proTUNING Freaks
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   BMW M3 and BMW M4 Forum > BMW F80 M3 / F82 M4 Forum > M3/M4 versus...

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      08-22-2019, 05:59 PM   #23
myzmak
Advocatus Douchebagus. Sex Marxist.
myzmak's Avatar
Canada
2232
Rep
3,368
Posts

Drives: Lucy.
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Canada

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2015 F80 M3  [5.00]
2013 MB E350 Wagon  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcades View Post
You can look at the price of the RS5 or the sales numbers on the F90 M5 as a good indicator of how this will end up already.

Everyone can say the RS5 or the M5 are far more practical but both of these cars sell in rather limited numbers already. Then you add in the wagon part of the RS6 Avant, which lets be honest, US buyers don't like wagons. I don't see this going well sales wise.

This is another one of those, "buyers" clamoring for this Avant but the amount of people actually going to end up buying it will be extremely little. You can get the Benz E63 AMG Wagon and yet, how many do you see on the road? Very, VERY little.

With how Audi prices cars, my educated guess is, this will easily hit 140k with options. WHich is what I have been saying, if Audi wants to do this correctly, they SHOULD do it with the RS4, judge the market first before they do the RS6 Avant. That is the more practical route, not this bring RS6 first, probably fail and not do this again.
I can't believe you didn't flag this post for me.

You and minn19 know my deep and undying power wagon love.
__________________
Drivin' Lucy
Appreciate 2
minn197550.50
Arcades2811.00

      08-22-2019, 06:05 PM   #24
minn19
Major General
minn19's Avatar
United_States
7551
Rep
7,812
Posts

Drives: 19 F150, 20 GLI, 20 C63S, 212S
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Minnesota

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak View Post
I can't believe you didn't flag this post for me.

You and minn19 know my deep and undying power wagon love.
I honestly was going to and I ended up having a crazy work/personal week. Not Lups crazy, but still. You know how it goes Myz, soccer ended Tuesday and hockey starts tonight.

I canít believe Iím saying this, but it looks bad ass. Please whoever above (or below) forgive me for saying that about a station wagon.
Appreciate 1
myzmak2232.00

      08-22-2019, 07:28 PM   #25
nicknaz
Lieutenant General
nicknaz's Avatar
United_States
3105
Rep
10,459
Posts

Drives: 6TT, model 3P, SM, F31 330
Join Date: May 2008
Location: NorCal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak View Post
I can't believe you didn't flag this post for me.

You and minn19 know my deep and undying power wagon love.
So which wagon do you have now?

Did you ever have a 6MT CTSV wagon? I was so sad that Enthusiast Internet didnít buy those up by the railcar load and reverse the Perfomance SUV trend j to Performance 6MT wagon trend
Appreciate 1
myzmak2232.00

      08-22-2019, 07:44 PM   #26
Arcades
Lup's Kid
Arcades's Avatar
Taiwan
2811
Rep
3,921
Posts

Drives: 18' Grigio Medio F80
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Los Angeles

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak View Post
I can't believe you didn't flag this post for me.

You and minn19 know my deep and undying power wagon love.
Quote:
Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
I honestly was going to and I ended up having a crazy work/personal week. Not Lups crazy, but still. You know how it goes Myz, soccer ended Tuesday and hockey starts tonight.

I canít believe Iím saying this, but it looks bad ass. Please whoever above (or below) forgive me for saying that about a station wagon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz View Post
So which wagon do you have now?

Did you ever have a 6MT CTSV wagon? I was so sad that Enthusiast Internet didnít buy those up by the railcar load and reverse the Perfomance SUV trend j to Performance 6MT wagon trend
I thought you would know!

This RS6 Avant is very pretty. Definitely more of a looker than the current Benz E63S AMG. I can't see myself with wagons though no matter how much I secretly want one. I don't mind the new Panamera but... no.
__________________
'18 Grigio Medio/Nutmeg BMW F80 M3 Competition "Stella" // '17 Mahogany Metallic/Black Porsche Macan S "Gisele"
2021 Porsche Macan GTS On Order

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lups View Post
You're making babies for me!
Appreciate 2
minn197550.50
myzmak2232.00

      08-22-2019, 08:28 PM   #27
GERMAN M3
Captain
GERMAN M3's Avatar
Germany
2132
Rep
908
Posts

