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      01-18-2020, 06:35 AM   #1
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M3 versus Taycan, a few photos I snapped last night

This one arrived to the dealer last night. The interior is stunning, especially the display. Spoke with a guy that drobve one on the Autobahn. He said he was going 135, nailed it and it jumped to 170 almost instataneously.

Pulled up next to the CGT moments later. Talk about both ends of the spectrum for Porsche.

The Base model will be around $80k ish. My buddy told me that have deposits for something like 30,000 and Porsche has had to figure out ways to expand production to meet demand.

Blazing straight line performance and style. Would you take one over an M3?
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      01-18-2020, 12:43 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by 996ttelise View Post
The Base model will be around $80k ish. Would you take one over an M3?
What 80k base model? Porsche said 4S is the entry-level model; with options, it's 130k which is over 40k more than a brand new M4 CP. And the Taycan is a big four-door boat compared to the already relatively large M3. Y'all really out here stretching the M3 vs xyz comparos.
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      01-18-2020, 01:44 PM   #3
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What 80k base model? Porsche said 4S is the entry-level model; with options, it's 130k which is over 40k more than a brand new M4 CP. And the Taycan is a big four-door boat compared to the already relatively large M3. Y'all really out here stretching the M3 vs xyz comparos.
First year there will be only Turbo, Turbo S and 4S. Then the base will appear late first year or second year.

Base will be $80k range. Isn't the 4S around upper $90K.

Isnít the Taycan 4S about same sticker as the CS and the Base Taycan less than a CS?

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      01-18-2020, 04:55 PM   #4
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That $80k base version isnít going to be the one that will instantly go 130mph-170mph... got to pay $200k for that acceleration potential
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      01-18-2020, 06:46 PM   #5
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That $80k base version isnít going to be the one that will instantly go 130mph-170mph... got to pay $200k for that acceleration potential
The white is $160k, but not for sale. That is version the guy drove who commented on performance.

I donít know the specs, but even the base is going to be stupid quick off the line. Last night I was just hanging out with the Porsche tech guys back in the shop. I am sure the front of the house knows specs. I did get pricing and timing back in mid December.

I am picking one up because I like the looks, need a 4 door and wife wants to get an electric. Keeping my gas hogs though.

What do you think of the looks?
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      01-19-2020, 08:48 AM   #6
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I'll take that Carrera GT Thank you very much.

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      01-19-2020, 09:04 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by ///M4ster Yoda View Post
I'll take that Carrera GT Thank you very much.

Electric cars are fast toaster ovens
No doubt about the CGT. As far as electric cars, we are heading that way and they are not a bad idea for commuting and straight line fun. Nice to see Porsche offer an alternative that is actually very cool looking for an electric car. The Tesla does not really do it for me, except I do love their SUV. I am just not an SUV or a truck kind of guy.
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      01-19-2020, 09:08 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by ///M4ster Yoda View Post
I'll take that Carrera GT Thank you very much.

Electric cars are fast toaster ovens
No doubt about the CGT. As far as electric cars, we are heading that way and they are not a bad idea for commuting and straight line fun. Nice to see Porsche offer an alternative that is actually very cool looking for an electric car. The Tesla does not really do it for me, except I do love their SUV. I am just not an SUV or a truck kind of guy.
I agree about Tesla and I'm glad Porsche is offering up something in this segment. The Taycan does look very cool. Just wish the pricing wasn't so outrageous but that's Porsche for you and people will pay it.
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      01-19-2020, 09:56 AM   #9
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I agree about Tesla and I'm glad Porsche is offering up something in this segment. The Taycan does look very cool. Just wish the pricing wasn't so outrageous but that's Porsche for you and people will pay it.
The CS got pretty dang expensive and you could stroll out with a Taycan C4S at or near the same price.

Any idea what the new generation M3s will costs? Will they be in similar range of the CS?

Everything is getting more and more expensive. The Taycan base and Taycan 4S may be in the same neighborhood as the new M3s price wise if one was careful on the Taycan option boxes. This may be especially true with the new M3s offered in higher trim levels (Competition, CS and CSL).

