M4 vs. Cayman GTS

[visualguy]

Originally Posted by Romo

So with the above mentioned sports chassis the ground clearance is dropping annother 10mm?

Yes. The ground clearance is only 89mm with the sport chassis. Too little clearance in my opinion.

[Audio Fan]

The Cayman is a great car, but it is underpowered, and feels like the car you settle for because you can't afford a 911. When P puts a 911 S engine in the Cayman and drops the price to M3/4 levels, I would consider a switch. Until then, the M4 will be in my garage. That's just me.

PS. It is hard to support a car company that suppresses a superior design so that old rich guys can have a trophy that needs to be over-engineered, and thus overpriced, to compensate for a flawed design. That's the engineer me.

[ZGM3]

Originally Posted by Audio Fan

The Cayman is a great car, but it is underpowered, and feels like the car you settle for because you can't afford a 911. When P puts a 911 S engine in the Cayman and drops the price to M3/4 levels, I would consider a switch...

PS. It is hard to support a car company that suppresses a superior design so that old rich guys can have a trophy that needs to be over-engineered, and thus overpriced, to compensate for a flawed design. That's the engineer me.

I hope that you will finally be wrong after all these years of Porsche holding back against its own 911.

Pure Rumors but hoping:
Cayman GT4

http://www.carbuzz.com/news/2014/5/1...e-911-7720341/

"A few days ago we caught our first glimpse of the Porsche Cayman GT4. And it looks fast. Really fast. Already an incredibly solid handler, the mid-engined Cayman has always been deliberately held back, so to speak, by Porsche so that it wouldn’t interfere with the 911’s prestige. The bottom line is that the smaller and far less historical Cayman could outperform the iconic 911. Porsche has so far been careful to avoid doing just that. Until now.

Although we don’t have any official specs, there’s a very good chance the Cayman GT4 will be the 911 killer Porsche said it would never build. So why the sudden change from Stuttgart? Good question, and here’s a possible answer: The current 991 generation 911 is capable of so much - just look at the Turbo and GT3 (when it’s not on fire). Why keep holding the Cayman back when there’s clearly room in the lineup to let it finally doing what it’s long been capable of: outperforming the 911 Carrera. So yes, the Cayman GT4 will likely beat the Carrera and probably even the Carrera S in matchup. The 911 Turbo and GT3, however, will remain untouchable." -carbuzz.com-


If this ever came to be a reality with the specs "guessed at" in this article then this could be one of the best track cars out there in the price range, and could be one hell of a fun daily/weekend driver. but would still most likely be at least $20k more than the M3/4..

[bimmerj]

Originally Posted by Audio Fan

The Cayman is a great car, but it is underpowered, and feels like the car you settle for because you can't afford a 911. When P puts a 911 S engine in the Cayman and drops the price to M3/4 levels, I would consider a switch. Until then, the M4 will be in my garage. That's just me.

PS. It is hard to support a car company that suppresses a superior design so that old rich guys can have a trophy that needs to be over-engineered, and thus overpriced, to compensate for a flawed design. That's the engineer me.

I used to think the Cayman S was fairly under powered too. Once you drive it, you change your mind. It is one of the most awesome cars out there. I even drove mine in the snow, it is a riot.

[1stm3f80]

I am sure everyone on this board has built a Porsche on the website. I still can't believe everything is an option. Safety package include's doors. Driver assistance package gives you a steering wheel. I guess you need the convenience package as it nets you a key to start the car. I know we have complained about BMW And the packages like exec pack but IMO we got it better then Porsche.

[pkimM3r]

Originally Posted by 1stm3f80

I am sure everyone on this board has built a Porsche on the website. I still can't believe everything is an option. Safety package include's doors. Driver assistance package gives you a steering wheel. I guess you need the convenience package as it nets you a key to start the car. I know we have complained about BMW And the packages like exec pack but IMO we got it better then Porsche.

lol..don't forget the driver assistance package gives you pedals too.

[mister2d]

Originally Posted by 1stm3f80

I am sure everyone on this board has built a Porsche on the website. I still can't believe everything is an option. Safety package include's doors. Driver assistance package gives you a steering wheel. I guess you need the convenience package as it nets you a key to start the car. I know we have complained about BMW And the packages like exec pack but IMO we got it better then Porsche.

This makes no sense. More options to choose from, and allowing you to pick and choose instead of a must-have option strategically placed in a luxo package. No thanks. Not me, I think Porsche shoppers have it better.

The other point you miss is that the Cayman (and other Porsches) are sports cars first. You can get a stripper with no added weight for the track if you want.

[Romo]

So, I have made my decision........

I' m ordering a Safire Blue Metallic Cayman GTS, and I`ll keep the the 1M.

All the driver goodies in it, PSAM, SCP, PTV, PDLS, PDK,Sports exhaust, PCCB, 20" Carrera Classic, Nav/Telephone stuff.

It was a hard decision for I had an E46 M3, E92 M3 and now a E82 1M (this car will be a keeper) and I had high expectatations over the F82 M4.
But IMHO it has outgrown it self, too big, too stretched, it has a certain puffy look over it like Jabba the Hut (no offense ) It lacks the outside sportiness IMHO that used to be typical M3 territory.

