Manual versus model year value

[clubracer6]

Would a 15 manual be worth the same as a 17 DCT assuming everything else is the same? I really would prefer a manual, but I can get a 17 DCT in similar spec for about the same or a tad bit more. Crazy to still go for the 15?

Thanks!

[N1rve]

Originally Posted by clubracer6

Would a 15 manual be worth the same as a 17 DCT assuming everything else is the same? I really would prefer a manual, but I can get a 17 DCT in similar spec for about the same or a tad bit more. Crazy to still go for the 15?

Thanks!

If you want to get this car to be more engaged while driving, get a manual with the options/features that you want.

If you want to have a car with launch control, have uber lighting fast shifts, quick kickdown acceleration, get the DCT.

After driving both, IMO DCT is the way to go for this car. The DCT is no slouch at all and you still get some of the quirks of a MT like you need to apply gas to start rolling, if you are on an incline in D and you get off the brakes and don't apply gas, the car will start rolling back like a MT.

The MT is really forgiving to drive manual though because it has a dual mass flywheel which makes it very easy to drive.

Usually later cars have some sort of revisons and bug fixes and there is a different torque curve for a 2015 than a 2017. Peak torque begins sooner on a 2015 than a 2017. There is also different iDrive versions and BMW discontinued 3G if that matters to you.

[darrvao777]

Originally Posted by clubracer6

Would a 15 manual be worth the same as a 17 DCT assuming everything else is the same? I really would prefer a manual, but I can get a 17 DCT in similar spec for about the same or a tad bit more. Crazy to still go for the 15?

Thanks!

i honestly didn't even consider DCT and wound up with a low mileage (17000) 2015 f82

i don't track the car, i would argue i don't even drive that aggressively so in many ways the benefits of the DCT are wasted on me

i am fortunate my car is a daily driver and i live in an area where i head against traffic (with minimal traffic at baseline)

hour long commute one-way is never fun but it's a smidge more tolerable when rowing the gears to a M car on the way to work 🙂

[clubracer6]

Thanks guys, but I am manual guy. My question was purely about monetary value. Thanks again.

[henrylee]

I would rather have a 15 manual than a 17 DCT

[MJBO]

Originally Posted by N1rve

There is also different iDrive versions and BMW discontinued 3G if that matters to you.

Assuming you’re referring to the disconnection of 3G services by American carriers.

My 3G Connected Drive works perfectly here in Aus.

[N1rve]

Originally Posted by clubracer6

Thanks guys, but I am manual guy. My question was purely about monetary value. Thanks again.

Most of the time as a car ages, only enthusists want the car and the manual will demand more $$$. That is what you are seeing now and as the car continues to age, usually DCTs will not carry that higher demand price as no normal person would want an old BMW as the DCT would scare most people away if it dies.

Typically I would stay away from 1st model year cars as those typically have a lot of teething issues. In 2017 there was a redesign of the bedplate which may or may not be important to you.

ZCP aka "Competition Package" also makes the car tend to hold value better which was available in late 2016. ZCP E90 M3s are demanding a higher price tag than a non-ZCP E90 M3.

Originally Posted by MJBO

Assuming you’re referring to the disconnection of 3G services by American carriers.

My 3G Connected Drive works perfectly here in Aus.

Yes.

[Humdizzle]

the manual car will hold value better. especially if its a f80.

if you think about there really aren't any other manuals in this segment unless you want a GM product. Mercedes c63, Audi RS5, Alfa giuilia quad... all automatic only. the manual f80 has this part of the market covered.

and there is no difference in the model years. the major change was the expensive icon headlights in 2018.

[krudmunk]

Originally Posted by N1rve

Most of the time as a car ages, only enthusists want the car and the manual will demand more $$$. That is what you are seeing now and as the car continues to age, usually DCTs will not carry that higher demand price as no normal person would want an old BMW as the DCT would scare most people away if it dies.

Typically I would stay away from 1st model year cars as those typically have a lot of teething issues. In 2017 there was a redesign of the bedplate which may or may not be important to you.

ZCP aka "Competition Package" also makes the car tend to hold value better which was available in late 2016. ZCP E90 M3s are demanding a higher price tag than a non-ZCP E90 M3.

Yes.

I thought the new bedplate redesign was on 2016 LCI models as well.

Anyways, I agree with what he is saying. Maybe the DCT with later year might hold value a slightly better as most people would prefer to stay away from first production model years even though it is a manual. This is specifically comparing 2017 DCT and 2015 6MT. But if you compare 2017 DCT and 2017 6MT, then I think the 6MT will hold value better as there is more demand.

Manual is more sought after as generation ages. I think in general with manuals base or comp tend to make very minor difference to some people. But most who prefer to mod tend to prefer base over comp.

The comp is just a tune with EDC suspension, 666M wheels, sway bar, comp seats, and black badges.

Folks that seek DCT for fast and quickness will most likely go after the G8x 8 speed automatics because those are much faster.

[us722]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

the manual car will hold value better. especially if its a f80.

if you think about there really aren't any other manuals in this segment unless you want a GM product. Mercedes c63, Audi RS5, Alfa giuilia quad... all automatic only. the manual f80 has this part of the market covered.

and there is no difference in the model years. the major change was the expensive icon headlights in 2018.

What’s this teething issue the poster above talked about? I thought crank hub is the only (if that) issue with this gen.

I agree with the poster above that after a certain point the enthusiasts are main buyers and they prefer manual. This dictates a premium. You saw E9X series people say that DCT is day and night vs E46 SMG which might be true but DCT cars are going for less than manual nowadays.

