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      01-20-2021, 08:49 AM   #2179
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      01-20-2021, 09:06 AM   #2180
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Cars/trucks/SUVs everything with 4 wheels is just getting bigger. Cell phones are getting bigger as well, hell look at the size of the iPhones (especially the max) today vs 5 years ago. Bigger is better with human nature and I don't think that is ever going to change.
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      01-20-2021, 10:44 AM   #2181
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Originally Posted by RugbyBro View Post
I can’t believe I just watched a tech video on F****** seats -_-

Also, I’m still incredibly perplexed by the concept of carbon buckets in a car this heavy. This video has now clarified that they aren’t true buckets, just a lighter electric seat with carbon seat backs... very boy racer
Have not watched the whole video. So the seat shell is not made of carbon fiber reinforced plastic?
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      01-20-2021, 11:39 AM   #2182
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Originally Posted by kyrix1st View Post
Have not watched the whole video. So the seat shell is not made of carbon fiber reinforced plastic?
From what I gather, they are not true "bucket seats" per se, with the backrest separate from the seat base for adjustability. Only the backrest shell is made of CFRP.
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      01-20-2021, 11:41 AM   #2183
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Originally Posted by kyrix1st View Post
Have not watched the whole video. So the seat shell is not made of carbon fiber reinforced plastic?
The shells are but the seat isn't what I would consider a "bucket seat". It's a two piece, fully electric & adjustable seat with a *lighter* weight design than the standard seats. In my view, it's probably just ticking the looks box and from that perspective it probably matches the ethos of this car. To their credit, they look really cool (banana hammock and all)

Who knows, we don't actually know the weight of the seats and I maybe eating my shorts in a couple months because BMW has revolutionized seat design and created a 15 lb electric seat, but until then I think anyone who is actually going to make this thing into a serious track toy is going to scrap those seats for true fixed buckets.
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      01-20-2021, 11:51 AM   #2184
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Originally Posted by swagon View Post
You know how many people bitch about the lack of Comfort Access in any car these days? CS didn't have it and people got mad. Too lazy to click a button on a key fob they're carrying with them anyway. Same with manual seats. Way too many people would probably go, "this is a 95k car and it doesn't have memory seats?"
Manual seats I didn't care, but it was dumb to not let CA or the armrest at least be an option IMO. And I had a M4 CS for awhile. 3600 pounds or 3620 wasn't going to make a difference in overall performance one iota. CA can't be that heavy, same for the armrest. I know, it all adds up yada yada, which is why they should've made it an option.
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      01-20-2021, 12:00 PM   #2185
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Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
Manual seats I didn't care, but it was dumb to not let CA or the armrest at least be an option IMO. And I had a M4 CS for awhile. 3600 pounds or 3620 wasn't going to make a difference in overall performance one iota. CA can't be that heavy, same for the armrest. I know, it all adds up yada yada, which is why they should've made it an option.
IMO, the armrest deletion is not only about weight. I really appreciate the added elbow room it provides to handle the steering on track.
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      01-20-2021, 12:01 PM   #2186
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IMO, the armrest deletion is not only about weight. I really appreciate the added elbow room it provides to handle the steering on track.
Right, so make it an option.
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      01-20-2021, 12:09 PM   #2187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swagon View Post
You know how many people bitch about the lack of Comfort Access in any car these days? CS didn't have it and people got mad. Too lazy to click a button on a key fob they're carrying with them anyway. Same with manual seats. Way too many people would probably go, "this is a 95k car and it doesn't have memory seats?"
It is not about laziness if you are using it as a DD - the CA option is really nice (I do use it all the time to open my trunk leaving work with my hands full). And get this, I use CA at least twice per day! But I don't change my seat position very often. So kill the power seats (including the one on the passenger side if it has it) - that will lower the seat height and save a LOT more weight. Oh but one last thing - I bet most people don't realize they don't have CA until they get home with the new car - but power seats? Yea, they would notice that - so maybe this is all a ploy by BMW marketing

