The GTS is an amazing deal right now

[2K7]

Originally Posted by Gomeler

I believe the GTS weighs around 3550 lbs. Lemme find the thread with the car on scales.


edit: 3550lbs here -> https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=25056545

I'll have my car put on scales when I install camber plates for another datapoint.

I haven't taken a look at that thread but according to BMW, it's 1,510 kg (~3,320 lbs) for the GTS.

so then the GTS weighs almost 200 lbs more than what BMW is stating on paper? has someone put a CS on the scale to compare?

[Gomeler]

Originally Posted by 2K7

I haven't taken a look at that thread but according to BMW, it's 1,510 kg (~3,320 lbs) for the GTS.

Is BMW stating the dry weight, without fluids/fuel?

I don't know if anyone has weighed a CS and published the results, for the most part I just stick in the GTS sub-forum.

edit: and I do agree in a sense, I feel like BMW was bashed a bit for the GTS. I hope that doesn't prevent them from bring track-focused cars to North America. A M2CSL would be incredible. That's a platform that should definitely weigh a few hundred pounds less than the base chassis.

[redrumm3]

As the proud owner of both the E30 M3 and a GTS, I think in general the NA market and media is not sophisticated enough to appreciate the virtues of each car initially. It is my opinion that we will not see another car in the NA market again in the near future, if ever, like the GTS.

There are many similarities with each of the two cars. The E30 M3 was panned much the same way as the GTS is today. Many said the M3 was not worth the price difference over the standard 325is.

Unfortunately the NA Media did not understand or take advantage of the virtues of the GTS in its testing of the car. With some set up the car is very capable, and offered a significant price advantage over its competitors. Also BMW NA did not support the car well in the testing either.

Fortunately, the GTS was offered in a much more limited basis than the E30 M3. I believe in time for those of us smart enough to hold on to the GTS we will see the the appreciation for the car and market value increase in much the same way.

Clearly the EU market gets it and understands the GTS and its track focused intent much better than here in the NA market.

Better buy one now why the price is right. There may not be a better time and this type of car may not pass this way again from BMW.

[2K7]

Originally Posted by Gomeler

Is BMW stating the dry weight, without fluids/fuel?

I don't know if anyone has weighed a CS and published the results, for the most part I just stick in the GTS sub-forum.

edit: and I do agree in a sense, I feel like BMW was bashed a bit for the GTS. I hope that doesn't prevent them from bring track-focused cars to North America. A M2CSL would be incredible. That's a platform that should definitely weigh a few hundred pounds less than the base chassis.

Not sure if that is the dry weight. It's what BMW published for the GTS though.

In case anyone is wondering, the average asking price of a GTS for sale on cargurus, cars.com, autotrader as of right now based on all cars available (~10-15 depending on the site) is $95,308.

[M Crazy]

Thx for the insight. I have been researching the GTS lately, and also have the same feeling that the car will appreciate in value. Love the Frozen Gray.

[FormulaMMM]

Smell-test on GTS values, by whatever criteria you want. Drive on track or a back road dialed in, see the interest it generates in a paddock (from enthusiasts of all varieties), pull into a gas station, roll through downtown, ask if your date would rather uber, look at it sitting in your garage... There's no reasonable argument to be made that values should be lower than what they are.

[Rguy]

Im always amazed at how many "Car guys", even the ones who consider themselves hardcore ones dont have a clue about it...or know very, very little. I think the GTS will follow the usual "wasnt appreciated at the time" price trends previous niche cars have followed. Too expensive when it was sold for what it was and criticized. A decade or so of mediocre/below average prices...and then at some point people will realize how special the car is, how few really exist (804 and already probably ~20 are gone/destroyed by now) and prices will rebound. Supra, NSX, ITR, E30, E36 LTW, Dino, etc. Its almost inevitable since the GTS has what those cars also have but in spades.

[kwalshuncw]

I've been wanting a GTS since I saw it at the NY Auto Show in 16 but my local dealership didn't receive an allocation. I starting tracking the used market about 2 years and was shocked to see the value dropping and I said to my salesman "If they drop in the 70s and 80s I'm buying one." I honestly never thought that day would come. Last week Mercedes of Fort Mitchell got in a 1,500 mile GTS and I snatched it up for $83,750+tax. They said they had a few people on it. The cheaper ones listed have a lot of shop days on their file so I'm assuming they're slightly beat up. I think the $80-$90k range is the sweet spot for the GTS right now.

[Darth One]

I’ve made this post in other threads here, but i’ll make it again as a possible low-water mark for GTS values.

In April and May of this year, i tried to trade my 10k mile (at the time) GTS in. Offers from multiple dealers (franchised BMW, other new car dealer, and Carmax) in 5 states were between $62-65k.

Let’s see how much i have to gain going forward by not accepting these offers that i considered extremely insulting and disappointing

[2K7]

Originally Posted by Darth One

I've made this post in other threads here, but i'll make it again as a possible low-water mark for GTS values.