I am not totally convinced they are in a different class price wise, but do agree that they are in a different class in other categories. That said, a lot of the M3 guys seems to be focused on and care only about drag racing and straight line speed.
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      01-19-2020, 11:42 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by 996ttelise View Post
The white is $160k, but not for sale. That is version the guy drove who commented on performance.

I donít know the specs, but even the base is going to be stupid quick off the line. Last night I was just hanging out with the Porsche tech guys back in the shop. I am sure the front of the house knows specs. I did get pricing and timing back in mid December.

I am picking one up because I like the looks, need a 4 door and wife wants to get an electric. Keeping my gas hogs though.

What do you think of the looks?
I havenít seen one in person but the dimensions are similar to a panamera so I have a rough idea.

Looks good. Very conventional and easy for people to accept.

Hope you get one and let us know how it goes. If youíre like me, the gassers end up on trickle chargers once thereís is a fast ev around
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      01-19-2020, 10:32 PM   #11
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Can't wait to get my turbo s in Sep. I am over my model S P100D, got so many problem within first year. Autopilot drove right into highway divider
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      01-20-2020, 05:39 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 996ttelise View Post
The CS got pretty dang expensive and you could stroll out with a Taycan C4S at or near the same price.

Any idea what the new generation M3s will costs? Will they be in similar range of the CS?

Everything is getting more and more expensive. The Taycan base and Taycan 4S may be in the same neighborhood as the new M3s price wise if one was careful on the Taycan option boxes. This may be especially true with the new M3s offered in higher trim levels (Competition, CS and CSL).

I am not totally convinced they are in a different class price wise, but do agree that they are in a different class in other categories. That said, a lot of the M3 guys seems to be focused on and care only about drag racing and straight line speed.
At least here in Canada, the M4cs tops out at the starting price of the Taycan 4S. Further, significant discounts can be had on the M4cs while the Taycan 4S price skyrockets quickly with options. The Turbo and Turbo-S are in a different stratosphere altogether. I don't expect the price of the G8X M3/4 to increase that dramatically over the base F8X M3/4. I therefore don't see the M3/4 being in the same market segment as the Taycan in terms of pricing and target audience.

All that being said, the Taycan remains one very attractive package.
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      01-20-2020, 11:54 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by avex8 View Post
Can't wait to get my turbo s in Sep. I am over my model S P100D, got so many problem within first year. Autopilot drove right into highway divider
Sorry that happened and glad you are ok.

I always keep my hands on the wheel on a new road or after a software update since itís only an L2 system right now but can make you feel like itís higher level sometimes.
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      01-21-2020, 08:18 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 996ttelise View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M4ster Yoda View Post
I agree about Tesla and I'm glad Porsche is offering up something in this segment. The Taycan does look very cool. Just wish the pricing wasn't so outrageous but that's Porsche for you and people will pay it.
The CS got pretty dang expensive and you could stroll out with a Taycan C4S at or near the same price.

Any idea what the new generation M3s will costs? Will they be in similar range of the CS?

Everything is getting more and more expensive. The Taycan base and Taycan 4S may be in the same neighborhood as the new M3s price wise if one was careful on the Taycan option boxes. This may be especially true with the new M3s offered in higher trim levels (Competition, CS and CSL).

I am not totally convinced they are in a different class price wise, but do agree that they are in a different class in other categories. That said, a lot of the M3 guys seems to be focused on and care only about drag racing and straight line speed.
The next M4 will have a marginal price increase over the current one. The non-comp will start under $70k and it'll probably be nicely equipped for that price, as opposed to any Porsche where you're spending $20k just on "must have" options and still leaving some off.
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      01-21-2020, 08:28 PM   #15
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Some good shots of the Taycan with Will Smith. Pretty funny video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...ature=emb_logo
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      01-21-2020, 08:41 PM   #16
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Was this in FL? I want to go check one out
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      01-21-2020, 09:19 PM   #17
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I just spec'd a Taycan Turbo to with my desired options... $180k! I then tried a 4S, starting price is $103k but it can't be configured without certain options so the base price is actually inflated to $115k, with options $150k.

