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      12-05-2018, 02:11 PM   #23
alex2364
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DDD31 View Post
Since BMW took those away, I think they should include the European rear fog light standard on U.S. cars.
Uh no, I hate people that leaves their rear fog on at night. Makes me want to leave my high beams on behind them.
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      12-05-2018, 02:17 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trebla193 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
I code them back on only for the legal checkup (MOT/TUV) every 2 years, or when it's extremly snowy, other than that totally useless feature.
So out of curiosity, how do you know if they are working? Is there a button or place to press to make the headlight washers come on? I have been of the belief that they came on when I push or pulled the stalk to clean the windshield.

I had the 02, 04, 06 , and 09 X5 and don't know if I ever pushed a button to change their state....

Thanks
they are activated every "x" times you pull the stalk to wash your windshield, you can code the duration, how many times they will come out and how many times you have to pull the stalk to activate them.

I simply coded them out, don't see any positive sides to having them on..
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      12-05-2018, 02:56 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
don't see any positive sides to having them
on..
What'ya mean, it keeps your headlights clean.
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      12-05-2018, 03:26 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
don't see any positive sides to having them
on..
What'ya mean, it keeps your headlights clean.
I turn them on only when it snows, that's actually the only situation when they're useful, when it rains they are just wasting washer fluid, let's be honest.
Thanks to Carly it' a matter of minutes.

The only reason they are obligatory with xenon headlights (at least in the EU, my C6 has xenons and no headlight washing system) is that xenons are not emitting that much heat as normal halogens, therefore snow and ice doesn't melt when in contact with the headlights and distorts the light emission..
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      12-05-2018, 04:08 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by alex2364 View Post
I hate people that leaves their rear fog on at night. Makes me want to leave my high beams on behind them.
I do use my high beam on them when I can. They apparently want me to see their rear end better. High beam does contribute! Rear fog light usage in clear weather (regardless day or night) is explicitly prohibited by local traffic laws. It's just I have to mind not blinding other drivers (oncoming in particular). That makes it tricky.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal View Post
it keeps your headlights clean.
Exactly! I did not want them but I do appreciate them. I can even control how frequently they work by not engaging the windshield washing and wipers simultaneously (that's pulling the lever only slightly to wash and pressing it down after release to wipe). They aren't as effective as wiping, of course, but much better than nothing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
I turn them on only when it snows, that's actually the only situation when they're useful
Why? Snow can become dirt (then it's "when it's dirty" again) but by itself it's so clean.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
when it rains they are just wasting washer fluid, let's be honest.
Oh, yes! And so is washing the windscreen (that's how you get them engaged). I never do that when it rains.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
The only reason they are obligatory with xenon headlights (at least in the EU, my C6 has xenons and no headlight washing system) is that xenons are not emitting that much heat as normal halogens, therefore snow and ice doesn't melt when in contact with the headlights and distorts the light emission..
AFAIK, Xenon light is vulnerable to dust affecting light focusing/distribution and it's brightness leads to blinding effect. I read that somewhere on the Internet. (I'm lazy to search for a confirmation link, sorry. )
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      12-05-2018, 04:17 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
they are activated every "x" times you pull the stalk to wash your windshield, you can code the duration, how many times they will come out and how many times you have to pull the stalk to activate them.

I simply coded them out, don't see any positive sides to having them on..
And you live in germany?!?
(according to your profile)

Quote:
The only reason they are obligatory with xenon headlights (at least in the EU, my C6 has xenons and no headlight washing system) is that xenons are not emitting that much heat as normal halogens, therefore snow and ice doesn't melt when in contact with the headlights and distorts the light emission..
Not true, read my previous post including the links.
Its a dirt issue (where the dirt diffreacts the light). The ruleset even specifies a special mixture / concoction that mimics this which contains silica sand, beechwood pulp with a certain particle size and a certain sodium salt (to mimic dried in salt chrystals coming from roadspray when roadsalt is distributed.
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      12-05-2018, 04:20 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuidoK View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
they are activated every "x" times you pull the stalk to wash your windshield, you can code the duration, how many times they will come out and how many times you have to pull the stalk to activate them.

I simply coded them out, don't see any positive sides to having them on..
And you live in germany?!?
(according to your profile)
Yes, in Munich, how is that relevant?
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      12-05-2018, 04:25 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
Yes, in Munich, how is that relevant?
How do you do this with TüV/HU?
Because this is I think a parameter that is checked?
You have a 24 month interval I believe?
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      12-05-2018, 04:30 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuidoK View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
Yes, in Munich, how is that relevant?
How do you do this with TüV/HU?
Because this is I think a parameter that is checked?
As I wrote before, I turn them on for the TÜV and when it snows, with the Carly app it's done in 2 minutes.

