G80 M3 (Manual) vs F80 M3 DCT - Stock

[hellokitty]

Probably the cleanest roll and dig race comparison I've seen. Just about dead even.

[Humdizzle]

i was impressed with the g80 launch. it hooks very well

[dms-01]

That front wheel gap on the G80 is yuuuuuuuge and one would think the G80 would walk away being the newer generation but here we are.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by hellokitty

Probably the cleanest roll and dig race comparison I've seen. Just about dead even.

Comparing DCT to 6MT is not apples-to-apples…

[M3god]

Dct will always win against 6spd manual

[DocL]

The G80 loses no matter what due to the ugly grill.

[SYT_Shadow]

exactly what I would expect. No one is getting the 6MT G80 for drag races. That's what the G80 ZCP is for with its 8sp ZF and potentially adding AWD

People getting a 6MT M understand they aren't getting the fastest version, but they are getting a pretty damn fast car, new, in 2022 with a 6MT for mid 70s. Pretty good if you ask me!

[RElias21]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Comparing DCT to 6MT is not apples-to-apples…

I'm very impressed by the F80 as a car here, as well as the G80 driver. The G80 driver shows how fun and effective a manual can be when you know how to shift.

Also, for an F80 base, though DCT, to hang with a G80 that has 50hp or so on it (and has at least an above-average driver) is impressive as well.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by RElias21

I'm very impressed by the F80 as a car here, as well as the G80 driver. The G80 driver shows how fun and effective a manual can be when you know how to shift.

Also, for an F80 base, though DCT, to hang with a G80 that has 50hp or so on it (and has at least an above-average driver) is impressive as well.

There's nothing surprising about the results, they are exactly as expected. The 6MT G80 has a small 4~5% power-to-weight advantage over the F80 that the F80 offsets with the quicker shifting DCT.

[NickyC]

BMW need a 6MT G80/G82 Competition with the same output as the RWD auto cars. The fact 6MT is down on a power and huge on torque is an absolute joke. They made a 6MT while basically forcing everyone to choose the auto because the manuals are so down on power they can't even get past the prior generation of car.

God I hate this current generation of M3/M4.

[M3JetPilot]

All that ugly and for what? Just kidding G80 peeps. It was a great race and interesting to see. It's a shame the G80 doesn't have a DCT choice. That would help me like that car more. I know the automatic gets lots of praise but since driving a DCT I don't think I can go back to an auto in a sports car.

What does this say about the opinion I often see in these forums that the G80 is a superior car in every way. Depending on how it's equipped and the versions being compared, that's obviously not true.

[Humdizzle]

Originally Posted by NickyC

BMW need a 6MT G80/G82 Competition with the same output as the RWD auto cars. The fact 6MT is down on a power and huge on torque is an absolute joke. They made a 6MT while basically forcing everyone to choose the auto because the manuals are so down on power they can't even get past the prior generation of car.

God I hate this current generation of M3/M4.

its probably just a tune right ? i dont think the comp gets any hardware changes, they just up the boost pressure on the map.

but yeah this is part of BMWs strategy. neuter the manual car. then they can tell everyone 'nobody is buying them, lets axe it from the model lineup'. bmw doesn't have to spend money to develop two transmissions and 100% of their cars can run the zf8

[Tacoma]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

its probably just a tune right ? i dont think the comp gets any hardware changes, they just up the boost pressure on the map.

but yeah this is part of BMWs strategy. neuter the manual car. then they can tell everyone 'nobody is buying them, lets axe it from the model lineup'. bmw doesn't have to spend money to develop two transmissions and 100% of their cars can run the zf8

The manual transmission was the reason the manual G8x was neutered and the base "Pure" variant was needed. It couldn't handle the extra power/torque of the CP model, so instead of upgrading the manual transmission, they neutered the engine and called the car "Pure."

Unwilling to spend $/effort to upgrade it, the manual transmission was essentially from the parts bin, a compromise, to keep the purest enthusiast happy. So if you tune it too much, you'll have to upgrade the manual transmission too or risk exceeding it's limit.

