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01-29-2014, 12:46 PM | #221 |
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I drove the M5 a few times (my brother owns one) and the car felt great, the interior is way above the quality of my GTR (heck my e90's interior is better than the interior of my GTR). The GTR is being replaced with the new M3, I almost pulled the trigger on the M5. The M5 being a crappy car talk is just non sense, every car maker puts out a few lemons it doesnt make it a bad car or car maker.
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01-29-2014, 07:18 PM | #222 | |
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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01-29-2014, 07:20 PM | #223 | |
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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01-29-2014, 08:28 PM | #224 |
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Despite the added performance and technological benefits, I'd much rather have a pristine or brand new E60 ///M5 over the F10. I think, "Sexy!!!" when I see the E60. I don't feel the same way about the F10, but I do recognize that it is a beast of a car.
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01-29-2014, 08:36 PM | #225 | ||
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I've personally never put the two cars in the same category--the M3 has been "top dog" for the small (relative, especially as the years have passed) sporty--with some luxury--coupe, and the M5 has been "top dog" for the full-sized luxury--with power and good handling--sedan. |
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01-29-2014, 08:40 PM | #226 | |
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01-29-2014, 09:04 PM | #227 | ||
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I just moved to the Seattle area, but so far the daily drive car scene has been a little disappointing. Nearly every other car is a Subaru Outback (a good car I'm sure, but not terribly exciting). On the bright side, I have three tracks within an hour from my house. EDIT: ...and wow, the conversation here has really drifted off topic, haha. |
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01-30-2014, 05:42 PM | #228 |
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I'm not sure where this "underrated" pipe-dream is coming from.
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01-30-2014, 05:47 PM | #229 |
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Pipe dream? A good percentage of BMW's turbocharged cars are underrated (..well, at least the ones that matter). Hell, it's no secret. Where have you been? In fact, this phenomenon of underrating turbocharged engines goes as far back as I can remember (..Supras, 300ZX's, Cosworth Escorts, etc.).
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01-30-2014, 05:53 PM | #230 |
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LOL Under a rock. "Pipe dream" hahaha
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01-30-2014, 11:31 PM | #231 | ||
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01-30-2014, 11:50 PM | #232 |
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01-31-2014, 01:35 AM | #233 | |
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01-31-2014, 03:06 AM | #234 | |
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Several tests of F1x M5/6 have commented in comparison tests that the way the M5/6 pulls at higher speeds is well beyond what a 560hp car should manage. Especially since they compare it with other 560/585hp cars... |
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01-31-2014, 07:48 AM | #235 |
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How should the term "shocking capabilities" be interpreted?
Shocking because of the already-listed HP & torque numbers? Or, because the power delivery exceeds expectations somehow? |
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01-31-2014, 08:22 AM | #236 |
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I finally drove an M5 a few times now and I can say that it's an amazing car from an interior perspective. It's just unreal. If the new M3 can be 30% of the M5 from an interior perspective, it'll be an amazing car. There is just so much difference between a 335i (F30) and an M5 right now. I know M3 is closing that gap, but how much is the question.
From a performance perspective the story is different. The car has torque at all levels. No turbo lag at all (I'm not sure this is because it was a 575 hp monster or the improved turbos). You touch the throttle slightly at 1200 rpm, and you get the power under your foot right there. Amazing feeling. That being said, when you WOT, it really does not feel so fast. Or in other words, it doesn't sound "as scary" as my M3. In my M3, when I go WOT from 20 mph to 90 mph, you get this sheer adrenalin being pumped into your veins. M3 is a lot less forgiving car. You have to be very careful. The road noise, steering feedback, it's a lot more raw, direct. M5 is what it should be, it's executive. It absorbs the road noise so well. The steering feedback is there, but it's a lot more forgiving. The torque though, believe it or not, it just does not feel like 500+ lb/ft, it doesn't. And I don't know if it's because the torque starts at 1200 rpm or not vs it builds gradually in the M3 (S65), the M3 punches you back more to your seat. With M5, you are like "meh, I'm doing 90 mph", with M3, it's more like "holy crap, I'm doing 90 mph", it's hard to explain. Naturally aspirated engines are a bit more rewarding and turbo is a lot easier to get it up there at fast levels. I'm not sure if I did a good job explaining, I drove my M3 and the M5, back to back, exactly 4 times and this is my feedback. Oh and the active sound in M5 actually sounds pretty good. It's done very elegantly, you don't really feel it. I quite liked it. |
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01-31-2014, 08:37 AM | #237 | |
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01-31-2014, 08:45 AM | #238 | |
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01-31-2014, 09:33 AM | #239 | |
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There's a certain amount of dramatic tension in the waiting. A naturally aspirated engine that revs to over 8,000 RPM provides some unique sensory feedback. Once you pass the 6,500 RPM mark, you're in to territory that few people experience on a regular basis. The sound of an S65 as it approaches its 8400 RPM redline contributes to the excitement of driving the car. With engines like the S63tu, or any other production turbocharged engine for that matter, the drama occurs quickly. Have a look at the difference in the dyno plot between a turbocharged engine and a high-revving naturally aspirated engine. The turbocharged car usually has a torque swell early in the RPM range, which tapers off as you reach the upper RPM range. A naturally aspirated engine like the S65 has a torque curve that is flat as a pancake throughout the RPM range and extends that flatness much higher. When you experience maximum acceleration in an M3, you anticipate the next shift, but you have to wait, and wait, and wait for the redline to show up. In a turbocharged car like the M5, the torque swells early, then tapers off as you reach higher RPM. I've developed an appreciation for both experiences, but I've definitely noticed that some people are more attached to one or the other. Some people are hooked the first time they experience the early torque delivery of a turbo, while others really like the drama of a high revving engine.
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01-31-2014, 10:10 AM | #240 | |
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If you get an F80 M3 with the (likely relatively cheap according to the Canadian price guide) full leather, it will be a very nice place to be. Not M5, and I won't say "not far off", but it's a far cry from the base F30 3 series. The seats alone are a huge upgrade. The Merino blows away the Dakota. The gauges are much, much nicer. The DCT shifter elevates the center console. The CF trim is really sharp. Etc. |
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01-31-2014, 10:33 AM | #241 | |
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01-31-2014, 10:40 AM | #242 | ||
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One of the "issues" with the F10 gen 5-series is that you are slightly detached from the driving experience, both compared with the E60, but not least compared with a 3-series. I suppose (hope) that the F8x M's will have a more raw, visceral drivers experience than the F10 M5 has (even though my drives in the F1x gen M5/6 have been enjoyable, especially the Manhart MH5 S with 700+ hp on the Autobahn ) This is how the F1 drivers comment on the power delivery characteristics of their new Turbo V6 engines: Quote:
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