The Taycan drives well (I had a short but informative drive in a moderatly optioned one, I believe it was around $160k), and it looks good, and I do love Porsche, but I can't help but think for $150k to $180k I could get a Tesla as a daily driver and then a fun sports car and maybe even still have cash left over. And I know its the elephant in the room, but the range is abysmal, and the Mission E-Concept was aiming for 311 miles!

Some info on the range: "My average efficiency on was 574 Wh/mi, which matches the car's lifetime average of 572. That corresponds to an average range (from the 83.7-kWh battery) of just 146 miles. ⁣ ⁣ Meanwhile, after 36 miles, the computer was looking at me with a straight face, predicting a 186 more miles of range. Not likely.⁣ ⁣ Sure, I did a few 0-60 runs, and this poor car has likely been abused every rolling minute. But the fact is, most EVs don't reach their EPA range (this one's is 192) and I don't think this thing is an exception." - Jason Cammisa

Matt Farrah used up 40% of range in 17 miles with "spirited/aggressive driving."

My problem with the Taycan is just this. For $150-180k I don't think its the best sports car. Fake/no engine noise, too heavy in the corners/feel, range is limited in spirited driving, and brake and steering feel aren't up to the Porsche standard, not to mention electric cars tend to feel more isolated due to the lack of "drama." They are quick as f*** in a straight line, but that isn't all that matters in a sports car in my opinion. As a daily driver its comfortable, but it has a small interior (rear seats are almost as difficult to get in as my CLS) and is lacking in cargo space despite being a midsize vehicle, the tech is somewhat clumsy to use, no one pedal driving, and the charging infrastructure simply isn't there for non-Tesla vehicles. Check out the E-Tron forums regarding the charging, especially the Electrify America chargers, it isn't pretty. Chargers have been getting stuck in vehicles, they don't charge at the best rate, sometimes the charging station doesn't work at all, and I have seen more than one case of owners getting stuck at the chargers without the ability to get elsewhere safetly, or even having to cancel their trip and go home due to lack of range. So as a daily driver or sports car, it doesn't really do either good enough for its large price tag.

The Taycan is a great car, if you have a garage with other cars, but it doesn't work if its your only car, or your only practical/4-door in my opinion.

My preferred situation is this: If I wanted electric, I could get a Model 3 Performance for $65k as my daily driver (and thats loaded, there is still a Long and Short Range model that are even cheaper), and I could also then buy a Boxster/Cayman. The two together are roughly the price of a Taycan, and I still have a great Porsche in my garage (especially since the 4.0 flat-6 is returning), and I would argue its a better Porsche since its an actual lightweight and engaging sports car. Hell, a loaded Model S is the same price as the Taycan 4S' inflated based price and offers more cargo and interior space, better tech, and 350 miles of range with a 2.4sec 0-60 time, or a long range trim will do 3.7 to 60 with 373 miles of range. Will it drive as well? No, but it still does handle decently and these cars are likely to be daily drivers stuck in traffic anyways. Owners seem to be extremely satisfied with their Tesla's, and a Model 3 handles even better than the S due to its compact size, and I can get all of my fun out of a sports car as my second vehicle.

When it comes to electric cars, its just hard to beat the complete package that Tesla brings to the table.

Just my $0.02 on the matter. I'd love to see what the "base" model Taycan and upcoming Taycan Sport Turismo (wagon) will be like.
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      01-21-2020, 09:44 PM   #18
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Great write up. The white turbo above is $160k so pretty sure you could do a reasonable 4S for $125k to $130k.

It will be interesting to see what base Taycan comes in at when it is released. I will likely go with base which hopefully can be had in the $115k range with options.

Range is pretty dang bad and I too will keep me gas hog sports cars. I think it would be nice to have Taycan forcwork commute and when I need four doors.

