E85 Ultimate debate

[Joy15779]

Dear Mates,
Unfortunately I m reading since a couple of months but I cannot get a definitive answer to my question.

My car is per signature. Running over 750 hp, we call stage 4 in Italy cause engine is tuned with Arrow Connecting rod and carillo piston and reinforced bearings.
Dorch HPFP, Injectors M5, Kratos evo turbo, full free exhaust.

Now, I purchased high precision raceworks stage 4.5 LPFP NOT INSTALLEDA AND bm3 FLEX FUEL KIT not INSTALLED.
I purchased Magigas E85 very pure, race pure.
I am load ing 10% with success, 30% with success and now gonna try 50% hopefully with success.
mANY GUYS TOLD ME lpfp mandatory, OTHERS NO.
As on today I faced ZERO problem, only Halim is performing multi map for different ethanol percentages.

Do I need to install LPFP and BM3 flex fuel kit or no?

Thanks for the answer.

Warm regards,
Giorgio

[heitzke]

I'm not surprised you're seeing success with the lower E-blends, but the real test is running straight E85 and being tuned to make use of it. E85 produces roughly ~70-80% the energy as the same gallon of 93. Given that, you need to flow ~30% MORE fuel to make the same exact power on 93. (I've also read it could be in the 30-40% more fuel).

That extra volume needed of E85, especially when you're tuned to run more boost, more timing and with larger fuel demands is where you'll run into issues with the LPFP trying to keep up. You're probably fine squeezing by with E15, E30, etc because the fuel demands aren't THAT much higher than 93.

Some of this all depends on how much power you're shooting to make too. You may hit your power goals and sit under the threshold of the factory LPFP, but with a built motor, big turbos, etc you probably won't. You haven't needed the LPFP yet because your fuel demands aren't extreme, but they're going to be here pretty soon.

The LPFP in your case is definitely the weak link. My setup makes ~700whp, maxing out the stock motor, but I have a Dorch Lift Kit for the HPFP side and a Precision Raceworks Stage 3 Brushless pump for the LPFP. No problems here meeting my fuel demands. The pump is rated to flow enough for 850whp on E85.

You have so much money in your car already to try to squeeze by on the factory LPFP. I can't pinpoint exactly, where but your LPFP isn't going to be able to keep up with the power potential of your setup on E85.

[Joy15779]

Thank you dear Heitzke, I really appreciate your considerations. Most probably you are right but I must tell the truth I' VE faced till now.
I overcome drastically 750 hp with RON100. Now "playing with E85" which is my new toy
You know that surrounding my city NOONE purchased the LPFP, I ve been convinced by a forum user but.... bah.... all the other similar cars are running 800 (like mine with kratos) or pure turbos, EVERYBODY with RON 100, I m the only one playing MAGIGAS E85. 100% of the local tuners are straight the LPFP is useless...Anyway, I purchased it, the best probably, and the bloody flex device BM3, so, soon or late I will install them, despite they said isn't an easy game...(for nothing they claim!).
I' ll keep you posted.
Today I run RONN 10 70% AND E85 PURE 30% without dedicated ECU (Halim is working on it), but with the standard eco it flys. ))

[kamilbaran]

I recommend the flex fuel kit paired with a proper custom tune. Lets you fill up as much E as you please with no reflashing, the car adjusts everything itself. You can be on 93 (or whatever kind you use) with a flex fuel sensor tune and then if you want more power fill up with E without any issues, the more E the more power. Big fan of the flex fuel system makes things easier than getting exacts levels different E blends.

[heitzke]

Originally Posted by Joy15779

Thank you dear Heitzke, I really appreciate your considerations. Most probably you are right but I must tell the truth I' VE faced till now.
I overcome drastically 750 hp with RON100. Now "playing with E85" which is my new toy
You know that surrounding my city NOONE purchased the LPFP, I ve been convinced by a forum user but.... bah.... all the other similar cars are running 800 (like mine with kratos) or pure turbos, EVERYBODY with RON 100, I m the only one playing MAGIGAS E85. 100% of the local tuners are straight the LPFP is useless...Anyway, I purchased it, the best probably, and the bloody flex device BM3, so, soon or late I will install them, despite they said isn't an easy game...(for nothing they claim!).
I' ll keep you posted.
Today I run RONN 10 70% AND E85 PURE 30% without dedicated ECU (Halim is working on it), but with the standard eco it flys. ))

I'm not totally surprised by the responses you're getting from others in your area when you have RON 100 available. E85 still has a bit higher of an octane rating of ~105 depending on the quality of the E85. With the extra 5 points you should be able to more safely run additional timing, etc. The downside is that it requires a good deal more volume of fuel to deliver that power and that's where your LPFP needs come in.

Personally i'd install the flex-fuel kit, the LPFP and run flex-fuel with a max power tune on E85. If they make use of the extra timing you should make more power than your 100 octane setup. Hard to really say what the gains will be over 100 octane tbh, they might not be a huge margin but i'm no tuner. It'd offer you a good bit of flexibility and a margin of safety due to fuel quality, etc.

Not a direct comparison but on my 2004 Cobra I got tuned on 93 and E85. The 93 tune yielded 629/601 and my E85 tune made 690/645 about an hour after the 93 tune was done. 12 points different in octane (given an octane of 105 for the E85).

[TopJimmy]

Gio,
The other guys say no to the LPFP because they use gas. Since you want to run E85 you will need 30% more fuel volume/flow. Because you have the big EVO turbos you really need more like 50% more flow to make maximum power.

You don’t need a flex fuel sensor. A flex tune is more convenient, but you’ve built for “crazy fast”, and a flex tune isn’t as strong as a tune for a single fuel.

I would add the Stage 4 LPFP with Fuel Pressure Regulator set to 100PSI (fixed pressure, no change for boost) with a new fuel line. Then tell Halim you want “all the sauce” with a dedicated E85 tune. Halim calls it the “balls out tune”.
-Jimmy

[Akutchand10]

Thanks for the information!Well, congratulations on your powerful car and all those fancy modifications! It sounds like you're really going for that high-performance experience. Now, onto your question about the LPFP and BM3 flex fuel kit. Hmm, let me think. Should you install them or not? Well, you know what they say, "Why fix something that ain't broke?" If you haven't faced any problems so far and you've been successfully loading different ethanol percentages, who needs those extra upgrades, right? Just keep relying on Halim's magical multi map skills, and you'll be golden. But hey, if you ever change your mind, I'm sure casinoplinko.com has the answers you're looking for. Good luck with your decision!

[Joy15779]

Originally Posted by TopJimmy

Gio,
The other guys say no to the LPFP because they use gas. Since you want to run E85 you will need 30% more fuel volume/flow. Because you have the big EVO turbos you really need more like 50% more flow to make maximum power.

You don’t need a flex fuel sensor. A flex tune is more convenient, but you’ve built for “crazy fast”, and a flex tune isn’t as strong as a tune for a single fuel.

I would add the Stage 4 LPFP with Fuel Pressure Regulator set to 100PSI (fixed pressure, no change for boost) with a new fuel line. Then tell Halim you want “all the sauce” with a dedicated E85 tune. Halim calls it the “balls out tune”.
-Jimmy

I m a dumb and you are always very kind and professional dear