidence in your product if you advertised your V1 as "broke the rig before slipping?" Yet, we have multiple cases of it slipping.

We created a testing rig using cut off the end of an N54 crank, and a hydraulic pump to simulate the crank spinning on the hub. We used this to see how easily we could slip a stock hub compared to our new design, after about 10-12 revisions we had one that broke the rig before slipping. We went with that design, and have since had it in our shop car without issue spinning high RPM, and making around 900WHP.

I know of two cars with cbc installed and they both spun

[Smee]

No ed you don't because its not on a forum or on Facebook so clearly yours making it up!!!!

Well thats how misterf80m3 will see it lol

[Ed_rx7]

Originally Posted by Smee

No ed you don't because its not on a forum or on Facebook so clearly yours making it up!!!!

Well thats how misterf80m3 will see it lol

Lol... well as it’s been said before... it’s his/her choice... it’s not my engine.

[deeldoo]

Originally Posted by RoadRunner///M

No idea. I'd imagine can read out with ISTA/Rheingold software. Perhaps contact LitchfieldMotors. If they'r prepared to offer 12mth warranty after scanning and fitting CBC, I'd think they'r pretty confident in their analysis.

Contacted litchfield they said they use their ecutek software to get it done.

I believe it encompasses alot more than BM3 i believe.

[Bmwlmr99]

89,000 miles no crank hub fix... you all are being hustled lol.... stage 2 tune , full exhaust, and i race the shit out of it , kick down ,down shit , 40 roll , 50 roll ,60 roll against mustangs, Camaros, hellcats , Porsche...whatever....most reliable car i ever owned... to hell with the crank hub lie

[Chris@VargasTurboTech]

Originally Posted by Bmwlmr99

89,000 miles no crank hub fix... you all are being hustled lol.... stage 2 tune , full exhaust, and i race the shit out of it , kick down ,down shit , 40 roll , 50 roll ,60 roll against mustangs, Camaros, hellcats , Porsche...whatever....most reliable car i ever owned... to hell with the crank hub lie

This is like saying, because I have never gotten cancer, cancer doesn't exist. You guys are falling for the cancer lie! All your friends, and loved ones with a proven cancer diagnosis are being hustled... We spent upwards of 20K just in replacing heads on the N54 where the hub spun and bent all the valves, this is what prompted us to design a fix in the first place. This is BEFORE we even owned an S55 or made a single product for it. It just turned out that the new bolt, and other changes to the S55 made it more prevalent. The issue is real, and we have dealt with it for years. Just because it has not happened to you means next to nothing as far as it being an issue

[cheveux]

Originally Posted by Chris@VargasTurboTech

This is like saying, because I have never gotten cancer, cancer doesn't exist. You guys are falling for the cancer lie! All your friends, and loved ones with a proven cancer diagnosis are being hustled... We spent upwards of 20K just in replacing heads on the N54 where the hub spun and bent all the valves, this is what prompted us to design a fix in the first place. This is BEFORE we even owned an S55 or made a single product for it. It just turned out that the new bolt, and other changes to the S55 made it more prevalent. The issue is real, and we have dealt with it for years. Just because it has not happened to you means next to nothing as far as it being an issue

Bad comparison. There is no medicine to prevent cancer. But there are solutions to prevent sch. For ones its the CBC, for others is the so called "full solution". Bmwlmr99 has CBC, i think. I think he is just saying that there is no evidence that anything more than a CBC is needed. I myself have CBC and honestly I have never seen a failure reported anywhere. If it happens, I will possibly install again a stock hub with more tightness on the central screw and again a VTT CBC OR the VTT V2 hub cause' it seems to be the best, given its price and installation time, but it is not my first option due to the lack of reported cbc failures.

[Bmwlmr99]

no,no no....i don't have anything done to the crank hub, and neither did any of the pro bmw m4 gt4 cars running in the road racing series that I spoke to have any mods to the crank hub either...

[Chris@VargasTurboTech]

Originally Posted by cheveux

Bad comparison. There is no medicine to prevent cancer. But there are solutions to prevent sch. For ones its the CBC, for others is the so called "full solution". Bmwlmr99 has CBC, i think. I think he is just saying that there is no evidence that anything more than a CBC is needed. I myself have CBC and honestly I have never seen a failure reported anywhere. If it happens, I will possibly install again a stock hub with more tightness on the central screw and again a VTT CBC OR the VTT V2 hub cause' it seems to be the best, given its price and installation time, but it is not my first option due to the lack of reported cbc failures.

