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      01-29-2020, 01:52 PM   #1
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Best buy @ $50k? F80 / M2 / M2C / 718 / A90 Supra

This will be long winded and may not necessarily be as focused as I would like, but I will try my best to be coherent with my thoughts.

I currently drive an F30 328i that I've paid off. Standard jb4/catless downpipe/intake for sound/H&R sport springs/437m wheels.

For the past year and a half, I've been putting some money aside each paycheck as if I had a car payment. My original idea was to get into one of the cheapest F80's that I could find come Winter 2020. I figured that by then, the G80 would be out and the used market may take another 5-10% depreciation hit. I've already been seeing some 2015's hit $38k, so this was looking like a good deal to me at the time.

I negotiated an unexpected "6 month" raise in October and have an upcoming annual review in April and so my budget has gone up to around $50k MAX.

I was also set on going manual for sure with the F80. I've been reading a lot of people mentioning the "lag" that can occur between gear shifts with the manual (and other counterpoints stating that it can be corrected with a tune) and others stating that DCT was the way to go to get the most out of the car. I have another manual car, though its out of state and I haven't seen it in 5 years. I honestly have no preference either way and without having driven each, can't really decide what might be best for me. DCT seems the more convenient option for Orange County traffic.

Then I started diving into the differences in model years and started leaning more towards the comp package. Then...I started leaning more towards a 2018+ with the updated headlights. Finding a sub 30k miles, mineral grey or black exterior, sakhir orange interior, comp package 2018+ for $50k, that's already in my area, has been difficult.

I've always liked the M2 and thought for a while I could see myself getting into one of those. I absolutely prefer the hexagon style headlight option (adaptive?) over the circular design. This seemed like a viable option as well, until they decided to come out with the M2 competition. Now it seems like it would be a waste to pick up an OG M2 when you get the comp with the S55 and the better seats. I've seen very few M2C's near $50k; they typically are seen around 53 or 54, so beyond my budget it seems.

In looking at used F80s, one of the dealer sites has a 718 Cayman available right around the same price point ($48k). I loved the 987 Cayman when it came out; I've always been a huge fan of the looks of it. I am admittedly not very knowledgeable about p-cars. So, I've spent the past week reading up on the different generations and each generation's different models (i.e. base, S, GTS). This 718 looked gorgeous at first, but now that I know a little bit more, I see that it's fairly light on options and its a base model. The base is a 2L flat 4 turbo (with the S and GTS being 2.5L with a better turbo). The S and GTS are unfortunately beyond that $50k upper limit. There are a few companies offering tunes and I particularly like the bundle from fabspeed that offers a tune+catless downpipe+exhaust for 3,500. My concern with the base model is people reporting the low end lag (that doesn't seem to be there with the larger 2.5L engine and variable vane turbo). It also feels like I would be missing out by spending this much money on another 4 cylinder car with a lot less headroom for modifications than the F80 platform.

I've also been following the A90 Supra for the past few years and was really excited for the launch. It seems to be bringing a lot more attention to the B58 which is great overall for the community. It seems like with BM3 and a catless downpipe, it would be no slouch, and most reviewers really enjoy driving it. Its unfortunate however that there are still dealer markups on them and really no used market available yet. Its unknown if one could be negotiated down to that $50k price point.


Those are my thoughts on each of the cars. I have not driven any of them, nor even been inside any of them. I was considering using turo to rent each one for a day to get a "real" test drive in.

Does anyone have any advice or comments concerning any of these cars, or even other recommendations around this price point? I will say that I am not a fan of Audi, Mercedes, or most domestics.
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      01-29-2020, 09:25 PM   #2
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Shelby GT350. That car is dripping with character, amazing engine, riot to drive. Didn't work for me as the back seats are too small, but based on the cars your looking at that seems like a non issue.
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      01-30-2020, 08:52 AM   #3
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2015/2016 M3's can be had for a very reasonable price IMO. I would suggest looking for an F80 under $40k or slightly above. You'll get a heck of a lot of performance and still save a few thousand vs the other options. Even better if you can snag a Comp, that way you can code in all the CS or other settings. The regular 718, while a great car, just isn't special enough with the 4 cylinder.

2015-16 M3, pretty decent value atm
2017-2018 Camaro 1LE, best value with it's own downfalls
Shelby GT350 in the mid $40k range
M2C, perfect size, good motor, a bit pricey IMO
Supra, great for overall use, lots of daily driver features, good motor, etc.
718, meh w/the 4, yay w/da 6


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      01-30-2020, 12:12 PM   #4
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If you can find an m2c 6mt in your price range, that would be an interesting car to just leave stock and enjoy. It has the best chance of going the way of the 1M resale value wise, in my opinion.

