Over MSRP?

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Desmond Is My Constant

MSRP = Manufacturer's Suggested Rip-Off Price

I never ever pay MSRP on anything because, even shoes I buy simply because I know MSRP already includes a significant mark-up. Think about it, if they can make a profit with below invoice price, how much do you think they are making with MSRP? LOTS! For what? So that you can drive a car in its first year with lots of bugs on top of being their beta tester for free.

I got my current M3 1k below invoice! The dealership still made a lot of money on my sale.

No thanks, I'll wait.

Yeah! That's the price that is paid for being an early adopter.

[Jockey]

You're paying MSRP to get the car during it's 1st year of production. That's normal.

Bah, Sedan Clan beat me to it

[YolkyPalky]

Originally Posted by Tonymiabmw

After about 500k in cars in the last 6 years at the dealer I use. If they don't give me MSRP they can get bent.

Most dealers are pleased as punch to get full MSRP as it's such a rarity these days, and if they try MSRP++ they are just raping you.

MSRP pricing will disappear when the waiting lists disappear, although Golfrrr at Steve Thomas BMW can probably give you the best answer.

[Tonymiabmw]

Originally Posted by Desmond Is My Constant

MSRP = Manufacturer's Suggested Rip-Off Price

I never ever pay MSRP on anything because, even shoes I buy simply because I know MSRP already includes a significant mark-up. Think about it, if they can make a profit with below invoice price, how much do you think they are making with MSRP? LOTS! For what? So that you can drive a car in its first year with lots of bugs on top of being their beta tester for free.

No thanks, I'll wait.

The thing is this car is new and it's supply and demand. If the car was sitting on the lot for months not selling and there is back stock then yes under MSRP. My uncle has a great way to determine how to get a deal. He goes online or to the dealer and looks for rust on the brakes to determine if it's been sitting. Great strategy.

[Desmond Is My Constant]

The current M3 was also on demand when I ordered mine. I had to wait 1.5 months for dealerships's allocation to open up, there were 9 guys before me and I paid below invoice, again, below invoice. Dealerships make a decent amount of money (around 8k in my case even with that 1k below invoice) even on invoice deals. I cannot even begin to think how much they are making on MSRP deals.

And early adopter? Dude, BMW should be paying YOU for dealing with all the headaches of owning this car in its first year. You seem like you know your stuff and have been around long enough to know how the current M3 was in 2008. Remember the DCT issues? Idle control valve? What about all the turbo issues in the N54 in those 2006-2009 models? Come on now This is not Ferrari 458 and it is going to have lots of issues for at least a year given the complexity around its turbos and cooling.

Wow, cannot believe still all these people putting down deposits and ordering this car are actually paying MSRP!

[Chill72]

Originally Posted by Desmond Is My Constant

MSRP = Manufacturer's Suggested Rip-Off Price

I never ever pay MSRP on anything because, even shoes I buy simply because I know MSRP already includes a significant mark-up. Think about it, if they can make a profit with below invoice price, how much do you think they are making with MSRP? LOTS! For what? So that you can drive a car in its first year with lots of bugs on top of being their beta tester for free.

I got my current M3 1k below invoice! The dealership still made a lot of money on my sale.

No thanks, I'll wait.

It's normal to get a good price on a outgoing model...you didn't do anything extraordinary here guy.

Go pat yourself on the back somewhere else.

[Desmond Is My Constant]

Originally Posted by Chill72

It's normal to get a good price on a outgoing model...you didn't do anything extraordinary here guy.

Go pat yourself on the back somewhere else.

My car is 2010, so it was 2 years old when I bought it. Hardly outgoing

Sorry, am I getting the way of M4 drooling dream?

[YolkyPalky]

Originally Posted by Desmond Is My Constant

MSRP = Manufacturer's Suggested Rip-Off Price

I never ever pay MSRP on anything because, even shoes I buy simply because I know MSRP already includes a significant mark-up. Think about it, if they can make a profit with below invoice price, how much do you think they are making with MSRP? LOTS! For what? So that you can drive a car in its first year with lots of bugs on top of being their beta tester for free.

I got my current M3 1k below invoice! The dealership still made a lot of money on my sale.

No thanks, I'll wait.

Not sure why you started this thread to begin with based on what you just said?

But I agree, paying full MSRP is just silly, and yet that is exactly what I did in ~late 2001 to order my '02 E46 M3. Lots of dealers were asking MSRP+, it was either MSRP or the highway. Allocation waiting lists were more than a year long. So if you wanted a new M3, you had no choice.

Of course the economy has changed a lot since then. But if you want to be the first person in your neighborhood, town, or city to own the "new M3/M4", you will pay MSRP for it, it's always been that way, nothing new.

