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      08-21-2013, 06:51 PM   #45
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A manual transmission is why I switched from Mercedes to BMW. I wouldn't buy a non manual M car. But if I had no choice I would seriously start looking elsewhere.

hmmm AMG's have a very nice exhaust tone
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      08-21-2013, 06:54 PM   #46
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If you want to see the manual transmission option continued in the future, there are two steps:

1. Get one.

2. ...and write to BMW.

Keep doing that and they can't not offer it. They can't ignore the same enthusiasts who 30-40 years ago established them as a performance automobile brand.

Save the manuals!
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      08-21-2013, 07:03 PM   #47
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I hope the BMW M3/M4 will be manual transmission
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      08-21-2013, 07:06 PM   #48
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A message for BMW: please , if the M4 CSL will exist (I hope so), do it without turbo.
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      08-21-2013, 07:11 PM   #49
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Why so much hate on the exhaust? It sounds pretty good to me and as in good I mean you can actually HEAR it. We have never had good oem mufflers on the m3. I bet this one will sound somewhere near the 335is exhaust which is simply amazing. For all the people complaining or worried about the weak exhaust don't worry because you would have slapped on a new muffler anyway.
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      08-21-2013, 07:12 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keno View Post
I can't believe I see posts like the above on a enthusiasts car forum.

You are missing the point my friend, no better feeling than taking my M3 out on some windy roads and shifting gears myself.
Exactly,some of us find it much more fun to drive a manual car,especially an M3.
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      08-21-2013, 07:29 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seis-speed View Post
Manual is the number 1 option for me, I will not buy a "sports car" w/o manual.

For me personally it is make or break on any purchase. I would take a 128 manual over a M3 auto, again that is me, not everyone will agree.

If the manuals do go away forever, I would only buy used, just get a Prius, or some type of SUV/pickup, but no more new "sports cars".....
Could not agree more..!!

I was always planning on selling my current 997.2 GT3 RS when the new 991 RS come out but now with no MT, i'll be keeping this one forever.

So if no MT M4 then MT M5 for me. But please BMW, keep the MT m3/m4 alive!!
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      08-21-2013, 07:38 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BGM View Post
i swear america is the only place left in the world where MT is something to get excited about...

it's a chore, plain and simple..

everywhere bar the USA a MT is just associated with low-end, low-spec cars that the original owner was too tight to check the an AT box on

it's now just turning into a cultural thing, and US is the last bastion where it's 'cool' to own a manual... it's distinctly uncool round my neck of the woods that's for sure!
I'm sorry, but you are completely clueless. It's not about being 'cool' to own a manual, but instead the enjoyment, the engagement, and the control one has with a manual transmission.
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      08-21-2013, 07:41 PM   #53
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...is it me or are the wheel-arch flares on the M3 much more intensified than the M4? If so, sign me up for one as the M4's flares were my one visual fail for an //M.
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      08-21-2013, 07:42 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheJacka
Quote:
Originally Posted by seis-speed View Post
Manual is the number 1 option for me, I will not buy a "sports car" w/o manual.

For me personally it is make or break on any purchase. I would take a 128 manual over a M3 auto, again that is me, not everyone will agree.

If the manuals do go away forever, I would only buy used, just get a Prius, or some type of SUV/pickup, but no more new "sports cars".....
Could not agree more..!!

I was always planning on selling my current 997.2 GT3 RS when the new 991 RS come out but now with no MT, i'll be keeping this one forever.

So if no MT M4 then MT M5 for me. But please BMW, keep the MT m3/m4 alive!!
Humble Brag...
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      08-21-2013, 08:04 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BGM
i swear america is the only place left in the world where MT is something to get excited about...

it's a chore, plain and simple..

everywhere bar the USA a MT is just associated with low-end, low-spec cars that the original owner was too tight to check the an AT box on

it's now just turning into a cultural thing, and US is the last bastion where it's 'cool' to own a manual... it's distinctly uncool round my neck of the woods that's for sure!
In AUS they only custom factory order our BMW's in manual, and even though they are cheaper, we end up paying more because "it's a custom factory order"...

Total nonsense, but it does mean we're forced to customize our manuals just the way we like them.

Imagine a world where to fully option load a manual 135i coupe w/ppk it takes $100k USD... :
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      08-21-2013, 08:05 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keno View Post
I can't believe I see posts like the above on a enthusiasts car forum.

You are missing the point my friend, no better feeling than taking my M3 out on some windy roads and shifting gears myself.
couldn't give a shit about the transmission tbh, i just prefer AT

so long as i'm in the right gear for the right bit of the road whether that be via AT ~95% of the time of through myself overriding it ~5% of the time it matters little..

don't be so insolent as to mark AT users as less 'enthusiastic' about their vehicles than yourself, it is incredibly arrogant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonCSU View Post
I'm sorry, but you are completely clueless. It's not about being 'cool' to own a manual, but instead the enjoyment, the engagement, and the control one has with a manual transmission.
i drove manual cars for circa 10 years prior to my first auto, not going back ever.
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      08-21-2013, 08:09 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos_Danger View Post
You are so wrong i dont know where to being with, How about Germany where manual is a must for enthusiast? How about the world shocked and disappointed when the new Porsche GT3 came out without a manual option this year?
I don't think this is true. More than ever, I'm convinced the MT love affair is, at most, an "Anglosphere" thing.