Ď16 f80 would be great too.

The one thing Iíve found out about Porsche after getting one is that everything escalates in terms of repair and maintenance. So just be sure you know what you are getting into on that front. Full warranty and free maintenance bmw is a lot different of a cost profile to own than out of warranty p-car
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      01-30-2020, 03:20 PM   #5
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Don't ever stretch yourself thin just for a car. Rather than searching for the cheapest 2017-2018 car you can find, its a better idea to get a mint well taken care of 2015-2016 example.

I'd go with a 2015-16 M3 or M4. Or an original M2. They have already taken a good chunk of depreciation. You can find a clean examples in the low 40s. When you get into the 30k range you are finding cars with missing options/sunroofs/accident history/driven in salt.

Just drive them all and see which one you like. Shouldn't be too hard to find a used M2 or M3 on a dealer lot to check out. Sounds like this is your daily driver and you have to deal with traffic, so i'd go DCT
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      01-31-2020, 12:51 PM   #6
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I appreciate all of the responses guys, thank you!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Montaver View Post
Shelby GT350. That car is dripping with character, amazing engine, riot to drive. Didn't work for me as the back seats are too small, but based on the cars your looking at that seems like a non issue.
Man, the voodoo engine is no doubt one of the best sounding v8's out there. And for the money, it would seem very hard to beat the GT350; the performance per dollar is just insane. The only problem is that I just could never see myself as a "mustang guy". You know who I am talking about lol. Being an enthusiast, I can absolutely appreciate it and would love to drive one some time. I just don't know if the ownership of a mustang is for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioRiderAaron View Post
2015/2016 M3's can be had for a very reasonable price IMO. I would suggest looking for an F80 under $40k or slightly above. You'll get a heck of a lot of performance and still save a few thousand vs the other options. Even better if you can snag a Comp, that way you can code in all the CS or other settings. The regular 718, while a great car, just isn't special enough with the 4 cylinder.

2015-16 M3, pretty decent value atm
2017-2018 Camaro 1LE, best value with it's own downfalls
Shelby GT350 in the mid $40k range
M2C, perfect size, good motor, a bit pricey IMO
Supra, great for overall use, lots of daily driver features, good motor, etc.
718, meh w/the 4, yay w/da 6


GL!
That's exactly how I was feeling about the 718 after doing some reading. I can't deny that its a great looking car, especially the one that I found with bordeaux red interior and carbon fiber trim with a manual - https://************/wpnjgrx

But considering the amount of car you can get with the same money from its competitors, it just doesn't seem like a good choice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknaz View Post
If you can find an m2c 6mt in your price range, that would be an interesting car to just leave stock and enjoy. It has the best chance of going the way of the 1M resale value wise, in my opinion.

Ď16 f80 would be great too.

The one thing Iíve found out about Porsche after getting one is that everything escalates in terms of repair and maintenance. So just be sure you know what you are getting into on that front. Full warranty and free maintenance bmw is a lot different of a cost profile to own than out of warranty p-car
Its crazy but I actually prefer the OG M2 styling over the comp (i.e. front bumper/grilles and 437m vs. the comp wheels). I just don't know if I would have a feeling of regret if I were to purchase the OG and just want to kick myself for not holding out for the comp. Getting a 6mt M2c at $50k would be ideal though.

I forgot about the maintenance costs on the porsche also. I think there was a C&D article on a long term cayman vs. (I forgot which trim) c7 corvette and they had a maintenance cost spread and the cayman was something like 4x the corvette. Very good points there, thank you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Humdizzle View Post
Don't ever stretch yourself thin just for a car. Rather than searching for the cheapest 2017-2018 car you can find, its a better idea to get a mint well taken care of 2015-2016 example.

I'd go with a 2015-16 M3 or M4. Or an original M2. They have already taken a good chunk of depreciation. You can find a clean examples in the low 40s. When you get into the 30k range you are finding cars with missing options/sunroofs/accident history/driven in salt.

Just drive them all and see which one you like. Shouldn't be too hard to find a used M2 or M3 on a dealer lot to check out. Sounds like this is your daily driver and you have to deal with traffic, so i'd go DCT
You are absolutely right about stretching yourself thin for a car and I totally agree.

I found this original M2 that looks like a bargain - https://************/wkdnk8q
Only downside is its an auto. Is the original as responsive to tuning as the S55? I think whichever platform I go with, a catless downpipe (or pipes) and flash like BM3 are planned. I think that's why I'd almost rather go with a '16+ M3 over the original M2.
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      01-31-2020, 01:58 PM   #7
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What are you going to use the car for? Commute? Track? Do you have another daily?
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      01-31-2020, 02:20 PM   #8
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Quote:
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What are you going to use the car for? Commute? Track? Do you have another daily?
Just commute (changing in 2 weeks from 50 miles round trip to 8) and weekend outings to wherever...LA, Long Beach, Costa Mesa. Probably no track time....but I would consider a track day if the conditions were right.