I'd rather wait a year not only for pricing to soften, but also for the factory to work out the kinks and many running factory changes that will take place, and also for better option packages to be offered, like the competition package.

[Desmond Is My Constant]

Originally Posted by YolkyPalky

Not sure why you started this thread to begin with based on what you just said?

But I agree, paying full MSRP is just silly, and yet that is exactly what I did in ~late 2001 to order my '02 E46 M3. Lots of dealers were asking MSRP+, it was either MSRP or the highway. Allocation waiting lists were more than a year long. So if you wanted a new M3, you had no choice.

Of course the economy has changed a lot since then. But if you want to be the first person in your neighborhood, town, or city to own the "new M3/M4", you will pay MSRP for it, it's always been that way, nothing new.

I'd rather wait a year not only for pricing to soften, but also for the factory to work out the kinks and many running factory changes that will take place, and also for better option packages to be offered, like the competition package.

I called up 4 dealerships in NY so far, 1 of them actually took the time to speak to me in detail (it was the guy who asked for over MSRP), the others outright told me they are not taking orders yet because you can;t order the car in the BMW's system yet! I'd call this hardly "waiting list". Come on. If you add up all the people on this forum who put down a deposit I guarantee you it won;t be more than 50-60 in all of U.S.

Also, BMW's car production model was a lot different in 2001 than it is today. They are building M3s in the standard production line in munich and you are hardly going to have to wait for it to come out of the factory.

All I'm saying is, open your eyes and don't be an idiot. Come on now. This is like the same thing when it comes to buying a house and giving an offer. "Oh there is a counter offer and its 10k over yours, what's the best you can do?", sound familiar? As many people said, there will always be weak people who will pay the dough to show off, I guess my point was there may be others who are getting carried away and they are not that desperate.

[Chill72]

Originally Posted by Desmond Is My Constant

My car is 2010, so it was 2 years old when I bought it. Hardly outgoing

Sorry, am I getting the way of M4 drooling dream?

Ok so you bought a 2010 model that was sitting in a dealer lot for two years...of course they'll give you a good price to move that shit.

Again, nothing special here.

[Desmond Is My Constant]

Originally Posted by Chill72

Ok so you bought a 2010 model that was sitting in a dealer lot for two years...of course they'll give you a good price to move that shit.

Again, nothing special here.

What are you talking about? I ordered a brand new M3 in 2010 from Germany. My point was, the M3 was hardly an outgoing model in 2010. It had been in production for 2 years. They continued to make them for 3 more years and I still managed to get 1k below invoice.

[YolkyPalky]

Originally Posted by Desmond Is My Constant

I called up 4 dealerships in NY so far, 1 of them actually took the time to speak to me in detail (it was the guy who asked for over MSRP), the others outright told me they are not taking orders yet because you can;t order the car in the BMW's system yet! I'd call this hardly "waiting list". Come on. If you add up all the people on this forum who put down a deposit I guarantee you it won;t be more than 50-60 in all of U.S.

Also, BMW's car production model was a lot different in 2001 than it is today. They are building M3s in the standard production line in munich and you are hardly going to have to wait for it to come out of the factory.

All I'm saying is, open your eyes and don't be an idiot. Come on now. This is like the same thing when it comes to buying a house and giving an offer. "Oh there is a counter offer and its 10k over yours, what's the best you can do?", sound familiar? As many people said, there will always be weak people who will pay the dough to show off, I guess my point was there may be others who are getting carried away and they are not that desperate.

Taking orders and holding your place on a list to place an order are two different things. And it wouldn't surprise me if some upstate NY, or wherever you are, cold as hell dealer locations don't have a robust waiting list. But I guarantee you it's different in sunny warm weather locations. When I ordered my '02 M3 off allocation, the dealer list with deposits was 50+ people, just at one dealership! I have no idea what it's like today because I don't care since I don't plan to buy in Year 1, but there are plenty of people who will, and allocations are going to be tight and list-driven.

[Chill72]

Originally Posted by Desmond Is My Constant

What are you talking about? I ordered a brand new M3 in 2010 from Germany. My point was, the M3 was hardly an outgoing model in 2010. It had been in production for 2 years. They continued to make them for 3 more years and I still managed to get 1k below invoice.

Ok so what. Why are you bitching about this on the forum if you can get a low price all day long?

I don't understand what you're trying to accomplish here.

[YolkyPalky]

Originally Posted by Chill72

Ok so what. Why are you bitching about this on the forum if you can get a low price all day long?

I don't understand what you're trying to accomplish here.

+1000, what was the point of this nonsense thread

[Desmond Is My Constant]

Originally Posted by Chill72

Ok so what. Why are you bitching about this on the forum if you can get a low price all day long?