What does medicine have to do with anything? Simply stating, just because you have not had something happen to you does mean it does not exist when it is happening to people all around you? Trying to figure out what medicine has to do with anything in that scenario? People just want to disagree about anything. Sure the crank hub issue doesn't exist. Its an awesome design from the factory, carry on guys...

[cheveux]

Originally Posted by Chris@VargasTurboTech

What does medicine have to do with anything? Simply stating, just because you have not had something happen to you does mean it does not exist when it is happening to people all around you? Trying to figure out what medicine has to do with anything in that scenario? People just want to disagree about anything. Sure the crank hub issue doesn't exist. Its an awesome design from the factory, carry on guys...

What I was trying to say is that diseases are "cured" when they happen. You sell the need to install a crank hub fix "before the disease", as if it were a case of life or death of the engine without evidence of its real need when "just" a cbc has worked so far for most users. just that

But I still think your product is excellent

[SE7EN335]

I personally know of 3 people who have done stage 2 93 octane and beat on it for years and then switch to custom e85 tune and their crank hub spun within 3 months. Coincidence? I think not

[MadM2C]

Originally Posted by SE7EN335

I personally know of 3 people who have done stage 2 93 octane and beat on it for years and then switch to custom e85 tune and their crank hub spun within 3 months. Coincidence? I think not

Lol I don’t get why this is so hard to grasp.

NOBODY HERE is arguing that spun crank hubs happen on e85, that is definitely a possibility. The point a few of us are trying to make is we haven’t seen any documented cases of them failing with just a CBC.

Hell the fastest stock turbo/ stock motor S55 60-130 currently is a guy tuned by f80paul and all he has is a CBC with no issues...

[E92inSG]

let me put this thread to rest once and for all!

The CBC fix alone will 100% guarantee you will never get a spun crank hub even at 2,000whp.


But if you do spin your hub while CBC-ed only, too bad!!

[MR RIZK]

The prophet has spoken..

[E92inSG]

Haha sorry. Just trying to put an end to this merry go round Lol

OP: have there been SPUN HUB on CBC
VTT: yes
OP: show me
VTT: there have been
OP: Show me
VTT: We have seen
OP: SHOW ME
VTT: They are out there
OP: no they aren’t
VTT: they are
OP: show me.

😂



Just get the CBC done and call it a day, that’s what I did.

[Bmwlmr99]

I have never ran a e85 tune, my advice would be to stay away from them , injector issues and almost all crank hub failures are related to aggressive e85 timing advance etc associated with the e85 hp gain....

[MR RIZK]

E92inSG don't apologise to me I only have a CBC installed.. maybe I should have ended it with a smiley face

[MadM2C]

Originally Posted by E92inSG

Haha sorry. Just trying to put an end to this merry go round Lol

OP: have there been SPUN HUB on CBC
VTT: yes
OP: show me
VTT: there have been
OP: Show me
VTT: We have seen
OP: SHOW ME
VTT: They are out there
OP: no they aren’t
VTT: they are
OP: show me.

😂



Just get the CBC done and call it a day, that’s what I did.

But my dogs friends sisters cousin spun his crank hub...

[Beemerm3]

I would get a cbc for the n55 platform too.

[Singham14]

I recently learned about the crank hub issue. I have a 2015 M4 with an intake, midpipe and muffler. I plan on possibly doing stage 1 MHD flash or BM3 flash at most. Do you guys think the crank bolt capture would be a good solution? Do I even need to worry? Shops are recommending the key crank hub but i am not sure if i want to get that done.

[E92inSG]

But has anyone actually spun a Hub while only using a CBC?

[TopJimmy]

Hubs have spun using just CBC. As long as the bolt was under torqued before the CBC was applied then the capture added no protection to overpowering the friction washer. The capture would still keep the bolt from moving any more than it had. If the capture is applied to a properly torqued bolt then you have protection against bolt movement but you can still "overpower" the friction washer with super heavy tunes (not sure exact HP/TQ).

Now to OP's question, a Stage 1 is unlikely to slip a hub, especially on a M car that's been driven 5 years (probably hard at some time). It's always a possibility... Its usually the guys running Stg2 E85 where hub slip can become an issue. With aftermarket turbos and or Meth even more so.