Vargas GC+ vs PS2+

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by sly1types

Not just that, but look at their N54 reputation...On the other hand Pure has great quality reputation.

Good thing the n54 just ended production .....

Geez tits my man, lack forgiveness much? I mean I read about it too, and you’re free to do as you please, but some of y’all remind me of my bitter ass mom who forgets nothing and is forgiveless to her detriment. If they make great products, it seems only you who misses out. But you’ll let 8-10 year old reputation cloud your ability to recognize the product as it truly is...

[Chris@VargasTurboTech]

Also, there wasn't a spline lock "fiasco". V1 spline lock is a great design, not as good as V2 but still great. We got pooched when a small batch of them came in not-per-spec material (too soft). We changed QA to material test every batch from then on forward, improved the design, offer a no-questions asked exchange for any V1 owner, added a "no slip guarantee" to the V2 when installed by an authorized shop, and now we're creeping up on 2 years of the V2 being sold with zero spins. Would have rather not had the issues of course, but what can you do once you're there? Make the best choices possible going forward, and that's what we've done. We will always move forward like that, compared to big corporations we're tiny, but it's 100% part of the continuous improvement culture at our core.

Chris

[MisterF80M3]

Originally Posted by fiveohwblow

Good thing the n54 just ended production .....

Geez tits my man, lack forgiveness much? I mean I read about it too, and you’re free to do as you please, but some of y’all remind me of my bitter ass mom who forgets nothing and is forgiveless to her detriment. If they make great products, it seems only you who misses out. But you’ll let 8-10 year old reputation cloud your ability to recognize the product as it truly is...

The thread I link happened just last year. Vargas turbos and spline lock going out.

https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1679594

Originally Posted by Chris@VargasTurboTech

Also, there wasn't a spline lock "fiasco". V1 spline lock is a great design, not as good as V2 but still great. We got pooched when a small batch of them came in not-per-spec material (too soft). We changed QA to material test every batch from then on forward, improved the design, offer a no-questions asked exchange for any V1 owner, added a "no slip guarantee" to the V2 when installed by an authorized shop, and now we're creeping up on 2 years of the V2 being sold with zero spins. Would have rather not had the issues of course, but what can you do once you're there? Make the best choices possible going forward, and that's what we've done. We will always move forward like that, compared to big corporations we're tiny, but it's 100% part of the continuous improvement culture at our core.

Chris

I thought you advertised the spline lock to be bombproof. "Broke the test rig" before spinning the hub. Yet, we have multiple people spinning their crank hub with the V1.

You stated that you sold hundreds of the V1. Why are these V1 not being recalled?

I truly feel bad for all the people with V1 spline lock. They have a ticking time bomb in their engines, which is arguably worst than having a stock hub.

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

The thread I link happened just last year. Vargas turbos and spline lock going out.

https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1679594



I thought you advertised the spline lock to be bombproof. "Broke the test rig" before spinning the hub. Yet, we have multiple people spinning their crank hub with the V1.

You stated that you sold hundreds of the V1. Why are these V1 not being recalled?

I truly feel bad for all the people with V1 spline lock. They have a ticking time bomb in their engines, which is arguably worst than having a stock hub.

What is this as a percent to production?

[x622]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

The thread I link happened just last year. Vargas turbos and spline lock going out.

https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1679594



I thought you advertised the spline lock to be bombproof. "Broke the test rig" before spinning the hub. Yet, we have multiple people spinning their crank hub with the V1.

You stated that you sold hundreds of the V1. Why are these V1 not being recalled?

I truly feel bad for all the people with V1 spline lock. They have a ticking time bomb in their engines, which is arguably worst than having a stock hub.

Dude literally just said he got a bad batch with soft metal and now they test for it. Shit happens. I know most of you have never ran a company before and had to deal with suppliers, but sometimes you just don’t expect how they’ll creatively try to save money on you.