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Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
Manual seats I didn't care, but it was dumb to not let CA or the armrest at least be an option IMO. And I had a M4 CS for awhile. 3600 pounds or 3620 wasn't going to make a difference in overall performance one iota. CA can't be that heavy, same for the armrest. I know, it all adds up yada yada, which is why they should've made it an option.
It still makes me laugh that you could get that car with the Exec package, the Power Rear Sunshade, the Adaptive LED Lights, the Heads Up Display... but nooo, noo comfort access. BMW is funny sometimes...
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      01-20-2021, 12:21 PM   #2188
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It is not about laziness if you are using it as a DD - the CA option is really nice (I do use it all the time to open my trunk leaving work with my hands full). And get this, I use CA at least twice per day! But I don't change my seat position very often. So kill the power seats (including the one on the passenger side if it has it) - that will lower the seat height and save a LOT more weight. Oh but one last thing - I bet most people don't realize they don't have CA until they get home with the new car - but power seats? Yea, they would notice that - so maybe this is all a ploy by BMW marketing
The key fob with my M Performance case is too bulky to put in my jeans pockets so I have it in my hand already and might as well click the button. I'd rather not have memory seats, but I do use memory function as I slide my seat back for better access and less bolster wear. It's about priorities. And I'm also the type of guy that prefers the E9x ignition where I put the key in the dash and click the button. At least the key had its own place unlike now.

They should make CA available as an option either way.

On Mercs, you can disable CA by holding the lock button or something, which helps prevent dickheads from remotely stealing your car.
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      01-20-2021, 12:34 PM   #2189
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Originally Posted by doug_999 View Post
It is not about laziness if you are using it as a DD - the CA option is really nice (I do use it all the time to open my trunk leaving work with my hands full). And get this, I use CA at least twice per day! But I don't change my seat position very often. So kill the power seats (including the one on the passenger side if it has it) - that will lower the seat height and save a LOT more weight. Oh but one last thing - I bet most people don't realize they don't have CA until they get home with the new car - but power seats? Yea, they would notice that - so maybe this is all a ploy by BMW marketing


It still makes me laugh that you could get that car with the Exec package, the Power Rear Sunshade, the Adaptive LED Lights, the Heads Up Display... but nooo, noo comfort access. BMW is funny sometimes...
Exactly, I get it though, BMW isn't the only one that does it as there is plenty of weirdness with other brands. It's just odd where certain ones decide to make something available or not.

Not to go back down the weird rabbit hole experience I had with my M4 CS, but I also thought it odd they didn't have the MP HAS available as an option for the CS line. And in my case, according to BMW NA it wasn't even designed for it and thus officially unavailable.
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      01-20-2021, 12:45 PM   #2190
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CA cannot weigh that much more than the regular door handles and the module couldn't be more than a pound or two. Seems more like a cost cutting than anything from BMW. Same reason for the fact that they don't put CA on the rear doors.

CA is not only a convenience feature, but IMO a safety feature as it keeps your hands free of the fob when quickly trying to get into your car, say during a rain storm, getting away from a perp, running to safety, etc.
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      01-20-2021, 12:48 PM   #2191
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CA cannot weigh that much more than the regular door handles and the module couldn't be more than a pound or two. Seems more like a cost cutting than anything from BMW. Same reason for the fact that they don't put CA on the rear doors.

CA is not only a convenience feature, but IMO a safety feature as it keeps your hands free of the fob when quickly trying to get into your car, say during a rain storm, getting away from a perp, running to safety, etc.
Living in one of the coldest climates in the US, it is one of my favorite/most useful options ever to come on any car. Can I live without just fine, sure, do I want to if I have a choice, nope.
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      01-20-2021, 12:55 PM   #2192
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      01-20-2021, 01:27 PM   #2193
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Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
Living in one of the coldest climates in the US, it is one of my favorite/most useful options ever to come on any car. Can I live without just fine, sure, do I want to if I have a choice, nope.
I can't imagine not having my M4 without Executive and CA - give me all the toys and luxuries!
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      01-20-2021, 01:33 PM   #2194
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If my car didn't have comfort access I'd want a place to put the keys, kind of like how MB had the old removable start stop buttons. To this day I still prefer the act of turning a key though.
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      01-20-2021, 02:42 PM   #2195
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If my car didn't have comfort access I'd want a place to put the keys, kind of like how MB had the old removable start stop buttons. To this day I still prefer the act of turning a key though.
My Cayman is funny as they've tried to combine both. I have their version of CA and they keep a faux permanent "key" you turn the ignition with instead of pushing a button. Took me a little while to get used to. It is a gimmick, but kind of a cool one.
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      01-20-2021, 02:45 PM   #2196
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Right, so make it an option.
So you would need to design and offer two distinct center consoles...
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      01-20-2021, 02:49 PM   #2197
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So you would need to design and offer two distinct center consoles...
Not really, they already had the stock one and they designed a new one for the CS (which was already designed for the GTS?). Offer yes, but with both cars rolling of the line anyway I don't think it would've been that big of a deal. Didn't the M3 CS have the original one with the armrest and door cards/pulls? I can't remember anymore.

