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      02-18-2015, 06:40 PM   #67
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I kinda screwed up ... I heard clarkson didn't like it so I drove it to the dump. Prolly shouldn't have done that before I watched the review.

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      02-18-2015, 06:57 PM   #68
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Yup, years from now, old Alex will be here in his 2015 M4 talking about how much better it is while we are in the next gen.
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      02-18-2015, 07:37 PM   #69
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"the car has been received very well and the efforts of a few naysayers to say otherwise should not be effective."

And they will not if they are few. It doesn't work that way when the car is truly good and loved by the large majority. An excellent car needs no one to defend it only bad cars do.
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      02-18-2015, 07:38 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
I kinda screwed up ... I heard clarkson didn't like it so I drove it to the dump. Prolly shouldn't have done that before I watched the review.

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      02-18-2015, 07:46 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
"the car has been received very well and the efforts of a few naysayers to say otherwise should not be effective."

And they will not if they are few. It doesn't work that way when the car is truly good and loved by the large majority. An excellent car needs no one to defend it only bad cars do.
That is the way it should work, but sometimes people who do not really know pick up and repeat something as 'common knowledge' often enough that it becomes true (whether or not it is) and then it becomes a repetitive self-fulfilling prophecy.

I really don't worry that, in the long run, this car will be seen as anything other than great but, as I said to GG, the point of this thread was originally and largely just for my own use/amusement/support so I could tell people to shut up (with an easy reference point for authority). If it helps convince those who are genuinely on the fence or unsure of what to think has been said about this car (some people do care before they buy....) then, great, happy to create a reference point for them too.
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      02-19-2015, 12:00 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak

...as I said to GG, the point of this thread was originally and largely just for my own use/amusement/support so I could tell people to shut up (with an easy reference point for authority).
So now you're being honnest of the fact that you've made a mission for yourself to shut everybody that dissagree with your view of the F8x, is'nt that what we call an internet bully!?
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      02-19-2015, 12:22 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex07M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak

...as I said to GG, the point of this thread was originally and largely just for my own use/amusement/support so I could tell people to shut up (with an easy reference point for authority).
So now you're being honnest of the fact that you've made a mission for yourself to shut everybody that dissagree with your view of the F8x, is'nt that what we call an internet bully!?
Thanks for coming out Alex. As I said it was to have facts to argue with so when people like you showed up without any i could shut them down. Facts being a foreign concept in your universe.

You have, however, helped prove my point. So thanks for that!

Dont you have an exam to study for?
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      02-19-2015, 12:42 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex07M3
Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak

...as I said to GG, the point of this thread was originally and largely just for my own use/amusement/support so I could tell people to shut up (with an easy reference point for authority).
So now you're being honnest of the fact that you've made a mission for yourself to shut everybody that dissagree with your view of the F8x, is'nt that what we call an internet bully!?
Thanks for coming out Alex. As I said it was to have facts to argue with so when people like you showed up without any i could shut them down. Facts being a foreign concept in your universe.

You have, however, helped prove my point. So thanks for that!

Dont you have an exam to study for?
Yeah sure, keep up with the good work budy, you're saving the F8x reputation one hit at a time!

lol
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      02-19-2015, 10:26 AM   #75
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Originally Posted by Alex07M3 View Post
Yeah sure, keep up with the good work budy, you're saving the F8x reputation from one troll at a time!

lol
Fixed it for you.

Now, lets have Mr Khil play us out with your theme song...

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      03-06-2015, 08:31 AM   #76
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Was anyone able to find an online version of the Top Gear March Issue RCF vs M4 article yet?
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      03-06-2015, 09:55 AM   #77
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here's an other comparo for your data base

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      03-06-2015, 11:38 AM   #78
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You've posted that same review 3 times, akin to spamming. The Cayman is clearly a better track car than 99.9% of vehicles on the road.

None of it changes the fact the F80 remains fastest production sedan in the history of the Nurburging. Handles and grips like a no 4-door ever before. M really stepped up their game finally lowering the increasingly piggy weight, while radically improving the chassis and brakes.

Any genuine enthusiast is thankful for it.
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      03-06-2015, 12:12 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl L
You've posted that same review 3 times, akin to spamming. The Cayman is clearly a better track car than 99.9% of vehicles on the road.

None of it changes the fact the F80 remains fastest production sedan in the history of the Nurburging. Handles and grips like a no 4-door ever before. M really stepped up their game finally lowering the increasingly piggy weight, while radically improving the chassis and brakes.