There is no doubt what so ever, the M3-4 are absolutely (very) fast cars, surplus on HP and Nm, and will kill a Cayman GTS straight line speed easy.

What the 1M has thought me; small, nimble and agile cars will do the job for me, so the Cayman will fit perfectly, and I will have the best of two worlds. A 2 seater PDK sportscar with a brilliant NA 6 boxer engine, an a 4 seater manual with a brilliant 6 IL TT engine.

In 2 or 3 years I,ll take on the coming M2, for now I`m enjoying these 2 cars !

[FTS]

Couple of recommendations:

• Consider the GTS interior package. It is a unique package that would increase resale value
• If you intend to track with the car, I'd leave out PTV
• Consider sport suspension if you don't mind a little harshness during DD work. Porsche is very good in shock calibration, and the sport suspension is probably the best they have come up with thus far. And the additional 10 mm drop in ride height makes the car's stance perfect even though on paper it is only 10 mm, the look is brilliant. Although it can be retrofit later on, the labor cost (not parts) will be more, replacing the A/R bars are a PITA.
• Unless it is for visual reasons, PCCBs are not worth it on a Porsche as the steel brakes are truly superb. However, after you get your car, consider installing GT3 master cylinder for improve pedal feel and track duty.

Best of luck and enjoy the new car.

[E92LNGCGY]

Originally Posted by Romo

So, I have made my decision........

I' m ordering a Safire Blue Metallic Cayman GTS, and I`ll keep the the 1M.

All the driver goodies in it, PSAM, SCP, PTV, PDLS, PDK,Sports exhaust, PCCB, 20" Carrera Classic, Nav/Telephone stuff.

It was a hard decision for I had an E46 M3, E92 M3 and now a E82 1M (this car will be a keeper) and I had high expectatations over the F82 M4.
But IMHO it has outgrown it self, too big, too stretched, it has a certain puffy look over it like Jabba the Hut (no offense ) It lacks the outside sportiness IMHO that used to be typical M3 territory.

There is no doubt what so ever, the M3-4 are absolutely (very) fast cars, surplus on HP and Nm, and will kill a Cayman GTS straight line speed easy.

What the 1M has thought me; small, nimble and agile cars will do the job for me, so the Cayman will fit perfectly, and I will have the best of two worlds. A 2 seater PDK sportscar with a brilliant NA 6 boxer engine, an a 4 seater manual with a brilliant 6 IL TT engine.

In 2 or 3 years I,ll take on the coming M2, for now I`m enjoying these 2 cars !

Congrats. Very good choice. I also considered the Cayman GTS but ordered the M4 instead.

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

Originally Posted by Romo

So, I have made my decision........

I' m ordering a Safire Blue Metallic Cayman GTS, and I`ll keep the the 1M.

All the driver goodies in it, PSAM, SCP, PTV, PDLS, PDK,Sports exhaust, PCCB, 20" Carrera Classic, Nav/Telephone stuff.

It was a hard decision for I had an E46 M3, E92 M3 and now a E82 1M (this car will be a keeper) and I had high expectatations over the F82 M4.
But IMHO it has outgrown it self, too big, too stretched, it has a certain puffy look over it like Jabba the Hut (no offense ) It lacks the outside sportiness IMHO that used to be typical M3 territory.

There is no doubt what so ever, the M3-4 are absolutely (very) fast cars, surplus on HP and Nm, and will kill a Cayman GTS straight line speed easy.

What the 1M has thought me; small, nimble and agile cars will do the job for me, so the Cayman will fit perfectly, and I will have the best of two worlds. A 2 seater PDK sportscar with a brilliant NA 6 boxer engine, an a 4 seater manual with a brilliant 6 IL TT engine.

In 2 or 3 years I,ll take on the coming M2, for now I`m enjoying these 2 cars !

Congrats, the GTS is looking to be an utter masterpiece in typical Porsche fashion. Maybe the best sports car ever?
The 1M will def not feel the same after driving the GTS though. It will redefine light, nimble and balanced.

[Romo]

Originally Posted by FTS

Couple of recommendations:

• Consider the GTS interior package. It is a unique package that would increase resale value
• If you intend to track with the car, I'd leave out PTV
• Consider sport suspension if you don't mind a little harshness during DD work. Porsche is very good in shock calibration, and the sport suspension is probably the best they have come up with thus far. And the additional 10 mm drop in ride height makes the car's stance perfect even though on paper it is only 10 mm, the look is brilliant. Although it can be retrofit later on, the labor cost (not parts) will be more, replacing the A/R bars are a PITA.
• Unless it is for visual reasons, PCCBs are not worth it on a Porsche as the steel brakes are truly superb. However, after you get your car, consider installing GT3 master cylinder for improve pedal feel and track duty.

Best of luck and enjoy the new car.

Thanks !

I have considered the sport suspension, but too low, even with PASM ground clearance is only 99mm, sport suspension (and I agree it will look superb) will make it a poor 89mm, with the 1M at 110mm I have troubles enough

I will not attend track, so PTV can stay.

