Budget under $50k - Used F80 or something else?

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by 440iGCCB

This is what I am looking for. The preciesness all the time, and high way rolling acceleration. 110% I will take you up on the offer. I have no idea how to track and could use a friend on that.

I have been reading on the CS deals! Do you mind if I PM you about numbers on that? I would be leasing the CS.

This is the beauty of the M car. You can appreciate the precision at all times without necessarily driving really fast.

For winter, do yourself a favor and get some nice winter tires. You can even get them for your stock wheels so you don't have to buy a specific set.
A Michelin PA4 or Alpin 5 handles extremely well and I've survived tons of snowstorms all over Boston, Ottawa and NY with it.


EDIT: The RS3 is a souped up Golf GTi with very similar driving dynamics. It is nice until 7/10 and then it falls apart. The car is mostly FWD until it loses grip. It's a cool car for a non-car person.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by EricSMG

As for harshness, yes - the ZCP cars ride very hard and can be tiring at times. I would not recommend one if you have crappy roads. Here, the roads are relatively nice and so it was tolerable for me. But man... what a FUN car.

Well, I guess it depends on your definition of harsh. I rented a Wrangler the other day and it blew my mind people can drive that on the road, every day. Or any day...
The 700/1000 spring rate E90 M3 is more comfortable to drive on track settings on the road

[Kooch]

Been daily driving mine since 2017 and excitement hasn't worn off. I commute from the south shore to Dorchester daily and still love driving the car. I have dedicated summer (305 rears) and winter sets and run in MDM exclusively. I would say no issue with this car in this area throughout the year with the right set up. Also made a run back from Saratoga springs yesterday afternoon and hit some traffic but boy were the wide open spots fun to run...I don't have experience in the 440 so can't help with the compare there.

[EricSMG]

Originally Posted by nicknaz

If you think 50F and light rain means traction issues then take a pass on f80

Non-issue in those conditions - it will take plenty of throttle. You just have to be smooth.

Now, 35* and wet.... just stay out of boost and zero problems.

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

Well, I guess it depends on your definition of harsh. I rented a Wrangler the other day and it blew my mind people can drive that on the road, every day. Or any day...

Haha, no kidding. And people will pay 40k for one of those POS'. I mean just look at how wavy the sheet metal is on those tin cans. Reminds me of a Ford, but much worse.

[VChenz]

i have three kids between 7 and 12. They love it. I set M1 = granny mode and M2 = full send. I also have a 2010 camry that i use when i need more space or in the winter.

I have never had a performance car...all my cars were camrys, sebrings, RAV4 etc. Boring, cheap cars. The camry floats like a boat but its got a smooth as silk drive (no steering feel or power but it has its place). The M3 is the first nice car i have ever owned. Its stiffer for sure, but definitely comfortable. The one thing you can't do is have your kids eat in the car cause stiffer suspension means things spill easier.

I personally wont be driving it in the winter but with some good winter tires it's doable. I bought my car used and it came with winter tires and rims but i dont intend on using them.

[stevehifi]

Originally Posted by BMWModel3

What about Model 3 Performance. AWD 0-60 3.2s. $49k.

Second that, the model 3 performance is $54900 (without incentives) and will smoke any stock or mildly modified m3/m4 in a straight line. (11.8sec 1/4 mile)

There are legit reviews (top gear, tiff nedell) comparing the model 3 against the m3 and giulia quad on a track (thunderhill) and again even on a road course the model 3 is about 2 seconds faster.

Sure it won't last more than 2-3 laps (it's not a track car) but 80% of owners don't take the car to the track on a regular basis.

[2011zx10R]

Originally Posted by stevehifi

Second that, the model 3 performance is $54900 (without incentives) and will smoke any stock or mildly modified m3/m4 in a straight line. (11.8sec 1/4 mile)

There are legit reviews (top gear, tiff nedell) comparing the model 3 against the m3 and giulia quad on a track (thunderhill) and again even on a road course the model 3 is about 2 seconds faster.

Sure it won't last more than 2-3 laps (it's not a track car) but 80% of owners don't take the car to the track on a regular basis.