Any genuine enthusiast is thankful for it.
I would have though that after the second time I posted it, it would have ended up here, but Myzmak probably have'nt seened it!
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      03-06-2015, 12:59 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl L View Post
You've posted that same review 3 times, akin to spamming. The Cayman is clearly a better track car than 99.9% of vehicles on the road.

None of it changes the fact the F80 remains fastest production sedan in the history of the Nurburging. Handles and grips like a no 4-door ever before. M really stepped up their game finally lowering the increasingly piggy weight, while radically improving the chassis and brakes.

Any genuine enthusiast is thankful for it.
Actually, the Panamera turbo S was and still is the fastest production sedan in the history of the Nurburgring and handles, grips, brakes, and steers like no sedan in history ever has all while being over 4600 lbs. In 2012 it lapped in 7:52 in HvS hands. It also clocked a 1:12.3 on Hockenheim, which are 2 seconds, and .5 seconds faster than the M3/4 clocked 3 years later. So while the M3 is not far off, it isnt the fastest.

Certainly the revised turbo S is even faster...my guess mid to high 7:4x.

Even the 2015 Cayenne turbo S has clocked a sub 8 min lap.

BTW - I pick up my 2015 M3 tomorrow.
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      03-06-2015, 03:03 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Revcrazy View Post
Actually, the Panamera turbo S was and still is the fastest production sedan in the history of the Nurburgring and handles, grips, brakes, and steers like no sedan in history ever has all while being over 4600 lbs. In 2012 it lapped in 7:52 in HvS hands. It also clocked a 1:12.3 on Hockenheim, which are 2 seconds, and .5 seconds faster than the M3/4 clocked 3 years later. So while the M3 is not far off, it isnt the fastest.

Certainly the revised turbo S is even faster...my guess mid to high 7:4x.

Even the 2015 Cayenne turbo S has clocked a sub 8 min lap.

BTW - I pick up my 2015 M3 tomorrow.
didn't the M3 clock a 7:51 or 7:52 in the Sport Auto test? as you know, that test is a far cry from factory drivers clocking a hot lap. Sport Auto drivers don't get to test in ideal conditions, nor do they get any significant time learning the car beforehand.

IMO, that's a win for the M. the Turbo S is a much more powerful car with a starting price that is 3 times higher than the M. while it's an impressive (and very ugly) beast, I'm not sure how relevant it is to compare it to the M3. the better comparison is to an M5, which is probably 99% as fast and luxurious as the Porsche, for about half the price and sans the ugliness. but hey, some people want the Porsche badge, and who am I to tell them how to spend their dollars.
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      03-06-2015, 03:10 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brosef View Post
didn't the M3 clock a 7:51 or 7:52 in the Sport Auto test? as you know, that test is a far cry from factory drivers clocking a hot lap. Sport Auto drivers don't get to test in ideal conditions, nor do they get any significant time learning the car beforehand.

IMO, that's a win for the M. the Turbo S is a much more powerful car with a starting price that is 3 times higher than the M. while it's an impressive (and very ugly) beast, I'm not sure how relevant it is to compare it to the M3. the better comparison is to an M5, which is probably 99% as fast and luxurious as the Porsche, for about half the price and sans the ugliness. but hey, some people want the Porsche badge, and who am I to tell them how to spend their dollars.
The M3/4 clocked a 7:52 (old post was off by 2 sec) and 1:12.8 by Sport Auto...so apples to apples with the turbo S as both were Sport Auto.

My point was only that the fastest, best sedan in history is the Panamera Turbo S. I like the styling myself, it sounds great and drives like nothing else, and interior/quality-wise, no M5 is even in the same general vicinity.

The Panamera wasnt made to be a track tool like the M3/4. It was meant to be a super luxurious car that is the best blend of luxury and sportiness. A driver's sedan the M5 no longer is. The fact that a 4600+ lb large sedan is beating a car that weighs over 1000 lbs less is very telling, especially if you consider it did that time over 3 years ago, the new one is likely a few seconds faster, and it will be replaced with a new generation soon.

Wasnt to take anything away from the M3, just that it was never the fastest sedan or any type of record holder in that regard.
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      03-06-2015, 04:09 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrtyJrze View Post
Was anyone able to find an online version of the Top Gear March Issue RCF vs M4 article yet?
Read it on iPad app a flight today. M4 won. Will have to figure a good way to scan it in at some point.
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      03-06-2015, 04:38 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Revcrazy View Post
The M3/4 clocked a 7:52 (old post was off by 2 sec) and 1:12.8 by Sport Auto...so apples to apples with the turbo S as both were Sport Auto.

My point was only that the fastest, best sedan in history is the Panamera Turbo S. I like the styling myself, it sounds great and drives like nothing else, and interior/quality-wise, no M5 is even in the same general vicinity.