[Chris@VargasTurboTech]

He knows that, long time hater re-typing what he's posted many times before. V1 did break the test rig, but that is meaningless if the material hardness isn't right -which happened, we made good on, and moved on. V2 is more aggressive and we QA every single batch to make sure it never happens again. V1 hasn't been sold for almost 2 years. Zero spins with V2. This is old news, nothing new.

Chris

[Chris@VargasTurboTech]

Originally Posted by fiveohwblow

What is this as a percent to production?

Great question. Current production? Zero. Zero spins on V2. Almost 2 years of sales, plus MANY people turned in their V1's without running them for a V2 upgrade at no charge, because we stand behind our products.

To answer your question directly though, of the V1's, if I take the one case that was documented, add in the rumors I've heard, double that sum, half the units sold, we'd be at about 1.2% failure rate.

V2 is easy to calculate. At least 4x the quantity V2's out there compared to V1's, 0% failure rate across the board.

Chris

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by Chris@VargasTurboTech

Great question. Current production? Zero. Zero spins on V2. Almost 2 years of sales, plus MANY people turned in their V1's without running them for a V2 upgrade at no charge, because we stand behind our products.

To answer your question directly though, of the V1's, if I take the one case that was documented, add in the rumors I've heard, double that sum, half the units sold, we'd be at about 1.2% failure rate.

V2 is easy to calculate. At least 4x the quantity V2's out there compared to V1's, 0% failure rate across the board.

Chris

A 1.2% failure rate would seem well within a reasonable range, but for those with pitchforks dawned, surely the 0% meets your standards..?


Or not.

[Chris@VargasTurboTech]

Well, to be be fair we don't want to see any failures, ever, on anything, and neither do any of our customers, anyone else's customers, etc. The only ones who like seeing failures are the haters, but I suspect that's because they're so used to it in other facets of their lives.

Bottom line is that things have to be right. We're happy, customers are happy, cars are fast and not spinning hubs... all is well.

Appreciate the support.

Chris

[landonvan]

I think it’s funny some sit here and bitch about some turbo and V1 failures. And yet you still own a BMW. The literal failing component is the hub and BMW has done nothing. Sooooo kindly shut the fuck up.

[Chris@VargasTurboTech]

Originally Posted by landonvan

I think it’s funny some sit here and bitch about some turbo and V1 failures. And yet you still own a BMW. The literal failing component is the hub and BMW has done nothing. Sooooo kindly shut the fuck up.

[MisterF80M3]

Originally Posted by fiveohwblow

A 1.2% failure rate would seem well within a reasonable range, but for those with pitchforks dawned, surely the 0% meets your standards..?


Or not.

Easy for you to say. How you would feel if you purchased and installed something that was marketed as being a viable solution for the crank hub issue, yet you can still spin your hub? So you spent thousands of dollars to install something that appears worst than the stock setup and you are okay with that?

Blackey asked for just a refund of the parts bought because he lost confidence in Vargas after his VTT turbo and crank hub went out but was denied. He didn't even request labor for installation and removal of their defective parts, towing fees, loss of use, and rental fees.

Originally Posted by x622

Dude literally just said he got a bad batch with soft metal and now they test for it. Shit happens. I know most of you have never ram a company before and had to deal with suppliers, but sometimes you just don’t expect how they’ll creatively try to save money on you.

Dude I run a manufacturing business. I would never let my customers hung out to dry like Tony did. I would have recalled all of the defective products before sh*t hit the fan. That is the industry standard and the right thing to do. Am I going to take a hit because of the defective product I made? Yes, but that is the cost of doing business and making your customers happy. Look at how many angry S55 owners there are in the thread I linked above.

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

Easy for you to say. How you would feel if you purchased and installed something that was marketed as being a viable solution for the crank hub issue, yet you can still spin your hub? So you spent thousands of dollars to install something that appears worst than the stock setup and you are okay with that?

Blackey asked for just a refund of the parts bought because he lost confidence in Vargas after his VTT turbo and crank hub went out but was denied. He didn't even request labor for installation and removal of their defective parts, towing fees, loss of use, and rental fees.