[Humdizzle]

Originally Posted by us722

What’s this teething issue the poster above talked about? I thought crank hub is the only (if that) issue with this gen.

I agree with the poster above that after a certain point the enthusiasts are main buyers and they prefer manual. This dictates a premium. You saw E9X series people say that DCT is day and night vs E46 SMG which might be true but DCT cars are going for less than manual nowadays.

not sure what your question is. DCT transmissions are worlds better than SMG in every way. the only upside to an SMG e46 is that you can easily convert it to manual.

but manual will always win out over anything with paddles for enthusiast dollars. its seen more like an exclusive club.

[RugbyBro]

To answer OP’s question, all things equal I’d say the ‘17 DCT will still be worth more as it is 2 MY younger. However, in relative terms the ‘17 DCT will have a higher rate of depreciation than the ‘15 6MT. That’s just the 6MT premium as these cars age.

[clubracer6]

Thanks all. Based on my shopping,it seems the 15 manuals are going for about what 16 DCT's are going for. A 16 manual a bit more and around the same price as a 17 or 18 DCT. I was tempted by a few DCT cars but could not bring myself to do it. It was also tough to find a mostly stock car.

[Soul Coughing]

When I was searching for a 4 door car big enough to fit my growing family, there were not many vehicles that were fun and still had a manual transmission. If I wanted something German, and manual, I had very limited options. I'm an enthusiast at heart and wasn't willing to give up on the connection I had with shifting my own gears, especially as it made the drive more interesting. It took a while to find a 6 speed F80, and that was 2 years ago. If my car were to be totaled, I'd be looking for another 6 speed F80 - as the G80 is hideous and there's even less choices now - and I'd guess it would be harder to find one in good condition.

[bholler]

Why not test drive both and see what you like?

I drove a 2001 325 Manual and loved it for 15 years before moving to 2017 F80 DCT.

The DCT is a marvel of engineering and I have only ever driven with paddles(automatic mode seems unnatural at this point). The shift are so crisp and gears are alive, it's not a slushbox.

I had the DCT flashed to the GTS Mapping and made a huge difference. No kangaroo-ing and shifting is even fast yet smoother.

If paddles are used properly you'll never look back I love it.

Forget "resale value" you're buying an M which is are you should only buy for the enjoyment of driving. I could also make a strong argument that color will play more determining factor in resale value than the transmission.

[Humdizzle]

Originally Posted by Soul Coughing

When I was searching for a 4 door car big enough to fit my growing family, there were not many vehicles that were fun and still had a manual transmission. If I wanted something German, and manual, I had very limited options. I'm an enthusiast at heart and wasn't willing to give up on the connection I had with shifting my own gears, especially as it made the drive more interesting. It took a while to find a 6 speed F80, and that was 2 years ago. If my car were to be totaled, I'd be looking for another 6 speed F80 - as the G80 is hideous and there's even less choices now - and I'd guess it would be harder to find one in good condition.

do you find your f80 manual as engaging as your other cars like the s2000 ? i found the f80's shift feel to be a bit dull compared to other cars like an s2000 or GT3. i found it difficult to always nail the 1-2 shift without lurching unless i was really really concentrating on my driving

[darrvao777]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

do you find your f80 manual as engaging as your other cars like the s2000 ? i found the f80's shift feel to be a bit dull compared to other cars like an s2000 or GT3. i found it difficult to always nail the 1-2 shift without lurching unless i was really really concentrating on my driving

i previously had a civic type r

the bmw manual is definitely more "rubbery" in feel compared to the notchier honda transmission but i still find it to be a lot of fun

i had a hellcat before that with the zf8 auto and even with paddles, it's not the same level of engagement for me

[N1rve]

Originally Posted by us722

What’s this teething issue the poster above talked about? I thought crank hub is the only (if that) issue with this gen.

I agree with the poster above that after a certain point the enthusiasts are main buyers and they prefer manual. This dictates a premium. You saw E9X series people say that DCT is day and night vs E46 SMG which might be true but DCT cars are going for less than manual nowadays.

Usually fit and finish issues.

[Soul Coughing]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

do you find your f80 manual as engaging as your other cars like the s2000 ? i found the f80's shift feel to be a bit dull compared to other cars like an s2000 or GT3. i found it difficult to always nail the 1-2 shift without lurching unless i was really really concentrating on my driving

No, the S2000 is more engaging. Having rebuilt a couple S2000 transmissions, it makes sense why they're so much fun to shift; there's not one piece of rubber, plastic (i have a bronze shifter bushing) , or non metal part between your hand and the shift fork engaging the synchros in the transmission. The F80 shifter feel has improved with the installation of the Turner shift bushing, and the M performance shifter (that sits lower), and I'm contemplating getting the SS kit everyone talks about, but I can't see it ever being as good. Not to say it's bad, as I'm comparing a sports car with a custom made transmission, to a GETRAG that sees service in non performance applications and needs to meet NVH requirements. Even with that said, it really adds to the experience of driving the car, even in the malaise of driving in stop and go traffic.

In regards to matching rev's, I too have an issue, and I think it's in the programming of the different drive modes - rev matching - in comfort and Sport seem to hang. In Sport +, the revs drop more quickly and I can time the drop in revs between shifts. I'll get the shifts down packed, and then drive another one of my manual cars and have to relearn the process all over again, haha.

[Soul Coughing]

Originally Posted by darrvao777

i previously had a civic type r

the bmw manual is definitely more "rubbery" in feel compared to the notchier honda transmission but i still find it to be a lot of fun

I agree! Still lots of fun to drive.

Haven't driven a Type R, but I'm sure it's nice! Honda continues to make a nice shifting manual transmission.