Drives: 2017 MG M3
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Somewhere

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2017 M3  [0.00]
2015 BMW M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kief View Post
Exactly, well said!
I am very much interested in the RS6 Avant as a replacement to my wife's X5M, but having dug a little deeper, this thing is going to cost crazy cash! AudiNA is setting this thing up to fail given the likely price, and America's aversion to wagons. It would have been much wiser to bring over the RS4 Avant at a relatively less expensive entry fee.
Totally agree Kief!! I think the RS6 will be out of range for most people, to include myself. The RS4 would definitely be a more entertaining entry point for most wagon enthusiasts. My gut tells me the RS6 will be priced somewhere between 120k and 130k.
__________________
2017 MG M3
Appreciate 1
Kief3286.00

      08-22-2019, 08:38 PM   #28
icegrill
Captain
icegrill's Avatar
494
Rep
778
Posts

Drives: 2015 M3
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Oregon

iTrader: (0)

There's an imported euro v10 rs6 wagon around town and I still think it's such a great looking beast! The new one is way outta my price range but glad to see Audi bringing this beauty stateside.
Appreciate 0
      08-22-2019, 08:48 PM   #29
icebiker
Second Lieutenant
148
Rep
202
Posts

Drives: 2016 F83 6MT
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: New Jersey

iTrader: (0)

Have always loved sporty wagons. Not that I could afford this Audi, but .....no manual, no deal. I miss my V70R. Not in the same league as the RS6, but plenty fun.
Appreciate 0
      08-23-2019, 02:57 PM   #30
minn19
Major General
minn19's Avatar
United_States
7551
Rep
7,812
Posts

Drives: 19 F150, 20 GLI, 20 C63S, 212S
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Minnesota

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GERMAN M3 View Post
Totally agree Kief!! I think the RS6 will be out of range for most people, to include myself. The RS4 would definitely be a more entertaining entry point for most wagon enthusiasts. My gut tells me the RS6 will be priced somewhere between 120k and 130k.
I'm sure lease prices will be reasonable like most BMWs.
Appreciate 1
GERMAN M32131.50

      08-25-2019, 10:48 AM   #31
GERMAN M3
Captain
GERMAN M3's Avatar
Germany
2132
Rep
908
Posts

Drives: 2017 MG M3
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Somewhere

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2017 M3  [0.00]
2015 BMW M3  [0.00]
Check this out!!! Pretty Cool!
Great job Audi.

__________________
2017 MG M3
Appreciate 1
myzmak2232.00

      08-25-2019, 08:24 PM   #32
ellipsis212
Lieutenant Colonel
ellipsis212's Avatar
817
Rep
1,753
Posts

Drives: 2017 M3
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: RVA

iTrader: (5)

Garage List
This car will be more special than having Ferrari in the states without all of the unwanted attention. The price will likely be ridiculous but I think it'll be worth it to have a unicorn-ish dream car that probably won't be around in the future due to cost/interest level.

Guess we'll have to see options on leasing next year and see if they want to push a few out the door. I'm guessing the low inventory will keep resale around 80k in 3 years but they'll run a pretty penny either route.

Side note, this ain't Sparky Griswold's wood panel station wagon. Try calling it an estate or a long roof and live in the now!
Appreciate 3
myzmak2232.00
ntg441957.50
heavyD^21509.50

      08-26-2019, 01:33 PM   #33
myzmak
Advocatus Douchebagus. Sex Marxist.
myzmak's Avatar
Canada
2232
Rep
3,368
Posts

Drives: Lucy.
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Canada

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2015 F80 M3  [5.00]
2013 MB E350 Wagon  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
I honestly was going to and I ended up having a crazy work/personal week. Not Lups crazy, but still. You know how it goes Myz, soccer ended Tuesday and hockey starts tonight.

I canít believe Iím saying this, but it looks bad ass. Please whoever above (or below) forgive me for saying that about a station wagon.
All wagons are bad ass (ok, other than the type driven by Clark Griswald in Vacation...but even that one in its own way....)

and I know how the seasons go. We start tryouts for ringette again tomorrow, hockey in about a week and then we are right back into it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz View Post
So which wagon do you have now?