Originally Posted by stevehifi

Second that, the model 3 performance is $54900 (without incentives) and will smoke any stock or mildly modified m3/m4 in a straight line. (11.8sec 1/4 mile)

There are legit reviews (top gear, tiff nedell) comparing the model 3 against the m3 and giulia quad on a track (thunderhill) and again even on a road course the model 3 is about 2 seconds faster.

Sure it won't last more than 2-3 laps (it's not a track car) but 80% of owners don't take the car to the track on a regular basis.

The Tesla 3 is such an ugly car.

[stevehifi]

Originally Posted by 2011zx10R

The Tesla 3 is such an ugly car.

most of the time you're inside the car

[OhioRiderAaron]

I'm gonna vote Macan (any trim really, GTS or even a base). It's really a solid daily driver, decent mpg all things considered, more comfortable on the street, reliable, looks great, and is an absolute monster in the winter. We have a Macan GTS that's been daily driven for 2 years without any issues, cuts thru level 2 snow emergencies without a hiccup, and is pretty entertaining to drive if you're expectations are reasonable. Maintenance costs are about the only thing you need to be careful with (see Indy dealers). Even had a base 4cyc loaner one time that may have been the best 4 banger I've driven in an SUV to date..

Of course F8X's, X5/6m, and Teslas are good options too.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by EricSMG

Non-issue in those conditions - it will take plenty of throttle. You just have to be smooth.

Now, 35* and wet.... just stay out of boost and zero problems.



Haha, no kidding. And people will pay 40k for one of those POS'. I mean just look at how wavy the sheet metal is on those tin cans. Reminds me of a Ford, but much worse.

Yep, I agree with you Eric. I did my euro delivery in 45F and rainy conditions and you better believe I was getting after it on the A-bahn, did my lap of the Ring and did a track day at Spa.

You and I already know this, but OP is the one worried about the car being stiff or being somewhat hard to drive in 50F wet weather.

A fast SUV is probably more what OP would value, or maybe a lightly modded e63 or rs7 with 700hp to make it a straight line highway cruising missile. Basically a really suped up version of the 440xi they already have.

Isn’t wrangler a factory off-road champ? And what’s why it kind of sucks on highways?

+1 to Aaron for suggesting Macan. Not sure I would get one new with my own money but used it’s super interesting. I drove my sister in law’s cayenne at a winter track day and that thing was as much fun to slide around as a wrx wagon

[JamesGames]

Originally Posted by nicknaz

If you think 50F and light rain means traction issues then take a pass on f80

And if you don’t need a back seat, how about a TTRS 911 C4S type of car? Yolo

Seriously... +100


I used to drive around a manual transmission toyota tacoma making deliveries some 15 years ago. "Traction" is an understatement on the rear end of a light truck like that. In certain scenarios, downshifting meant locking up the rear tires on slick wet winter SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA roads.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by JamesGames

Seriously... +100


I used to drive around a manual transmission toyota tacoma making deliveries some 15 years ago. "Traction" is an understatement on the rear end of a light truck like that. In certain scenarios, downshifting meant locking up the rear tires on slick wet winter SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA roads.

Were these deliveries involving tofu by any chance?

Be honest, you were clutch kicking to get a drift started

In all seriousness, I can see where OP is coming from. Sometimes you just want to get to work without a lot of drama. When if first got my f80 codes to euro mdm, I commuted In that mode, and while on a conference call, I made a right turn with aggressive throttle and ended up accidentally sliding through the turn, with the rear of my car over the lane marker. Fun but whoops and could have ended up with me on YouTube. Awd commuter appliances have their place (ie I daily a model 3 with Perfomance package)

[F82Tazmanian]

Originally Posted by BMWModel3

What about Model 3 Performance. AWD 0-60 3.2s. $49k.

BIL got the S p100d and I just can't get on board with electric

[F82Tazmanian]

Originally Posted by OhioRiderAaron

I'm gonna vote Macan (any trim really, GTS or even a base). It's really a solid daily driver, decent mpg all things considered, more comfortable on the street, reliable, looks great, and is an absolute monster in the winter. We have a Macan GTS that's been daily driven for 2 years without any issues, cuts thru level 2 snow emergencies without a hiccup, and is pretty entertaining to drive if you're expectations are reasonable. Maintenance costs are about the only thing you need to be careful with (see Indy dealers). Even had a base 4cyc loaner one time that may have been the best 4 banger I've driven in an SUV to date..