Dude I run a manufacturing business. I would never let my customers hung out to dry like Tony did. I would have recalled all of the defective products before sh*t hit the fan. That is the industry standard and the right thing to do. Am I going to take a hit because of the defective product I made? Yes, but that is the cost of doing business and making your customers happy. Look at how many angry S55 owners there are in the thread I linked above.

In the circumstance you referenced I would be upset but were speaking apples and oranges and I think you know it. You’re referencing age old treatment from Tony, I’m referencing product reliability.

Since you run a business, and particularly a manufacturing one, I’m positive whatever it is you produce hasn’t been 100% without defect, ever. I’m merely stating the products do the trick and folks are having hang ups about purchasing because of the past stories and not product quality.

[x622]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

Easy for you to say. How you would feel if you purchased and installed something that was marketed as being a viable solution for the crank hub issue, yet you can still spin your hub? So you spent thousands of dollars to install something that appears worst than the stock setup and you are okay with that?

Blackey asked for just a refund of the parts bought because he lost confidence in Vargas after his VTT turbo and crank hub went out but was denied. He didn't even request labor for installation and removal of their defective parts, towing fees, loss of use, and rental fees.



Dude I run a manufacturing business. I would never let my customers hung out to dry like Tony did. I would have recalled all of the defective products before sh*t hit the fan. That is the industry standard and the right thing to do. Am I going to take a hit because of the defective product I made? Yes, but that is the cost of doing business and making your customers happy. Look at how many angry S55 owners there are in the thread I linked above.

Couple things. I don't know these people. I don't know you, and I don't personally know Tony. What I do know is he seems to be rough to deal with because he lacks some interpersonal skills and doesn't have the finesse that you'd want a talented account manager to have - which is why you hire someone for that, and oh look there's Chris. That being said, I don't know what I'd do in his shoes if a customer wanted me to refund everything when one component failed due to a manufacturer. I'd probably try to do a bit more to salvage the relationship, but I'm probably a bit better at dealing with customers than he is. That being said, he did do a recall, there's the v2. I have it on my car. I hope it works. It seems like they're doing their due diligence now to ensure that it isn't going to be screwed up like the bad batch that was in v1.

Next, as fireohwblow said, there's not a chance in hell that you have a 100% rate with no defects. Zero. You might have a better strategy for QC than he did at the time, sure, but there is always failed parts.

[E92inSG]

@misterf80m3

I don’t think anyone here is saying VTT is perfect in anyway. But the fact is that you have posted multiple times in every VTT related thread from turbos to crank hubs to CBC beating up on them repeatedly and tirelessly. While I do commend your willingness to “warn” other forum users I feel at some point it becomes closer to harassment with each new post.

Vargas turbos have proven themselves with some of the fastest cars on this platform and to be completely frank when you’re running those turbos at those levels, there is an inherent risk to something breaking. I think it might be time to ease up a little on your personal vendetta (it seems) and let other new users figure out on their own if these products do work.

If they have a high failure rate, it will come out on its own naturally.

*edit*
Honestly it’s nothing against you at all, and I hope you don’t take it personally. This is simply my unbiased opinion

[Sebuhi_09]

I have installed v2 crank hub. I am doing 5.8 100-200km. Driven like 20k and i really drive it. I am an engineer and from day 0 i liked the Vargas crank hub design.

I am using TS stage2 s55 turbo. I personally know more than 10 TS turbo users here. Different car models there products and price are awesome. Unfortunately they dont have stage3 or bigger turbo basically. I am counting on GCmax. As I dont want to move to single turbo option. So planning to get gc max on black friday, hoping i will have good discount.

[Idfkman]

I’ve seen so many remanufactered hybrid turbo’s fail in one way or another from all popular manufacturers. If I were going hybrid turbo’s I’d go with new Mitsubishi units from either Mosselman or Full Race. The others just seem to have perpetual issues.

For the money and fun factor I’ll be spending my money on a single setup.