Did you ever have a 6MT CTSV wagon? I was so sad that Enthusiast Internet didnít buy those up by the railcar load and reverse the Perfomance SUV trend j to Performance 6MT wagon trend
An E350 right now (and before that the sleeper VW Passat W8 wagon - wanted to get that one in 6MT, but we were right on the end of the production cycle and missed it). E63S has long been on the radar for when we replace the E350....though it might have some real competition with the RS6 Avant

Never had the CTS - can never get over the Cadillac styling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcades View Post
I thought you would know!

This RS6 Avant is very pretty. Definitely more of a looker than the current Benz E63S AMG. I can't see myself with wagons though no matter how much I secretly want one. I don't mind the new Panamera but... no.
I keep saying: absolute best of all worlds. The utility of whatever godawful looking SUVs north americans insist on buying (cargo room galore) BUT they drive like cars.
__________________
Drivin' Lucy
Appreciate 2
minn197550.50
GERMAN M32131.50

      08-26-2019, 04:16 PM   #34
Humdizzle
Lieutenant Colonel
1598
Rep
1,502
Posts

Drives: 2010 ferrari 458
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Missouri

iTrader: (0)

probably not.

If they limit quantity to under 1000 and don't allow leases.. then yeah i'd fork down 50% and finance it. do my own individual spec.

Otherwise the depreciation will just be silly. You could probably do a used GT4 + a nice $40-50k estate car daily of your choice... and save a load of cash.
__________________

2018 Porsche GT3 6MT
2015 Silverstone F80 6MT
2009 Honda Civic
Previous: Ferrari 458 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | R35 GTR | FR-S | F30 335i
Appreciate 0
      08-26-2019, 04:20 PM   #35
nicknaz
Lieutenant General
nicknaz's Avatar
United_States
3105
Rep
10,459
Posts

Drives: 6TT, model 3P, SM, F31 330
Join Date: May 2008
Location: NorCal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak View Post
An E350 right now (and before that the sleeper VW Passat W8 wagon - wanted to get that one in 6MT, but we were right on the end of the production cycle and missed it). E63S has long been on the radar for when we replace the E350....though it might have some real competition with the RS6 Avant

Never had the CTS - can never get over the Cadillac styling.



I keep saying: absolute best of all worlds. The utility of whatever godawful looking SUVs north americans insist on buying (cargo room galore) BUT they drive like cars.
That's too bad on your opinion of Cadillac styling. You could be having E63 / RS6 type of performance right now in your driveway with 6MT to boot, for the same money as E350 wagon.

I really wanted to do euro delivery, so I went the F80 route, but those CTS-V 6MT wagons were super compelling back in 2014-2015

My wife has an F31 wagon right now. Definitely a nice road trip car. Too bad on the towing capacity though. That's likely to tip me into the large SUV or van market in the future (e.g. 4x4 sprinter van)
Appreciate 1
myzmak2232.00

      08-26-2019, 05:00 PM   #36
Darth One
drunk poster
Darth One's Avatar
United_States
4094
Rep
2,953
Posts

Drives: M4 GTS | E46 M3
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: FL

iTrader: (0)

I'm planning on it. It's at the top of the list to replace a Macan GTS in two years. But a few things have to break right:

1. The pricing can't be ridiculous. M5/E63 pricing is fair, but not Panamera pricing
2. Wife has to not hate it
3. Lease terms cannot be usurious
4. It can't drive like shit. It's gonna be a very heavy car, so the big question is, can it wear its weight well?

If those conditions are met, I'm reasonably certain I'll be leasing one if i can get my hands on one
Appreciate 0
      08-26-2019, 06:28 PM   #37
Arcades
Lup's Kid
Arcades's Avatar
Taiwan
2811
Rep
3,921
Posts

Drives: 18' Grigio Medio F80
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Los Angeles

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth One View Post
I'm planning on it. It's at the top of the list to replace a Macan GTS in two years. But a few things have to break right:

1. The pricing can't be ridiculous. M5/E63 pricing is fair, but not Panamera pricing
2. Wife has to not hate it
3. Lease terms cannot be usurious
4. It can't drive like shit. It's gonna be a very heavy car, so the big question is, can it wear its weight well?

If those conditions are met, I'm reasonably certain I'll be leasing one if i can get my hands on one
Audi's RS leases are never great to begin with so I wouldn't expect it to be better.