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      01-21-2020, 09:50 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
I just spec'd a Taycan Turbo to with my desired options... $180k! I then tried a 4S, starting price is $103k but it can't be configured without certain options so the base price is actually inflated to $115k, with options $150k.

The Taycan drives well (I had a short but informative drive in a moderatly optioned one, I believe it was around $160k), and it looks good, and I do love Porsche, but I can't help but think for $150k to $180k I could get a Tesla as a daily driver and then a fun sports car and maybe even still have cash left over. And I know its the elephant in the room, but the range is abysmal, and the Mission E-Concept was aiming for 311 miles!

Some info on the range: "My average efficiency on was 574 Wh/mi, which matches the car's lifetime average of 572. That corresponds to an average range (from the 83.7-kWh battery) of just 146 miles. ⁣ ⁣ Meanwhile, after 36 miles, the computer was looking at me with a straight face, predicting a 186 more miles of range. Not likely.⁣ ⁣ Sure, I did a few 0-60 runs, and this poor car has likely been abused every rolling minute. But the fact is, most EVs don't reach their EPA range (this one's is 192) and I don't think this thing is an exception." - Jason Cammisa

Matt Farrah used up 40% of range in 17 miles with "spirited/aggressive driving."

My problem with the Taycan is just this. For $150-180k I don't think its the best sports car. Fake/no engine noise, too heavy in the corners/feel, range is limited in spirited driving, and brake and steering feel aren't up to the Porsche standard, not to mention electric cars tend to feel more isolated due to the lack of "drama." They are quick as f*** in a straight line, but that isn't all that matters in a sports car in my opinion. As a daily driver its comfortable, but it has a small interior (rear seats are almost as difficult to get in as my CLS) and is lacking in cargo space despite being a midsize vehicle, the tech is somewhat clumsy to use, no one pedal driving, and the charging infrastructure simply isn't there for non-Tesla vehicles. Check out the E-Tron forums regarding the charging, especially the Electrify America chargers, it isn't pretty. Chargers have been getting stuck in vehicles, they don't charge at the best rate, sometimes the charging station doesn't work at all, and I have seen more than one case of owners getting stuck at the chargers without the ability to get elsewhere safetly, or even having to cancel their trip and go home due to lack of range. So as a daily driver or sports car, it doesn't really do either good enough for its large price tag.

The Taycan is a great car, if you have a garage with other cars, but it doesn't work if its your only car, or your only practical/4-door in my opinion.

My preferred situation is this: If I wanted electric, I could get a Model 3 Performance for $65k as my daily driver (and thats loaded, there is still a Long and Short Range model that are even cheaper), and I could also then buy a Boxster/Cayman. The two together are roughly the price of a Taycan, and I still have a great Porsche in my garage (especially since the 4.0 flat-6 is returning), and I would argue its a better Porsche since its an actual lightweight and engaging sports car. Hell, a loaded Model S is the same price as the Taycan 4S' inflated based price and offers more cargo and interior space, better tech, and 350 miles of range with a 2.4sec 0-60 time, or a long range trim will do 3.7 to 60 with 373 miles of range. Will it drive as well? No, but it still does handle decently and these cars are likely to be daily drivers stuck in traffic anyways. Owners seem to be extremely satisfied with their Tesla's, and a Model 3 handles even better than the S due to its compact size, and I can get all of my fun out of a sports car as my second vehicle.

When it comes to electric cars, its just hard to beat the complete package that Tesla brings to the table.

Just my $0.02 on the matter. I'd love to see what the "base" model Taycan and upcoming Taycan Sport Turismo (wagon) will be like.
The problem with Tesla is they are not attractive. I would rather spend the extra $$$ to get something that looks great and has a nice interior. I wouldnít drive a Misel 3 just because of its looks no matter how much it cost.
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      01-21-2020, 09:55 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 996ttelise View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
I just spec'd a Taycan Turbo to with my desired options... $180k! I then tried a 4S, starting price is $103k but it can't be configured without certain options so the base price is actually inflated to $115k, with options $150k.