Just look at the DCT/MT statistics for the E92 LCI, non-NA, LHD (of which Germany is probably the #1 market):

293 Manual vs. 5920 DCT. 95% DCT uptake!

All of BMW's development $ is being put into DCTs & ACTs. And it's not like the M manual is that great anyways.
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      08-21-2013, 08:15 PM   #58
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no manual - no M. Highly unlikely.
hey bmw its time for 7speed manual!
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      08-21-2013, 08:22 PM   #59
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I guess I can never resist this topic...
  1. A DCT is not an automatic, it is automatable.
  2. The design, engineering, construction and most importantly the FEEL of the DCT is like a manual. I think most (or certainly at least many) who criticize DCT have not driven an M3 through the gears in S5 mode shifting at redline.
  3. When you have the DCT in manual mode, it simply is not an automatic, you choose every single shift up and down, except those downshifts while slowing that prevent an engine stall.
  4. DCT in manual mode is very involving and satisfying. You still shift, just on the steering wheel rather than on the tranny tunnel. Oh wait, you can do that too. Who cares about the clutch pedal...
  5. I seriously applaud Porsche for their decision for PDK (dual clutch) only for the hardcore GT3. Its the best choice by far because of it performance while allowing full manual control over shifting. I wish BMW had the balls to do that same. Less expensive DCTs would be one result.
  6. Shifting a traditional manual is clearly not the only way to be involved with and in touch with ones driving. Do you think F1 folks miss the clutch pedal or need to be "more involved"... There is plenty left to do in high performance driving other than worry about the clutch pedal.
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      08-21-2013, 08:29 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BGM View Post
i swear america is the only place left in the world where MT is something to get excited about...

it's a chore, plain and simple..

everywhere bar the USA a MT is just associated with low-end, low-spec cars that the original owner was too tight to check the an AT box on

it's now just turning into a cultural thing, and US is the last bastion where it's 'cool' to own a manual... it's distinctly uncool round my neck of the woods that's for sure!
Sir, it's not about being trendy. It's about being more connected to the car and the driving experience. Yes DCT's are faster, but so is a hand job. i'll take the #$%^ job everytime.
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      08-21-2013, 08:33 PM   #61
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Scott,

When I got my 6MT e92 M3, I was surprised by the lack of shift light indicators. Usefulness can be debated, but that aside, why the omission on the MT?
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      08-21-2013, 08:41 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swamp2
I guess I can never resist this topic...
  1. A DCT is not an automatic, it is automatable.
  2. The design, engineering, construction and most importantly the FEEL of the DCT is like a manual. I think most (or certainly at least many) who criticize DCT have not driven an M3 through the gears in S5 mode shifting at redline.
  3. When you have the DCT in manual mode, it simply is not an automatic, you choose every single shift up and down, except those downshifts while slowing that prevent an engine stall.
  4. DCT in manual mode is very involving and satisfying. You still shift, just on the steering wheel rather than on the tranny tunnel. Oh wait, you can do that too. Who cares about the clutch pedal...
  5. I seriously applaud Porsche for their decision for PDK (dual clutch) only for the hardcore GT3. Its the best choice by far because of it performance while allowing full manual control over shifting. I wish BMW had the balls to do that same. Less expensive DCTs would be one result.
  6. Shifting a traditional manual is clearly not the only way to be involved with and in touch with ones driving. Do you think F1 folks miss the clutch pedal or need to be "more involved"... There is plenty left to do in high performance driving other than worry about the clutch pedal.
Exactly, manual is gonna be out of stage soon, for those who claim that manual has more fun have never tried a DCT. DCT gives you different combinations of shifting. DCT FOR LIFE!
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      08-21-2013, 08:51 PM   #63
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Have driven both DCT and MT on track, MT way more satisfying and challenging for me personally to drive than clicking yourself even in most aggressive setting. For sure won't result in the fastest times, but who cares. And as far as optimal gear ratios mated to the engine, I quite frankly couldn't really distinguish the DCT advantage at least at my perception or skill level.

Slowly but surely, with turbocharged engines, lack of instantaneous throttle response, lower redlines, electric steering, fart-can exhaust sounds, fake engine noises, etc nearly every last vestige of driving feel/experience/engagement is being taken away and now the MT too?!!? Thanks but no thanks.
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      08-21-2013, 08:52 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blindside_137 View Post
that does not sound good
Sigh....I agree

I don't think I'll ever fall in love again like I did when accelerating hard with an S65 under the hood...
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      08-21-2013, 09:02 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by Longbow64 View Post
Save the manuals!
+1
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      08-21-2013, 09:05 PM   #66
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For me, manual with a turbo car is a must

I like to put the DCT in manual mode in S6

If I can't get a manual then it most certainly must have a DCT

i find no faults with the M-DCT

And if I was getting another Porsche it would have to have the manual
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