I'm personally expecting the RS6's AWD to hide the weight for daily driving wise, probably not track wise (like almost all of Audi RS cars).
__________________
'18 Grigio Medio/Nutmeg BMW F80 M3 Competition "Stella" // '17 Mahogany Metallic/Black Porsche Macan S "Gisele"
2021 Porsche Macan GTS On Order

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lups View Post
You're making babies for me!
Appreciate 0
      08-26-2019, 07:30 PM   #38
Darth One
drunk poster
Darth One's Avatar
United_States
4094
Rep
2,953
Posts

Drives: M4 GTS | E46 M3
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: FL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcades View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth One View Post
I'm planning on it. It's at the top of the list to replace a Macan GTS in two years. But a few things have to break right:

1. The pricing can't be ridiculous. M5/E63 pricing is fair, but not Panamera pricing
2. Wife has to not hate it
3. Lease terms cannot be usurious
4. It can't drive like shit. It's gonna be a very heavy car, so the big question is, can it wear its weight well?

If those conditions are met, I'm reasonably certain I'll be leasing one if i can get my hands on one
Audi's RS leases are never great to begin with so I wouldn't expect it to be better.

I'm personally expecting the RS6's AWD to hide the weight for daily driving wise, probably not track wise (like almost all of Audi RS cars).
Agreed. I think it's unrealistic to expect BMW-type deals, because Audi won't subsidize to that degree. I'm used to paying Porsche leases so that might be acceptable if they're similar
Appreciate 0
      08-27-2019, 02:57 PM   #39
myzmak
Advocatus Douchebagus. Sex Marxist.
myzmak's Avatar
Canada
2232
Rep
3,368
Posts

Drives: Lucy.
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Canada

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2015 F80 M3  [5.00]
2013 MB E350 Wagon  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz View Post
That's too bad on your opinion of Cadillac styling. You could be having E63 / RS6 type of performance right now in your driveway with 6MT to boot, for the same money as E350 wagon.

I really wanted to do euro delivery, so I went the F80 route, but those CTS-V 6MT wagons were super compelling back in 2014-2015

My wife has an F31 wagon right now. Definitely a nice road trip car. Too bad on the towing capacity though. That's likely to tip me into the large SUV or van market in the future (e.g. 4x4 sprinter van)
Yeah...its a long standing problem of mine with Cadillac. I've always loathed the Escalade and I think they just brought that whole look through the whole line.

Plus...I'll admit to some issues with the Cadillac brand. Every time I see one (even CTS-V or ATS-V), I assume the driver is silver haired - have yet to be disappointed on that. I'll admit to enough vanity that I don't want people to assume that about me when they see my car.

I often wonder if GM should just start a brand new brand to try to really compete on the performance side - ditch caddy (or remove this whole line from that brand) altogether. Charge a bit more (as, ironically, when people pay less they assume it isn't as good).

F31s look nice. We don't tow anything, so that isn't an issue but as the wagon is our 'full size', that size is a bit small for us (2 kids + dog with a ton of trips to the mountains each year with skis or golf clubs or hiking stuff or whatever).

If you like the size of the F31, AMG has done the C-43 wagon here now....which maybe gives you something else that is mildly sportier.

OR if you want a larger size but don't want to pay E63 dollars, there is an E53

(though, frankly, i'm not sure the performance is that different on those two from the C400 or E400....but that leads to a WHOLE OTHER rant about how AMG is cheapening its brand by offering these 'in betweener' cars like the C43 and E43 - even worse than BMW with all the "M240i" etcs....but I really digress now)

Buddy of mine and his partner (who worked with me at the time) have 4 kids between them (from multiple past marriages - very much a brady bunch) and I tried to convince them to get and modify a sprinter a few years ago (as I seriously think that could be cool). She would barely speak to me for a month after I suggested it instead, she just got some monstrously big infinit or something
__________________
Drivin' Lucy
Appreciate 0
      08-27-2019, 03:00 PM   #40
Darth One
drunk poster
Darth One's Avatar
United_States
4094
Rep
2,953
Posts

Drives: M4 GTS | E46 M3
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: FL

iTrader: (0)

Modified Sprinter is my dream but i think i would hate driving it.

I priced it out and it’s around M5 pricing (actually a bit more than that tbh). It’s a nice option if you don’t care about performance
Appreciate 0
      08-28-2019, 10:35 AM   #41
f80er
Lieutenant Colonel
f80er's Avatar
1768
Rep
1,958
Posts

Drives: An M3
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: DMV

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth One View Post
Modified Sprinter is my dream but i think i would hate driving it.