The Taycan drives well (I had a short but informative drive in a moderatly optioned one, I believe it was around $160k), and it looks good, and I do love Porsche, but I can't help but think for $150k to $180k I could get a Tesla as a daily driver and then a fun sports car and maybe even still have cash left over. And I know its the elephant in the room, but the range is abysmal, and the Mission E-Concept was aiming for 311 miles!

Some info on the range: "My average efficiency on was 574 Wh/mi, which matches the car's lifetime average of 572. That corresponds to an average range (from the 83.7-kWh battery) of just 146 miles. ⁣ ⁣ Meanwhile, after 36 miles, the computer was looking at me with a straight face, predicting a 186 more miles of range. Not likely.⁣ ⁣ Sure, I did a few 0-60 runs, and this poor car has likely been abused every rolling minute. But the fact is, most EVs don't reach their EPA range (this one's is 192) and I don't think this thing is an exception." - Jason Cammisa

Matt Farrah used up 40% of range in 17 miles with "spirited/aggressive driving."

My problem with the Taycan is just this. For $150-180k I don't think its the best sports car. Fake/no engine noise, too heavy in the corners/feel, range is limited in spirited driving, and brake and steering feel aren't up to the Porsche standard, not to mention electric cars tend to feel more isolated due to the lack of "drama." They are quick as f*** in a straight line, but that isn't all that matters in a sports car in my opinion. As a daily driver its comfortable, but it has a small interior (rear seats are almost as difficult to get in as my CLS) and is lacking in cargo space despite being a midsize vehicle, the tech is somewhat clumsy to use, no one pedal driving, and the charging infrastructure simply isn't there for non-Tesla vehicles. Check out the E-Tron forums regarding the charging, especially the Electrify America chargers, it isn't pretty. Chargers have been getting stuck in vehicles, they don't charge at the best rate, sometimes the charging station doesn't work at all, and I have seen more than one case of owners getting stuck at the chargers without the ability to get elsewhere safetly, or even having to cancel their trip and go home due to lack of range. So as a daily driver or sports car, it doesn't really do either good enough for its large price tag.

The Taycan is a great car, if you have a garage with other cars, but it doesn't work if its your only car, or your only practical/4-door in my opinion.

My preferred situation is this: If I wanted electric, I could get a Model 3 Performance for $65k as my daily driver (and thats loaded, there is still a Long and Short Range model that are even cheaper), and I could also then buy a Boxster/Cayman. The two together are roughly the price of a Taycan, and I still have a great Porsche in my garage (especially since the 4.0 flat-6 is returning), and I would argue its a better Porsche since its an actual lightweight and engaging sports car. Hell, a loaded Model S is the same price as the Taycan 4S' inflated based price and offers more cargo and interior space, better tech, and 350 miles of range with a 2.4sec 0-60 time, or a long range trim will do 3.7 to 60 with 373 miles of range. Will it drive as well? No, but it still does handle decently and these cars are likely to be daily drivers stuck in traffic anyways. Owners seem to be extremely satisfied with their Tesla's, and a Model 3 handles even better than the S due to its compact size, and I can get all of my fun out of a sports car as my second vehicle.

When it comes to electric cars, its just hard to beat the complete package that Tesla brings to the table.

Just my $0.02 on the matter. I'd love to see what the "base" model Taycan and upcoming Taycan Sport Turismo (wagon) will be like.
The problem with Tesla is they are not attractive. I would rather spend the extra $$$ to get something that looks great and has a nice interior. I wouldn’t drive a Misel 3 just because of its looks no matter how much it cost.
I totally understand, and its your money so at the end of the day, its your decision. Just thought I'd put my thoughts on the Taycan out there.
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      01-22-2020, 01:43 AM   #21
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I think Porsche was trying to market the first exotic electric car with its pricing strategy since exotic electric don't exist.
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      01-22-2020, 03:04 PM   #22
nicknaz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
I totally understand, and its your money so at the end of the day, its your decision. Just thought I'd put my thoughts on the Taycan out there.
Josh, funny, thatís exactly my POV and how my garage looks. Except instead of a boxster/cayman itís a 6TT
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