My car passes the TÜV without DPF/EGR even though it should raise a 100 red flags, everything is doable even in Germany, they are human and like a few extra € just like any other guy
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      12-05-2018, 04:47 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
As I wrote before, I turn them on for the TÜV and when it snows, with the Carly app it's done in 2 minutes.
ah I missed that.

as far as offering a few euro's thats the same here (NL) but most are very reluctant for that, as they get periodic checks from the ministery, and I think 2 or 3 fails or so and you loose your licence..
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      12-05-2018, 04:50 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuidoK View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechicken View Post
As I wrote before, I turn them on for the TÜV and when it snows, with the Carly app it's done in 2 minutes.
ah I missed that.

as far as offering a few euro's thats the same here (NL) but most are very reluctant for that, as they get periodic checks from the ministery, and I think 2 or 3 fails or so and you loose your licence..
I am not literally giving them money, but I send my mechanic to the TÜV with my car, they all know each other and are willing to turn a blind eye for those minor things..
Who pays beers in the Biergarten after work it's another thing
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      12-05-2018, 05:03 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemonchicken View Post
I’ve used mine twice. Once to see what they do. The second time was to make sure they were still working.
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      12-05-2018, 11:20 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by RichM50d View Post
We used to do that at college, spraying all the girls as they walked up the hill!
In today's era you'd be looking at 25-life
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      12-06-2018, 09:16 AM   #36
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I have never missed them and will not miss them should I buy one of the newer BMW models. Usually I have them turned off via coding on both of my cars and RE-enable them when the car is due for the official legal inspection
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      12-11-2018, 11:22 AM   #37
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needless to say, the fuckers are coded ON..
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      12-11-2018, 11:27 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMidnightNarwhal View Post
What'ya mean, it keeps your headlights clean.
Never had a car with this option; call me crazy, but I wish I did!
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      12-20-2018, 09:12 PM   #39
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I genuinely don't understand how someone can grasp the concept of a windshield washer system, yet fail to grasp the concept of a headlamp washer system. It's the same concept.

The real value is when driving on wet salty roads after a snow storm. You can immediately see the improvement of illuminating the road when driving in the dark in these conditions.

If you live in Florida or someplace it never snows, then I see the logic in skipping this option... But that's why BMW grouped them as part of the Cold Weather Package.
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      12-23-2018, 12:13 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuidoK View Post
The point of headlight washers is to keep the headlights clean in order to reduce glare/diffraction of light in unwanted directions. It has nothing to do with snow, but with dirt.
LED headlights are not required to have washers as the total light output of these LED's is below a certain value (2000 lumen). Xenon bulbs go above that. (and tungsten obviously also below that).
That rule still stands and hasn't changed. (So if a car should have LED lights with an output above 2000 lumen, it would require the washers)
This is btw an european rule; afaik in the US, the washers aren't required at all.

European ruleset:
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-cont...1X1206%2803%29

Ruleset for the washers itself:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...6KbYukl7zbPsPP
The regulations changed in Oct 2017.

It was:


Vehicles without AFS, HID Light Source, output >2000lm = Cleaning System and Self Leveling Beam Inclination System.

Vehicles Without AFS, Solid State (LED), output <2000lm = Self Leveling Beam Inclination System

Vehicles Without AFS, Solid State (LED), output >2000lm = Self Leveling Beam Inclination System + Headlamp Cleaning System

Vehicles with AFSi (Dual Dynamic Self Leveling Beam Inclination Systems), HID or Solid State Lighting (>2000lm) = Cleaning System no longer Required.
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      12-23-2018, 01:02 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
The regulations changed in Oct 2017.
Do you mean the US regulations or the EU regulations?
My links/post regards the EU regulations, and are in force.
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Last edited by GuidoK; 12-23-2018 at 01:10 PM..
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      12-23-2018, 01:13 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuidoK View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
The regulations changed in Oct 2017.
Do you mean the US regulations or the EU regulations?
My links/post regards the EU regulations.
UN (formerly ECE/UNECE) GTR. Was under IWC GRE alternative Mandate that was extended twice.

Reason for these changes are:

Improvement in Halogen bulbs providing performance equal to or greater than HID

Phase out of HID

Improvement in lens coatings to minimize contamination buildup

Difficulty managing heavy De-Icing situations with Solid State lighting. Headlamp Cleaning system often causes thick ice buildup when used in cold weather.
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      12-23-2018, 01:29 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by SHoTTa35 View Post
They are only required for Xenon lamps, for LEDs they are not included.
I don't know about that. My '16 M3 with LED's has headlight washers
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      12-23-2018, 01:30 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
UN (formerly ECE/UNECE) GTR. Was under IWC GRE alternative Mandate that was extended twice.
Got a link?
My link is to the official EU law page and shows that it my link is still in force...

As far as what I can read in "ECE/TRANS/WP.29/GRE/78 Report of the Working Party on Lighting and Light-Signalling on its seventy-eighth session (24-27 October 2017)" There is no mention of anything of that:
https://www.unece.org/fileadmin/DAM/...29-GRE-78e.pdf

And in ECE/TRANS/WP.29/GRE/79 - Report of the Working Party on Lighting and Light-Signalling on its seventy-ninth session (24-27 April 2018) (the following harmonisation session) there is only some text improvement and paragraph changes, but no real rule changes...
https://www.unece.org/fileadmin/DAM/...29-GRE-79e.pdf

Complete report list:
https://www.unece.org/trans/main/wp2...re/grerep.html
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Last edited by GuidoK; 12-23-2018 at 03:08 PM..
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