The interior package is a PITA as it comes to $$$ or €€€, for just some color stitching it isn`t worth it, now for the PCCB, they are costly as well but do look far more better then the relatively small standard brakes in 20" wheels. I had a fair amount off discount on the whole package, so it makes them worthwhile !

[mister2d]

Originally Posted by Romo

Thanks !

I have considered the sport suspension, but too low, even with PASM ground clearance is only 99mm, sport suspension (and I agree it will look superb) will make it a poor 89mm, with the 1M at 110mm I have troubles enough

I will not attend track, so PTV can stay.

The interior package is a PITA as it comes to $$$ or €€€, for just some color stitching it isn`t worth it, now for the PCCB, they are costly as well but do look far more better then the relatively small standard brakes in 20" wheels. I had a fair amount off discount on the whole package, so it makes them worthwhile !

Wow, no track time but you ordered PCCB? Yikes. Hope it doesn't bite you someday.

Anyway enjoy your 981 because I sure am. Fit and finish on the interior is superb. Solid everywhere from door latches to sun shade to the crispness of the turning stalk. It's a very well crafted car.

[visualguy]

Originally Posted by Romo

It was a hard decision for I had an E46 M3, E92 M3 and now a E82 1M (this car will be a keeper) and I had high expectatations over the F82 M4.
But IMHO it has outgrown it self, too big, too stretched, it has a certain puffy look over it like Jabba the Hut (no offense ) It lacks the outside sportiness IMHO that used to be typical M3 territory.

Yes - the M4 is too big. In particular, it's too long. I was surprised to see that it's bigger than the Audi S5 in all dimensions. Also, the design is kind of a mess.

Still, if I could own only one car, I would prefer the M4 to the Cayman. I see the Cayman as a fun sports car to drive on certain occasions, not as a daily driver. It's just too low, too noisy, and draws too much unwanted attention.

[Sparco]

Originally Posted by visualguy

Yes - the M4 is too big. In particular, it's too long. I was surprised to see that it's bigger than the Audi S5 in all dimensions. Also, the design is kind of a mess.

Still, if I could own only one car, I would prefer the M4 to the Cayman. I see the Cayman as a fun sports car to drive on certain occasions, not as a daily driver. It's just too low, too noisy, and draws too much unwanted attention.

Where did you see the M4 is bigger in all dimensions to an S5. If that is the case, I definitely will be going the Cayman route. I cant tell you the mistake I made going WITH an Audi S5 only to realize once the novelty wore off that it was somewhat portly for lack of a better word.

[visualguy]

Audi S5: 182.7"(L) X 53.9"(H) X 73"(W)
BMW M4: 184.5"(L) X 54.4"(H) X 73.6"(W)

The M4 is larger in all dimensions than the S5. In terms of weight: the M4 is only about 7% lighter than the S5.

[stylinexpat]

Originally Posted by half man half amazin

Exactly! I drove the Cayman S last week and it reminded me of the e92 with the lack of torque. Great car, but not a lot of creature comforts, and torque definitely makes me smile 😊

I agree,it definitely is missing some torque. I own a Cayman as and owned an M3 before this as well.

[stylinexpat]

Originally Posted by visualguy

The two things I don't like about the Cayman are the excessively noisy cabin (the tire noise is particularly annoying), and the low ground clearance (99mm with PASM vs 121mm on the M4).

I find the cabin noise to be quite nice. There is cabin noise though (It's a Porsche and a sports car). I chose not to get the Sports suspension on my Cayman S due to ground clearance. It definitely sits too low for California roads. If the roads were better made I would get the lower sitting Cayman S but this is not the UAE or Japan with circuit like roads that are paved nice,flat and smoothly. I drove them both back to back before buying my Cayman S. I liked the handling on the Cayman S with the lower Sports suspension more but I really would be bottoming out and scraping the bottom and front end a lot more often with that lower sports suspension. Due to California's poorly built roads,freeways and highways I found the regular Cayman S with 19" wheels to be better only because it is more suitable for our California streets,roads,freeways and highways.

[thebigcheese]

The cayman s is a very fun car so i can only imagine what the cayman gts holds. Still excited for my m3 though!

[mister2d]

Originally Posted by unitz

The cayman s is a very fun car so i can only imagine what the cayman gts holds. Still excited for my m3 though!

The GTS is just an S with a body kit and a couple more ponies. Everything else you can option on a regular Cayman S. You wouldn't see much, if at all, any difference.

[thebigcheese]

Originally Posted by mister2d

The GTS is just an S with a body kit and a couple more ponies. Everything else you can option on a regular Cayman S. You wouldn't see much, if at all, any difference.

oh wow, well its still going to be a fun car. M3 FTW

[mister2d]

Originally Posted by Prowess Symphony

You really lay it on thick man. Your hyperbole and Porsche praise is pretty comical no offense.

He may be laying it on thick, but I believe him to be telling the truth.

Take a hint from me: DO NOT test drive a Cayman. Lol