I don't understand what you're trying to accomplish here.

I said a few times what I am trying to accomplish here, maybe you should have taken the time to read my posts.

As the current (and former) owner of many performance cars including an M3 and a 997, I am warning any potential (possibly young and inexperienced) buyers. Don't be an idiot. Open your eyes. Wait for a few months. No car, I mean no car, not even a 991 GT3, is worth MSRP. If you need to wait 6 months, so be it. These are first world problems. Oh I have to have my iPhone right away so let me stay up till 12 am and order it online. No you don't. It's okay to wait and drive whatever you are driving for 3-4 more months. Don't be desperate.

[Chill72]

Originally Posted by Desmond Is My Constant

I said a few times what I am trying to accomplish here, maybe you should have taken the time to read my posts.

As the current (and former) owner of many performance cars including an M3 and a 997, I am warning any potential (possibly young and inexperienced) buyers. Don't be an idiot. Open your eyes. Wait for a few months. No car, I mean no car, not even a 991 GT3, is worth MSRP. If you need to wait 6 months, so be it. These are first world problems. Oh I have to have my iPhone right away so let me stay up till 12 am and order it online. No you don't. It's okay to wait and drive whatever you are driving for 3-4 more months. Don't be desperate.

Just as I suspected, you assume that everyone here is an idiot and you will save the day by posting "Look what I can do..." crap.

Thanks but no thanks.

Now go to sleep.

[Jockey]

Look, people are going to pay MSRP to get their hands on this car for the first year. Get over it.

This isn't something that's only happens to BMWs. If the demand is high enough for a car, it's going to happen.

[Desmond Is My Constant]

Originally Posted by Chill72

Just as I suspected, you assume that everyone here is an idiot and you will save the day by posting "Look what I can do..." crap.

Thanks but no thanks.

Now go to sleep.

Not here to argue. Posted my experiences over several years of buying (and always specially ordering) similar cars. Seems like what I said upsets you somehow, I was just trying to help others save money. No car is worth paying MSRP. It's like paying the list price for a house. Surely in orange county some rich person with a hole in their pocket will pay it, but 95% of the people won't.

There may be people out there who have never sat in an M car, maybe some just got a new job (or a good bonus), they may not know how this works and may get fooled into thinking you have to pay MSRP to buy an M car (or order one). Well, you don't. The only reason is if you want to drive the car the first 6 months after it is released - which is a fair point (but debatable).

[YolkyPalky]

Originally Posted by Desmond Is My Constant

I said a few times what I am trying to accomplish here, maybe you should have taken the time to read my posts.

As the current (and former) owner of many performance cars including an M3 and a 997, I am warning any potential (possibly young and inexperienced) buyers. Don't be an idiot. Open your eyes. Wait for a few months. No car, I mean no car, not even a 991 GT3, is worth MSRP. If you need to wait 6 months, so be it. These are first world problems. Oh I have to have my iPhone right away so let me stay up till 12 am and order it online. No you don't. It's okay to wait and drive whatever you are driving for 3-4 more months. Don't be desperate.

Why are you preaching to others what they should do with their money? An opionated statement "not worth msrp" is your opinion only. Some people may gladly pay an msrp+ premium to get an M3 first before others. What a waste of a thread if all you wanted to do is preach to others how tight money is for you and therefore no one else should pay more than $xxxx for their items.

I think it's stupid to pay MSRP also in today's environment, but I could give a crap what others want to do with their money.

[turbolag]

Originally Posted by Chill72

Just as I suspected, you assume that everyone here is an idiot and you will save the day by posting "Look what I can do..." crap.

Thanks but no thanks.

Now go to sleep.

Still chuckling.

+1 everything Chill said.

Also, BMW has confirmed that there are already over 200 US pre-orders.

If you want a good deal - go get it. I don't give a shit about what you drive. Good for you, driving performance cars. I'm going for the LCI/ZCP because prices will drop, plus stuff gets sorted out. I got a good price on my '11 E90. Do what you did, shut the fuck up, wait 2 years, and then buy the damn thing.

[Desmond Is My Constant]

Originally Posted by turbolag

Still chuckling.

+1 everything Chill said.

Also, BMW has confirmed that there are already over 200 US pre-orders.

If you want a good deal - go get it. I don't give a shit about what you drive. Good for you, driving performance cars. I'm going for the LCI/ZCP because prices will drop, plus stuff gets sorted out. I got a good price on my '11 E90. Do what you did, shut the fuck up, wait 2 years, and then buy the damn thing.

You are rude.

[turbolag]

Originally Posted by Desmond Is My Constant

You are rude.

Your posts are pointless.

No offense intended.