I didn't track my M3/4s nearly as much as you did, but I did quite a few times and I still to this day don't get the elbow thing on the armrest. It was no big deal for me as I just bought a cheap pillow to stuff there for my arm.

Edit: Just saw the M3 CS didn't have the armrest either, but did have the regular door cards/pulls. Even stranger IMO.
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      01-20-2021, 02:58 PM   #2198
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Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
Not really, they already had the stock one and they designed a new one for the CS (which was already designed for the GTS?). Offer yes, but with both cars rolling of the line anyway I don't think it would've been that big of a deal. Didn't the M3 CS have the original one with the armrest and door cards/pulls? I can't remember anymore.

I didn't track my M3/4s nearly as much as you did, but I did quite a few times and I still to this day don't get the elbow thing on the armrest. It was no big deal for me as I just bought a cheap pillow to stuff there for my arm.

Edit: Just saw the M3 CS didn't have the armrest either, but did have the regular door cards/pulls. Even stranger IMO.
It's not that strange IMO, the CS are essentially "parts bin" cars with most of the R&D money going into the tuning development.

They already had the center console without armrest adapted for the single zone HVAC from the GTS, so they simply used that for the M4cs and M3cs. They already had the lightweight door cards from the GTS, so they used that on the M4cs. However, since these would not fit the 4-door M3, they took the 30jahre edition interior for the M3cs.

The only true unique parts are the front CF splitter and rear deck Gurney flap.
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      01-20-2021, 03:06 PM   #2199
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Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
It's not that strange IMO, the CS are essentially "parts bin" cars with most of the R&D money going into the tuning development.

They already had the center console without armrest adapted for the single zone HVAC from the GTS, so they simply used that for the M4cs and M3cs. They already had the lightweight door cards from the GTS, so they used that on the M4cs. However, since these would not fit the 4-door M3, they took the 30jahre edition interior for the M3cs.

The only true unique parts are the front CF splitter and rear deck Gurney flap.
That's what I was saying, they already had both versions, so it was just a matter of working it into the production like anything else. They were already charging a hefty premium for those here (tried to anyway) so they may as well of given people a choice on it.

I guess strange from a stated mission part or something like that. If the CS was supposed to be a more track focused/special car yada yada, why the difference between the M3/4 CSs? I remember the marketing talking about them as part of cutting the weight etc. It couldn't of been that hard or expensive to make cardboard cutouts for the M3 CSs.

Ah fun to rehash old arguments from the past.
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      01-20-2021, 03:14 PM   #2200
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Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
That's what I was saying, they already had both versions, so it was just a matter of working it into the production like anything else. They were already charging a hefty premium for those here (tried to anyway) so they may as well of given people a choice on it.

I guess strange from a stated mission part or something like that. If the CS was supposed to be a more track focused/special car yada yada, why the difference between the M3/4 CSs? I remember the marketing talking about them as part of cutting the weight etc. It couldn't of been that hard or expensive to make cardboard cutouts for the M3 CSs.

Ah fun to rehash old arguments from the past.
So you're saying they should have offered the CS without the single zone climate HVAC and the standard center console? Sure they could, but that would increase the production/distribution complexity on a relatively low volume car and increase cost further. Option choices were rather limited on the CS. BMW-NA did overprice the CS in the US, not BMW AG who produces the cars.

The M3cs was an afterthought really, rushed at the last minute, particularly aimed at the US market. Minimal investment was the goal IMO.
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