No other daily right now. Considering shipping my other car here from FL, though its an engine swapped '95 240sx and not the best candidate for a daily.
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      01-31-2020, 05:38 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MONSTAR View Post
I appreciate all of the responses guys, thank you!!





That's exactly how I was feeling about the 718 after doing some reading. I can't deny that its a great looking car, especially the one that I found with bordeaux red interior and carbon fiber trim with a manual - https://************/wpnjgrx

But considering the amount of car you can get with the same money from its competitors, it just doesn't seem like a good choice.


I forgot about the maintenance costs on the porsche also. I think there was a C&D article on a long term cayman vs. (I forgot which trim) c7 corvette and they had a maintenance cost spread and the cayman was something like 4x the corvette. Very good points there, thank you!


You are absolutely right about stretching yourself thin for a car and I totally agree.

I found this original M2 that looks like a bargain - https://************/wkdnk8q
Only downside is its an auto. Is the original as responsive to tuning as the S55? I think whichever platform I go with, a catless downpipe (or pipes) and flash like BM3 are planned. I think that's why I'd almost rather go with a '16+ M3 over the original M2.
The N55 motor is not as robust as the S55, or even the B58 in the m240i. Its a single turbo setup. With a tune and downpipe you'll probably be making what a stock M3 or M2c puts down.

The cayman might not look like much on paper. But you're paying for the mid engine layout which is pretty much better in every way than a front engine layout. it will ride better, handle better, turn in better.

Porsche charges obscene amounts for service work by the hour. if you can find a good indy shop that will help drop the costs significantly. My buddy has a macan and took to Porsche for an alignment, they wanted $500. So he took to VW/Audi instead for half that.
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      02-01-2020, 09:33 AM   #10
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In that price range you should at least test drive a Tesla Model 3...
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      02-01-2020, 03:09 PM   #11
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In that price range you should at least test drive a Tesla Model 3...
You know I love my model 3 but if someone is coming asking about a bunch of gas cars, and several are 2 seats cars, I donít think there is any way they would get an EV.
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      02-01-2020, 03:19 PM   #12
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Quote:
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You know I love my model 3 but if someone is coming asking about a bunch of gas cars, and several are 2 seats cars, I don’t think there is any way they would get an EV.
Shattering pre-conceived notions is one of the things the Model 3 is best at, so one never really knows.
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      02-02-2020, 12:55 PM   #13
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I am in similar situation where I planning to replace my F30 to F80/F82/M2C/Others in winter 2020 Same around $50K budget. Test drove a F82 and my friend's F80 M3, a C7 Vette and RWD Jaguar F type R. So far my preference is the Jag. I LOVE the F80/F82, amazing car with good deal at this time. But when it gets to the interior, is very similar to the F30 that I owned for 6 years. I kinda don't want to spent 50K for the same interior for another 5-6 years. But as I said the F80/F82 is awesome enough for me to consider. The vette is great but I just not a fan of that transmission & engine noise, beside the C8 is coming out so C7 is not consider at this time. 718 cayman is 4-cyclinder so no consider for me, but the 981 Cayman S, the flat H6 engine with the sound and PDK The only problem with that car is is gets a bit outdated and maintanance could be pricy. Until I drove the Jag. I am not saying the Jag is the best, it has many flaws: lack of reliability and the MPG. But overall is a gorgeous car, with 550hp V8 and the ZF8, the exhuast sound, the interior, the performance. But it never beat the BMW in handling and reliability and the aftermarket is lacking for Jaguar. I am really insterest how the G80 will actually looks like, if that G80 continue the legacy of the M3, I might consider of leasing one. To conclude, since my plan is replacing my F30 at winter 2020, My plan will be
1)Get a 2016 AWD Jaguar F type R
2)Get a 2018 F80/F82 comp
3)Lease a G80 M3
4)Lease a C8
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      02-02-2020, 01:05 PM   #14
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Cliffs notes please🤨
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      02-04-2020, 03:37 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZCD1 View Post
In that price range you should at least test drive a Tesla Model 3...
I see that you have the model 3 performance which I am sure smokes basically anything on the road!! For me though, I just can't get into the looks of the 3. I do like the S and saw a few P85D's in the price range (they were 2014-2015 and I went as far as to looking into the "facelift" package to retrofit current gen front bumper etc). My only complaint is the lack of sound. I think I am going to stick with ICE for the time being and enjoy them while theyre still an option.