[Soul Coughing]

Originally Posted by Tacoma

The manual transmission was the reason the manual G8x was neutered and the base "Pure" variant was needed. It couldn't handle the extra power/torque of the CP model, so instead of upgrading the manual transmission, they neutered the engine and called the car "Pure."

Unwilling to spend $/effort to upgrade it, the manual transmission was essentially from the parts bin, a compromise, to keep the purest enthusiast happy. So if you tune it too much, you'll have to upgrade the manual transmission too or risk exceeding it's limit.

This sounds about right from a BMW durability perspective - needing to get the cars past the 4 year warranty period- but in practice, the manual has held up well to increased power. Seems the clutch is the weak point once you get past 25-30% increase in torque.

I do find it interesting that the DCT makes up for the lower HP! Goes to show how much quicker the DCT is compared to the manual - both the gearing and the speed!

[RugbyBro]

Originally Posted by M3JetPilot

What does this say about the opinion I often see in these forums that the G80 is a superior car in every way. Depending on how it's equipped and the versions being compared, that's obviously not true.

That can be said about every successive generation of M3; doesn’t stop any of them from being great

[mpower79]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Comparing DCT to 6MT is not apples-to-apples…

F82 cs or f82 competition run better than than that stock M4

[TractionControlDelete]

Originally Posted by Tacoma

The manual transmission was the reason the manual G8x was neutered and the base "Pure" variant was needed. It couldn't handle the extra power/torque of the CP model, so instead of upgrading the manual transmission, they neutered the engine and called the car "Pure."

Unwilling to spend $/effort to upgrade it, the manual transmission was essentially from the parts bin, a compromise, to keep the purest enthusiast happy. So if you tune it too much, you'll have to upgrade the manual transmission too or risk exceeding it's limit.

It's an interesting decision, in light of the fact that the F10 M5 had a manual transmission available that could handle higher horsepower and torque (at least 500 lb-ft I believe)

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by mpower79

F82 cs or f82 competition run better than than that stock M4

and your point is... ??

[kyrix1st]

Originally Posted by Soul Coughing

.....
I do find it interesting that the DCT makes up for the lower HP! Goes to show how much quicker the DCT is compared to the manual - both the gearing and the speed!

I feel many are misled by the notion that higher max hp -> better acceleration. What makes S55 great is a broader maximum torque band across the whole engine rpm, compared to S58 that has narrower maximum torque band but makes higher maximum horsepower.

I would say F82 was able to demolish competition with higher horsepower due to this engine characteristic and the M-DCT.

[TractionControlDelete]

Originally Posted by kyrix1st

I feel many are misled by the notion that higher max hp -> better acceleration. What makes S55 great is a broader maximum torque band across the whole engine rpm, compared to S58 that has narrower maximum torque band but makes higher maximum horsepower.

I would say F82 was able to demolish competition with higher horsepower due to this engine characteristic and the M-DCT.

I figured BMW would eventually release a revised 6MT G8X - the transmission is rated to handle 443lb-ft so there is some overhead left. A stripped down G82, with increased torque, and the 6MT might make for a fun Heritage Edition.

[Tacoma]

Originally Posted by F82KPowers

I figured BMW would eventually release a revised 6MT G8X - the transmission is rated to handle 443lb-ft so there is some overhead left. A stripped down G82, with increased torque, and the 6MT might make for a fun Heritage Edition.

I doubt it. BMW usually understate their power/torque numbers so the 6MT G80 is probably at the limit that they're comfortable with to warranty its reliable operation over expected lifespan.

BMW did the minimum needed and that's going to be it I think. It's the equivalent of throwing us a bone to keep us happy.

I've only bought BMW with manuals but the F80 will be my last. Not keen on buying lesser compromised versions de-tuned because of the transmission.

[mpower79]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

and your point is... ??

haha you are rigth!
im trying to said that g80 not that fast as those cars