I priced it out and itís around M5 pricing (actually a bit more than that tbh). Itís a nice option if you donít care about performance
My buddy has had a couple modified sprinters and a modified Metris for his work. They cool and all but noisy as all hell with the big open space behind the driver/passenger. Don't get me wrong if you need one then they are great but other than a need I can't see anyone actually wanting one.
Appreciate 0
      08-28-2019, 10:51 AM   #42
ntg44
Lieutenant Colonel
ntg44's Avatar
United_States
1958
Rep
1,705
Posts

Drives: R8 4.2 Spyder
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Chicago

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak View Post
I often wonder if GM should just start a brand new brand to try to really compete on the performance side - ditch caddy (or remove this whole line from that brand) altogether. Charge a bit more (as, ironically, when people pay less they assume it isn't as good).
Sounds to me like a Pontiac revival, kind of what Dodge is trying to turn itself into. Pontiacs used to cost more than Chevys, would be a pretty good opportunity to bring the brand back.
Appreciate 0
      08-28-2019, 12:04 PM   #43
seis-speed
#savethemanuals
seis-speed's Avatar
United_States
1712
Rep
1,630
Posts

Drives: 1M | Golf R | 911
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: West Coast

iTrader: (0)

G80 with a cargo-box on top for me, due to manual transmission.
If a manual transmission wagon came to the US, I would definitely get one.
Appreciate 0
      08-28-2019, 12:40 PM   #44
nicknaz
Lieutenant General
nicknaz's Avatar
United_States
3105
Rep
10,459
Posts

Drives: 6TT, model 3P, SM, F31 330
Join Date: May 2008
Location: NorCal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak View Post
Yeah...its a long standing problem of mine with Cadillac. I've always loathed the Escalade and I think they just brought that whole look through the whole line.

Plus...I'll admit to some issues with the Cadillac brand. Every time I see one (even CTS-V or ATS-V), I assume the driver is silver haired - have yet to be disappointed on that. I'll admit to enough vanity that I don't want people to assume that about me when they see my car.

I often wonder if GM should just start a brand new brand to try to really compete on the performance side - ditch caddy (or remove this whole line from that brand) altogether. Charge a bit more (as, ironically, when people pay less they assume it isn't as good).

F31s look nice. We don't tow anything, so that isn't an issue but as the wagon is our 'full size', that size is a bit small for us (2 kids + dog with a ton of trips to the mountains each year with skis or golf clubs or hiking stuff or whatever).

If you like the size of the F31, AMG has done the C-43 wagon here now....which maybe gives you something else that is mildly sportier.

OR if you want a larger size but don't want to pay E63 dollars, there is an E53

(though, frankly, i'm not sure the performance is that different on those two from the C400 or E400....but that leads to a WHOLE OTHER rant about how AMG is cheapening its brand by offering these 'in betweener' cars like the C43 and E43 - even worse than BMW with all the "M240i" etcs....but I really digress now)

Buddy of mine and his partner (who worked with me at the time) have 4 kids between them (from multiple past marriages - very much a brady bunch) and I tried to convince them to get and modify a sprinter a few years ago (as I seriously think that could be cool). She would barely speak to me for a month after I suggested it instead, she just got some monstrously big infinit or something
My brother had an e63 wagon that he kindly lent to me whenever I visited him in a toronto (including some DEs). Cool car but definitely tough to fully max out.

Im not really going to do highway pulls to triple digits with my family and dog in the car, and would prefer to drive a more focused sports car if itís a solo drive or track day, so e63 is sort of in a no manís land for me.

After my brotherís ownership, a good friend bought the e63 and modded it to 700hp and he recently sold it (replaced with fast EV) since he never had enough chances to unleash the horsepower either.

The family hauler I am really interested in is the Lincoln aviator. Great towing specs and amazing mid century modern style interior. 400hp is enough for a family hauler, and competent but not sporty handling is ok.

Towing aside, I do like the size of the f31, and itís 40mpg on the freeway (with awd) with ďgood enoughĒ power. If the steering feeling was improved it would get pretty close to ďperfect family hauling commuterĒ in my eyes.
Appreciate 1
myzmak2232.00

Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:34 AM.




f80post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST