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      08-19-2013, 07:35 PM   #155
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take the current M3 base price $61.000 + $20.000 = M4

M4 falls right between M6 and M3

lesser M than M6, but more than M3...

so $80k +/- for base M4 would be logical...
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      08-19-2013, 07:45 PM   #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dimabimmer View Post
take the current M3 base price $61.000 + $20.000 = M4

M4 falls right between M6 and M3

lesser M than M6, but more than M3...

so $80k +/- for base M4 would be logical...
Seems a little steep for a base price. For this to be the case then it must obliterate and RS5 and a C63 AMG 507 edition in every category to justify this price point, or there must be a majority of options standard. Otherwise you are way into M5 territory with 15 k in options. That would put it about 95 k or more.
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      08-19-2013, 07:46 PM   #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dimabimmer View Post
take the current M3 base price $61.000 + $20.000 = M4

M4 falls right between M6 and M3

lesser M than M6, but more than M3...

so $80k +/- for base M4 would be logical...
Not gonna happen.

Starting price won't be that far off E92 M3 starting price, but adjusted for extra standard equipment that the M4 will have (over the E92 M3). This is what BMW is shooting for.
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      08-19-2013, 07:56 PM   #158
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason View Post
Not gonna happen.

Starting price won't be that far off E92 M3 starting price, but adjusted for extra standard equipment that the M4 will have (over the E92 M3). This is what BMW is shooting for.
Do you know if you will be able to order a (f80 m3) with a sunroof
thanks
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      08-19-2013, 08:08 PM   #159
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Originally Posted by marvin e92 View Post
Do you know if you will be able to order a (f80 m3) with a sunroof
thanks
I would imagine there will be such an option.
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      08-19-2013, 08:22 PM   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason
Quote:
Originally Posted by dimabimmer View Post
take the current M3 base price $61.000 + $20.000 = M4

M4 falls right between M6 and M3

lesser M than M6, but more than M3...

so $80k +/- for base M4 would be logical...
Not gonna happen.

Starting price won't be that far off E92 M3 starting price, but adjusted for extra standard equipment that the M4 will have (over the E92 M3). This is what BMW is shooting for.
good point Jason,
in any case, I got my credit cards out and holding my breath, because I'm 100% sold on M4...

but maybe, I should see the new M3 first...
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      08-19-2013, 08:26 PM   #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dimabimmer View Post
good point Jason,
in any case, I got my credit cards out and holding my breath, because I'm 100% sold on M4...

but maybe, I should see the new M3 first...
The good thing is... you likely can't go wrong either way
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      08-19-2013, 08:44 PM   #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dimabimmer View Post
take the current M3 base price $61.000 + $20.000 = M4

M4 falls right between M6 and M3

lesser M than M6, but more than M3...

so $80k +/- for base M4 would be logical...
Base will be right around $70K, maybe a bit under. There's no way they're pricing this at $80K.
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      08-19-2013, 10:24 PM   #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos_Danger View Post
Yes, but ill take a base M4 over a fully loaded 435i (because performance)
Definitely agree there, but since you could have just as easily compared to a fairly stripped 435i, I assumed you really wanted those options. In other words it doesn't strike me as particularly logical to try to make up for performance by adding every gadget and toy unless you have a $60k-$70k pile of money you are trying your damnedest to burn through. Not a criticism necessarily, just we have different ways of thinking I suppose.
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      08-19-2013, 10:48 PM   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos_Danger View Post
Your reasoning is a little off, say I've already Pre planned to spend 60-70k on a third car, a weekend car, now if it was you would you get a base M4 or a fully loaded 435i??? See it makes sense when you think about it
Like I said - different ways of thinking. I don't target a dollar figure, I target a certain use case and range of utility. I then get the most performant car that meets my needs within my budget. Anything left over goes toward the next toy, or perhaps mods, or a vacation, or maybe driving school or track time or whatever.
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      08-20-2013, 12:57 AM   #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason View Post
Not gonna happen.

Starting price won't be that far off E92 M3 starting price, but adjusted for extra standard equipment that the M4 will have (over the E92 M3). This is what BMW is shooting for.
This made me very happy.

So assuming 7spd DCT is standard and heated seats are standard, the only options I would need are Premium Package, Competition Package and maybe Upgraded sound package. Would love to do this with Euro Delivery at the end of May '14

Edit: would also add Technology Package
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      08-20-2013, 08:38 AM   #166
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos_Danger View Post
A company handles my finances, they're very good, they keep me balanced and on the fence, 60-70k every 2 years for automotive pleasure its perfect, that is upgrading/trading current rides or purchasing a new one
Sounds great. For me, even in that case I still will not choose to purchase options I do not need. I am an engineer so philosophically I keep things as simple as possible for the task at hand.

Philosophy aside, I think the end result is the same anyway. For a $70k budget, whether comparing a stripped M4 to a stripped 435i or a loaded 435i I'd choose the M4. However, I don't necessarily believe you will be able to drive away in an M4 for that sum of money. I suspect OTD it will be mid-70s, especially since there may be a couple "must haves" such as metallic paint, non-plastic interior trim, possibly factory performance upgrades. Perhaps, if they don't take ED cars from dealer allocations you will be able to come in under $70k for an ED. But I would not count on that, at least not right away.
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      08-20-2013, 10:18 AM   #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinny84 View Post
This made me very happy.