In April and May of this year, i tried to trade my 10k mile (at the time) GTS in. Offers from multiple dealers (franchised BMW, other new car dealer, and Carmax) in 5 states were between $62-65k.

Let's see how much i have to gain going forward by not accepting these offers that i considered extremely insulting and disappointing

Have you tried again? I feel like prices are on the uptick. Dealers will try to lowball you. 10k mileage is on the high side for a GTS but there's no way I would ever let the car go for $65k!!

[2K7]

Originally Posted by kwalshuncw

I've been wanting a GTS since I saw it at the NY Auto Show in 16 but my local dealership didn't receive an allocation. I starting tracking the used market about 2 years and was shocked to see the value dropping and I said to my salesman "If they drop in the 70s and 80s I'm buying one." I honestly never thought that day would come. Last week Mercedes of Fort Mitchell got in a 1,500 mile GTS and I snatched it up for $83,750+tax. They said they had a few people on it. The cheaper ones listed have a lot of shop days on their file so I'm assuming they're slightly beat up. I think the $80-$90k range is the sweet spot for the GTS right now.

Congrats!!! I saw it listed only a few days ago. It's still listed but good to hear it's been sold and that you are the lucky new owner! You will love the car. I have a database of GTS cars I've been tracking since 2017.

[Darth One]

Originally Posted by 2K7

Have you tried again? I feel like prices are on the uptick. Dealers will try to lowball you. 10k mileage is on the high side for a GTS but there's no way I would ever let the car go for $65k!!

No, and i probably won’t for awhile. I’ve convinced myself that i should just drive my now “worthless” car...it has 12k miles now.

I don’t believe those offers are lowballs btw. I think they accurately represented wholesale prices at the time. Besides getting these quotes from dealers in pretty much every US metro area, I forgot to mention that i had someone check auction prices and the results were comparable.

Maybe someone with current wholesale data can chime in. If low mileage examples are at high 70’s to low 80’s retail, then my high mileage car probably is still at 65k wholesale, but i’m just eyeballing things here...

[minn19]

Originally Posted by 2K7

CS curb weight is ~3600 lbs. GTS ~3300lbs. We're not talking just a "few" pounds in difference.

Why would you think they are that big of difference? Mechanically they essentially the same and the GTS has a few things that are heavier than the CS. Such as the 666 wheels, which I honestly don't know why they are on this car as stock (my dislike for their looks aside). The water injection, heavier adjustable wing and I'm guessing the adjustable suspension is heavier as well than the stock CS suspension. I'm not sure of the weight difference between the seat removal and then adding the roll bar. The roll bar could be heavier than the rear seat delete. They share the hood and interior "weight savings" etc. I'm not sure where you think BMW could shave hundreds of pounds off of the GTS compared to a CS.

I had my CS corner balanced and it came in at 3634 with just less than a half a tank of gas. I have a base/lightest M4 CS you can get and the only mod is MP HAS. I'm guessing real world GTS weights are similar with comparable fuel etc.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by FormulaMMM

Smell-test on GTS values, by whatever criteria you want. Drive on track or a back road dialed in, see the interest it generates in a paddock (from enthusiasts of all varieties), pull into a gas station, roll through downtown, ask if your date would rather uber, look at it sitting in your garage... There's no reasonable argument to be made that values should be lower than what they are.

Sure there are. Economy possibly slowing, the fact that it is a two passenger car with a roll bar (limiting the market of available buyers). Competition the such as the new mid engine Vette possibly being cheaper than a used GTS etc.

That being said, I do think the GTS is a hell of a deal/package in the 80s etc.

[nickl630]

Originally Posted by Darth One

No, and i probably won’t for awhile. I’ve convinced myself that i should just drive my now “worthless” car...it has 12k miles now.

I don’t believe those offers are lowballs btw. I think they accurately represented wholesale prices at the time. Besides getting these quotes from dealers in pretty much every US metro area, I forgot to mention that i had someone check auction prices and the results were comparable.

Maybe someone with current wholesale data can chime in. If low mileage examples are at high 70’s to low 80’s retail, then my high mileage car probably is still at 65k wholesale, but i’m just eyeballing things here...

Pretty accurate with their offers. Its just what its worth wholesale. For a niche/high-line car 10k miles is VERY high.

[nickl630]

Also... pretty amusing to read some people here think the GTS will be worth 175-200k. While we cant predict the future the current dealer market/trend shows no signs of the GTS going up in value and I feel there were simply too many made for that to happen.

The M3CS was made in lower numbers and I fully anticipate mine to be worth 50k at turn-in, the M4CS is already getting destroyed. All models were also trashed by reviews and critics (this wont matter value wise)

The 1M while pushing 60's-70's in absolute mint condition is nowhere near that number... and is more "exclusive" over any F8x

Maybe the only car I can think of is the E46 CSL or the E92 CRT, both did not come to NA.

30 years from now? Who knows.. but if you think this car or any modern F8x will be north of 6 figures 5 years from now.... well it just wont happen.

Edit: I dont want to seem like im just bashing the GTS, I have a CS and fully expect it to be worthless, both our cars were hated by reviewers over price mostly, both had too high of production numbers to be "rare". At 80k the GTS is a fantastic car and should be bought to be enjoyed... not as a "investment" lol. Who knows where the market will go.. it'll take a decade to see the results. Enjoy and drive your damn cars!

[Darth One]

Originally Posted by nickl630

Pretty accurate with their offers. Its just what its worth wholesale. For a niche/high-line car 10k miles is VERY high.

THANK YOU. Appreciate getting hard data, whether or not i like the story that the data actually tells...

[2K7]

Originally Posted by minn19

Why would you think they are that big of difference? Mechanically they essentially the same and the GTS has a few things that are heavier than the CS. Such as the 666 wheels, which I honestly don't know why they are on this car as stock (my dislike for their looks aside). The water injection, heavier adjustable wing and I'm guessing the adjustable suspension is heavier as well than the stock CS suspension. I'm not sure of the weight difference between the seat removal and then adding the roll bar. The roll bar could be heavier than the rear seat delete. They share the hood and interior "weight savings" etc. I'm not sure where you think BMW could shave hundreds of pounds off of the GTS compared to a CS.

I had my CS corner balanced and it came in at 3634 with just less than a half a tank of gas. I have a base/lightest M4 CS you can get and the only mod is MP HAS. I'm guessing real world GTS weights are similar with comparable fuel etc.

Because that's what BMW says the GTS weighs. Also, doesn't make any sense that the roll bar in the GTS would weigh more than the rear seats. I know the GTS exhaust is lighter than the CS exhaust. What does BMW say is the official curb weight for your CS?

[2K7]

Originally Posted by nickl630

Also... pretty amusing to read some people here think the GTS will be worth 175-200k. While we cant predict the future the current dealer market/trend shows no signs of the GTS going up in value and I feel there were simply too many made for that to happen.

The M3CS was made in lower numbers and I fully anticipate mine to be worth 50k at turn-in, the M4CS is already getting destroyed. All models were also trashed by reviews and critics (this wont matter value wise)

The 1M while pushing 60's-70's in absolute mint condition is nowhere near that number... and is more "exclusive" over any F8x

Maybe the only car I can think of is the E46 CSL or the E92 CRT, both did not come to NA.

30 years from now? Who knows.. but if you think this car or any modern F8x will be north of 6 figures 5 years from now.... well it just wont happen.

Edit: I dont want to seem like im just bashing the GTS, I have a CS and fully expect it to be worthless, both our cars were hated by reviewers over price mostly, both had too high of production numbers to be "rare". At 80k the GTS is a fantastic car and should be bought to be enjoyed... not as a "investment" lol. Who knows where the market will go.. it'll take a decade to see the results. Enjoy and drive your damn cars!

The 1M is more exclusive than the GTS? really? lol. Just for Canada and US alone, there were more 1Ms made than all of the GTS for the entire world.

I don't know why it's amusing considering there are plenty of GTS listed and selling for close to $200K usd right now or above outside of the US. Autoscout which is the largest car marketplace in Europe has 46 GTS and DTM GTS for sale right now. GTS prices around the world are approximately the same as a 488. See for yourself.

https://www.autoscout24.com/lst/bmw/...0=GTS&atype=C&

https://www.autoscout24.com/lst/ferr...age=1&atype=C&

It won't take a decade in the US to see significant price increases on the GTS in the US. I believe all low mileage, accident free GTS cars in the US will be selling for $100K+ within 5-7 years (conservative estimate). Feel free to wager a bet. I'll bet $10,000. If I'm wrong, I owe you $10K. If you're wrong, you owe me $10K.

[SunnyD]

Originally Posted by nickl630

The M3CS was made in lower numbers

I don't understand this statement...M3 CS production numbers totaled 1,200 units worldwide, while the GTS totaled 800.

[nickl630]

Originally Posted by 2K7

I don't know why it's amusing considering there are plenty of GTS listed and selling for close to $200K usd right now or above outside of the US. Autoscout which is the largest car marketplace in Europe has 46 GTS and DTM GTS for sale right now. GTS prices around the world are approximately the same as a 488. See for yourself.

https://www.autoscout24.com/lst/bmw/...0=GTS&atype=C&

https://www.autoscout24.com/lst/ferr...age=1&atype=C&

It won't take a decade in the US to see significant price increases on the GTS in the US.

Europe is a totally different market.

[2K7]

Originally Posted by nickl630

Europe is a totally different market.

feel free to make me a bet then. it can also be a friendly bet if you don't want to put any money down.