The Panamera wasnt made to be a track tool like the M3/4. It was meant to be a super luxurious car that is the best blend of luxury and sportiness. A driver's sedan the M5 no longer is. The fact that a 4600+ lb large sedan is beating a car that weighs over 1000 lbs less is very telling, especially if you consider it did that time over 3 years ago, the new one is likely a few seconds faster, and it will be replaced with a new generation soon.

Wasnt to take anything away from the M3, just that it was never the fastest sedan or any type of record holder in that regard.
My only error was in quoting the F80 rather than the F82, but per BMW, they're performance is identical. Now, I will say that if you're going to correct someone you need to be correct and backup your claims. Per this link, http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife.html, the M4 went around in 7.52.00 and the Panamera Turbo S in 7.52.20. May be a hair's width, but faster is faster. Re the PTTS being three years older, well it's also three times the price. But both of things are moot as the F8x clocked a faster lap with Horst van Saurma at the wheel in each car.

You always compare the performance of Porsche's two seaters to the M3, so comparing the PTTS to the M3 is more than fair. When the next Panamera comes out the M3 Comp package will be out and this cycle will repeat ad nauseam but, as of now, faster is faster.

Last edited by Carl L; 03-06-2015 at 06:22 PM.. Reason: Added "S" to PTT.
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      03-06-2015, 06:19 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl L View Post
My only error was in quoting the F80 rather than the F82, but per BMW, they're performance is identical. Now, I will say that if you're going to correct someone you need to be correct and backup your claims. Per this link, http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife.html, the M4 went around in 7.52.00 and the Panamera Turbo S in 7.52.20. May be a hair's width, but faster is faster. Re the PTT being three years older, well it's also three times the price. But both of things are moot as the F8x clocked a faster lap with Horst van Saurma at the wheel in each car.

You always compare the performance of Porsche's two seaters to the M3, so comparing the PTT to the M3 is more than fair. When the next Panamera comes out the M3 Comp package will be out and this cycle will repeat ad nauseam but, as of now, faster is faster.
boom, roasted
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      03-16-2015, 05:06 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl L View Post
My only error was in quoting the F80 rather than the F82, but per BMW, they're performance is identical. Now, I will say that if you're going to correct someone you need to be correct and backup your claims. Per this link, http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife.html, the M4 went around in 7.52.00 and the Panamera Turbo S in 7.52.20. May be a hair's width, but faster is faster. Re the PTTS being three years older, well it's also three times the price. But both of things are moot as the F8x clocked a faster lap with Horst van Saurma at the wheel in each car.

You always compare the performance of Porsche's two seaters to the M3, so comparing the PTTS to the M3 is more than fair. When the next Panamera comes out the M3 Comp package will be out and this cycle will repeat ad nauseam but, as of now, faster is faster.
So wait...the F80 is the quickest Sedan around the ring...ever?
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      03-16-2015, 06:28 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl L View Post
My only error was in quoting the F80 rather than the F82, but per BMW, they're performance is identical. Now, I will say that if you're going to correct someone you need to be correct and backup your claims. Per this link, http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife.html, the M4 went around in 7.52.00 and the Panamera Turbo S in 7.52.20. May be a hair's width, but faster is faster. Re the PTTS being three years older, well it's also three times the price. But both of things are moot as the F8x clocked a faster lap with Horst van Saurma at the wheel in each car.

You always compare the performance of Porsche's two seaters to the M3, so comparing the PTTS to the M3 is more than fair. When the next Panamera comes out the M3 Comp package will be out and this cycle will repeat ad nauseam but, as of now, faster is faster.
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So wait...the F80 is the quickest Sedan around the ring...ever?


89. BMW M5 7:52.00 157 '05 507 / 1848 Hans-Joachim Stuck

91. BMW M4 7:52.00 157 '14 431 / 1497 Horst von Saurma


Per the same link, the E60 M5 posted a 7:52 ten years ago.
The F80 has yet to post a lap time. Yes, the performance of the F82 is claimed to be identical to the F80 on paper, so its safe to say times should be similar, but until the F80 sets a time, we can only assume.
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      03-16-2015, 07:58 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSanto View Post
So wait...the F80 is the quickest Sedan around the ring...ever?
Correct. That is of course for stock production sedans on showroom rubber. The aforementioned E60 M5 only ran 8.13 in stock form (Sport Auto test, Horst Von Saurma). The time cited by the poster above was for a modded car with Cup rubber.

I tracked my E60 once. The brakes wilted and she leaned like a 4,000lb bear around the curves but it was a great engine to wring out. Kinda miss that car.
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