So assuming 7spd DCT is standard
Not likely since a manual 6-spd is offered as well.
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      08-20-2013, 10:51 AM   #168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hwelvaar View Post
Not likely since a manual 6-spd is offered as well.
He's in here in the US where, in recent years, BMW NA has made automatic and DCT transmissions standard equipment and manual transmissions a no cost option (when they are available at all). Along with series vehicles like the 3, 4, 5, and 6, the M5 and M6 are also offered this way. So I would say that there is actually a very good chance the M3 and M4 will follow suit.

The net result, by the way, can be assumed to be a higher base price than what may otherwise have been, not a free DCT.
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      08-20-2013, 12:21 PM   #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
He's in here in the US where, in recent years, BMW NA has made automatic and DCT transmissions standard equipment and manual transmissions a no cost option (when they are available at all). Along with series vehicles like the 3, 4, 5, and 6, the M5 and M6 are also offered this way. So I would say that there is actually a very good chance the M3 and M4 will follow suit.

The net result, by the way, can be assumed to be a higher base price than what may otherwise have been, not a free DCT.
Other "required" additions to the F8x vis-a-vis E9x:

1. 19-inch wheels (but probably cast, not forged like 220Ms)
2. IDrive
3. Starting in 2014, rear-view camera
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      08-20-2013, 12:58 PM   #170
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Seeing the prices I would see this to be around $90k+ in Canada
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      08-20-2013, 01:16 PM   #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos_Danger View Post
Even Jason posted on this the price will be 60-70k closer to 60 than 70,
That it will start between 60K and 70K is a fairly widely held opinion, yes. Few will disagree with that. Jason does not have any official pricing information yet, but I am sure he'll share it when he does.

The current E92 M3 is $61,025 with destination according to bmwusa.com. Add in a commensurate increase for the new model plus new standard equipment and we could easily be at a $70k base price. This assumes, for now, that the more efficient engine in the new car avoids the GGT as well. If it does not, that's another $1300.

And as I said, a truly zero-option M4 will be unlikely. Once you pay sales tax, I don't see a $70k OTD M4 as a reality. At least not at MSRP. Talk to a forum sponsor about ED pricing or perhaps an invoice-plus deal and you have a shot.
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      08-20-2013, 01:18 PM   #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos_Danger View Post
About manuals in the US I also have to add that even though they are offered as free like you said, get this, demand is so low that every car that BMW sends to dealerships, cars that are not pre allocated or ordered just cars to fill dealerships are DCT or ZF autos, only cars that are specifically ordered by customers to have a manual do so, I don't know why that is such a big deal to me, hell its 2013 you can't even get the new Porsche 911 GT3 with a manual *sigh*
You missed the point. You are not getting a free manual. You are, instead, paying the higher price of the DCT while actually getting the manual instead.
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      08-20-2013, 01:29 PM   #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
You missed the point. You are not getting a free manual. You are, instead, paying the higher price of the DCT while actually getting the manual instead.
If that's the way they'll do it I think you will kill more than 50% of the little MT demand that is still left. I'm considering going back to MT but if I have to pay for the DCT to get it I think I'll go for another DCT.

I don't see it as a done deal though. With an MT standard they can keep the base price more competetive and also claim a lower weight, not sure if they can claim the MT weight as the official weight if it's an option. Both are rather important competetive factors but if they want to phase out the MT for the next model a standard DCT is a good way to wind down MT demand further.
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      08-20-2013, 01:51 PM   #174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
If that's the way they'll do it I think...
All valid opinions. The way I see it, standard automatic and DCT transmissions on every Fxx model in the BMW US lineup, including models that sit below and above the M3/M4 is pretty big writing on the wall.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rissei View Post
Other "required" additions to the F8x vis-a-vis E9x:

1. 19-inch wheels (but probably cast, not forged like 220Ms)
2. IDrive
3. Starting in 2014, rear-view camera
And from the M camp, standard M Driving Dynamics Control also seems likely. Even M Dynamic Damper Control may be standard, though I could equally see them offering a passive system too.
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      08-20-2013, 01:56 PM   #175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
If that's the way they'll do it I think you will kill more than 50% of the little MT demand that is still left. I'm considering going back to MT but if I have to pay for the DCT to get it I think I'll go for another DCT.

I don't see it as a done deal though. With an MT standard they can keep the base price more competetive and also claim a lower weight, not sure if they can claim the MT weight as the official weight if it's an option. Both are rather important competetive factors but if they want to phase out the MT for the next model a standard DCT is a good way to wind down MT demand further.
BMW would love to stop selling MT cars. Lower development costs when they only have to perfect the AT. To that end, I agree that it doesn't make sense for BMW to make the AT much more expensive than the MT. The M3/M4 will likely be done similarly to the M5. The MT will be $300 cheaper or the same price as an AT.
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      08-20-2013, 04:48 PM   #176
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For whatever it's worth, the last m3 sedan's euro delivery invoice including gas guzzler tax and destination costs was $50.5k. It was $47.8k without GGT or destination costs.

Now that was a 2011 MY car vs. a 2015 MY car, so assuming some inflation and added costs for content, I'm going with $56k euro invoice price for the new m3 including destination and assuming it avoids the GGT.

I personally don't need a competition package on it, don't want carbon ceramic brakes, and can source other things like wheels much more cheaply. I might want the technology package.

I think that's going to be pretty darn reasonable at the end of the day.
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