I love each engine's unique sound. It's fun to me to try to guess which car just drove by based on the noise. Subaru WRX/STI's boxers, any of the Nissan/Infiniti VQ engines, Mustang coyotes, those are the easy to identify ones.
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      02-05-2020, 12:54 PM   #16
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Quote:
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...For me though, I just can't get into the looks of the 3...I love each engine's unique sound.
I completely understand that.

I still think it's worth taking a test drive, because it's mind-blowing, and can quickly rearrange your priorities.

In any case, good luck with your search!
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      03-04-2020, 07:35 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montaver View Post
Shelby GT350. That car is dripping with character, amazing engine, riot to drive. Didn't work for me as the back seats are too small, but based on the cars your looking at that seems like a non issue.
An engine that also has a tendency to blow up as well. Well documented issues as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZCD1 View Post
I completely understand that.

I still think it's worth taking a test drive, because it's mind-blowing, and can quickly rearrange your priorities.

In any case, good luck with your search!
I've heard this countless times. "Drive one, you'll change your mind!"

I drove a Model S 85 last week. It did not change my mind. I can't drive in silence. Instant power is nice but there's nothing else to it.
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      03-04-2020, 08:57 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TanzaniteBlue View Post
.

I've heard this countless times. "Drive one, you'll change your mind!"

I drove a Model S 85 last week. It did not change my mind. I can't drive in silence. Instant power is nice but there's nothing else to it.
You drove an f30 335 equivalent, and zcd1 was talking about the f80 M3 equivalent.
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      03-05-2020, 08:17 AM   #19
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You drove an f30 335 equivalent, and zcd1 was talking about the f80 M3 equivalent.
My opinion still stands. I drove the Model S in real world conditions. No sound, no gear changes = no thanks.

Last edited by TanzaniteBlue; 03-05-2020 at 08:23 AM..
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      03-05-2020, 07:08 PM   #20
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Quote:
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My opinion still stands. I drove the Model S in real world conditions. No sound, no gear changes = no thanks.
yea I can see that POV. I used to have that POV too, but now my pcar (modded 6mt turbo Mezger) is a garage queen.

The faster EV with tons of torque, AWD and aggressive suspension tuning are a lot different than the base model car you drove, but honestly, I am ok with less people driving EV.

More chargers and hov access for me
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      04-06-2020, 12:45 AM   #21
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For me, it is was just a toy/I was buying it solely for the fun to drive aspect than 718 Cayman all the way.

I personally need fun to drive mixed with something that can fit a rear facing car seat, F80 ZCP is what I landed on.
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      07-04-2020, 05:02 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ufoetzzj View Post
I am in similar situation where I planning to replace my F30 to F80/F82/M2C/Others in winter 2020 Same around $50K budget. Test drove a F82 and my friend's F80 M3, a C7 Vette and RWD Jaguar F type R. So far my preference is the Jag. I LOVE the F80/F82, amazing car with good deal at this time. But when it gets to the interior, is very similar to the F30 that I owned for 6 years. I kinda don't want to spent 50K for the same interior for another 5-6 years. But as I said the F80/F82 is awesome enough for me to consider. The vette is great but I just not a fan of that transmission & engine noise, beside the C8 is coming out so C7 is not consider at this time. 718 cayman is 4-cyclinder so no consider for me, but the 981 Cayman S, the flat H6 engine with the sound and PDK The only problem with that car is is gets a bit outdated and maintanance could be pricy. Until I drove the Jag. I am not saying the Jag is the best, it has many flaws: lack of reliability and the MPG. But overall is a gorgeous car, with 550hp V8 and the ZF8, the exhuast sound, the interior, the performance. But it never beat the BMW in handling and reliability and the aftermarket is lacking for Jaguar. I am really insterest how the G80 will actually looks like, if that G80 continue the legacy of the M3, I might consider of leasing one. To conclude, since my plan is replacing my F30 at winter 2020, My plan will be
1)Get a 2016 AWD Jaguar F type R
2)Get a 2018 F80/F82 comp
3)Lease a G80 M3
4)Lease a C8
I tested the Jag when I cross shopped and it was a riot, but ultimately I didn't like the dated tech and the thought of such an expensive car (gotta think MSRP, not used market) maintenance and parts cost. Same reason I passed on AMG GTS. M4 has a bigger base of customers, so cheaper mods, easier to maintain, bigger parts market, tunes, etc.

I like making cars my own, so availability of BimmerCode and BootMod3 were a huge plus. Just a thought. C8 I wanted to try, but the delay to market was huge and when reviews came out and complaints of understeer poured in, I bailed. C8 is only worth considering in Z06 package to me
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