Of course F8X's, X5/6m, and Teslas are good options too.

I have to agree the macan would be a great choice. Issue is my future wife wants to get a macan S for herself, so I'm taking that off my list.

Glad to hear it's reliable as well, everyone I know with 911s and Cayennes have sworn by them long term.

[F82Tazmanian]

Originally Posted by VChenz

i have three kids between 7 and 12. They love it. I set M1 = granny mode and M2 = full send. I also have a 2010 camry that i use when i need more space or in the winter.

I have never had a performance car...all my cars were camrys, sebrings, RAV4 etc. Boring, cheap cars. The camry floats like a boat but its got a smooth as silk drive (no steering feel or power but it has its place). The M3 is the first nice car i have ever owned. Its stiffer for sure, but definitely comfortable. The one thing you can't do is have your kids eat in the car cause stiffer suspension means things spill easier.

I personally wont be driving it in the winter but with some good winter tires it's doable. I bought my car used and it came with winter tires and rims but i dont intend on using them.

Thanks for your input. I guess I'm not too worried about stiffness the more i think about it. Just traction. I'm sure there are those who will talk about learning to drive and project some sort of toughness for handling these cars (not you), but there is a lot more thought into powering a 420whp rwd car in any situation vs awd

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by BMWModel3

Did I already ask you how stiff is the ride. Apparently there's a stealth Performance model you can order now but it doesn't get the springs, brakes, wheels, and spoiler. I think I'd love a Performance model with 18" wheels but retaining the bigger brakes.

You can’t fit 18s over the brakes. Needs to be 19+. Also I am fairly sure the hub is slightly different between the 2 brake types, so you can’t use the same wheels.

Previously, the brakes etc were part of “Perfomance package plus” that was a $5k option and then became standard. This package is needed for “track mode” so not sure if you care but you’d lose that software capability.

It’s comfortable, and there’s still about an inch more wheel gap than I’d like even with the slight lowering. It’s like an e90 328 with sport package and rft, or f80 with passive dampers. The base cars with 18” wheels look like they have a lift kit installed.....

Didn’t you say in another post you couldn’t get behind electrics? No need to force things. Just get a gas car with a big motor and a non track oriented suspension (eg alpina b7)
.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by BMWModel3

Yea I know but with leasing becoming available, prices dropping, super chargers popping up everywhere, co-workers raving about theirs, no need for servicing, and not having to get gas I think I'd be willing to try it out. No manual G80 might be the tipping point honestly.

P100DL acceleration potential couldn’t sell you on EV, but being able to lease does? Or “price drop” that just reflects what the price has been since last year with refunds and tax credits?

I’m not 100% following your decision making logic, but yea, model 3P is a solid car and I’ve enjoyed my 9 months having one, so go for it!

[agentrnge]

Do you have the option of having a second / winter beater car or more comfy car if you are worried the M3 will be too harsh. I never thought they were harsh even for crap NJ area roads. There is less sound deadening than a "luxury" car. And active sound is dumb. But it rides and drives wonderfully. If you can, get a cheap 2nd car to pair along with whatever fun car you get. I keep my M3 off the road when its snowy/salty. But otherwise DD year round split 50/50 duty with the 2nd car, a 2001 740iL.

Also, alternating between two cars with different feels every few days/weeks invigorates your appreciation for each car.

[afadeev]

Originally Posted by 440iGCCB

Planning to trade my 440xi in, and wanted some insight on the F80. I have driven it a few times, and it is an abosolute monster no doubt. My only concern is if that excitement will wear off and then I have this stiff car to slog back and forth to work, and traction issues.

I had a 13' E90 for a brief stint, and a few other rwd BMWs in the past. To be transparent, traction always was slightly an issue in the NE climate.

You and I are in NJ, and I don't drive my ///M3 in the winter for all of the above reasons.
I could, if I had a spare set of winter (instead of track) wheels and tires, but without winter tires, I would not dare.

For $50K, you will be looking at MY'16-17 cars, which will have at most 6-18 months of warranty left on them. Just saying.

For a new ~$50K sports car, you can't beat Tesla Model 3 Performance.
I have one of each, and TM3P is my preferred daily driver, and fun, and autoX car.

BTW, if you still want F80 M3, drop me a line, and I will sell you mine!


HTH,
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