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      07-17-2019, 05:34 PM   #1
MuffinFlavored
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Best bang for buck build for 600-800whp?

Use case: no track, no dragstrip, just get good 60-130mph times (like sub 5s) on the highway but still be a daily
Transmission: manual (probably won't need clutches)
Fuel: 93. E85/E50/E30 maybe? (you guys tell me what to do/what would be best; obviously being able to use regular gas is easier day to day)

Forged pistons/rods/built block: nah (cheap! but seriously... i'd like to push it a little under as far as the stock block can go to be safe)
Meth: nah (unless it really makes sense too... but... dangerous!)

Turbos: PURE stage 2 million plus medallion burger pizza or Kratos ($3k - $6k)
Port injection: FuelIt ($2k, not sure which system to get with what addons)
Downpipes/charge pipe/x-pipe/whatever-pipe: ? ($1k-$2k, please recommend which to get)
Intake: ? ($500 - $1k, probably the BMS one?)
Exhaust: ? (the I6 is never going to sound good so I really don't care?)
Tune: BM3 and some OTS map that works with the turbos + more fuel? ($2k?)
Crank hub upgrade: probably needed ($2k?)

$15k before labor? What am I missing? Am I living in a pipe dream to think this will be easy/daily drivable?
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      07-17-2019, 08:12 PM   #2
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Bang for the buck and 600-800 hp is a recipe to spend the max amt possible b/c you are increasing the chances of blowing up your motor, necessitating a rebuild.

Also, beyond the engine you will need upgraded axles, clutch, at least wider rear tires, suspension upgrades to help put the power down better.
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      07-18-2019, 10:18 AM   #3
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Aiming for 600-700 is better than 800. Once you cross 700 you need to spend a lot more to prevent engine damage. You can ignore the risk but there is high rate of engine failure.

Clutch if over 700, don't need it but eventually will. No intake but if you can find a used and sell it later without losing too much then yes
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      07-18-2019, 11:33 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlterZgo View Post
Bang for the buck and 600-800 hp is a recipe to spend the max amt possible b/c you are increasing the chances of blowing up your motor, necessitating a rebuild.

Also, beyond the engine you will need upgraded axles, clutch, at least wider rear tires, suspension upgrades to help put the power down better.
please excuse my ignorance but aren't people getting 550whp+ with just a stage 1/stage 2 tune? that's close to 600whp and doesn't mean you need to build out your block. i specifically said i'm looking to get to the point where i don't need to rebuild the block, and getting a manual would alleviate the need for a clutch at this power level i believe.
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      07-18-2019, 12:37 PM   #5
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Don't know if 6mt on your configuration could be sub 5's. But your list of mods (if it includes a fully built motor) on a DCT could get really close to sub 5's.

Last edited by TR930; 07-18-2019 at 12:42 PM..
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      07-18-2019, 06:39 PM   #6
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Yes, that list of mods should get you to 600 to 800 RWHP.

Yes you can drive and enjoy the car daily. Mine is just shy of 600 (for now) and I've driven it on several long drives (did Hot Rod Power Tour all 7 cities in 7 days) as well as done daily commutes for weeks. Only downside is hard to stay out of the gas so you'll be spending money on rear tires.
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      07-19-2019, 10:26 AM   #7
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BM3 + Downpipe + Charge Pipe + Intake for FBO mods, you can save a lot of money by buying them as a combo deal. we offer couple combo deals on our website

Pure Turbo kits are the most reliable for us, strongly recommend them

Active Autowerke Midpipe + REMUS exhaust sounds great,add the carbon tips and it will change the way your car looks
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      07-19-2019, 04:40 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
BM3 + Downpipe + Charge Pipe + Intake for FBO mods, you can save a lot of money by buying them as a combo deal. we offer couple combo deals on our website

Pure Turbo kits are the most reliable for us, strongly recommend them

Active Autowerke Midpipe + REMUS exhaust sounds great,add the carbon tips and it will change the way your car looks
do you need to play with fueling with a setup like this?

say you do PURE turbos and FBO + tune... where is the limit?
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      07-19-2019, 04:53 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored View Post
do you need to play with fueling with a setup like this?

say you do PURE turbos and FBO + tune... where is the limit?
Thats something your tuner will decide on based on your logs
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      07-19-2019, 05:07 PM   #10
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What octane fuel do you have? Is E85 readily available, or is it a total pain?

Basics
BMC Filters - No need for an intake, and they don't make much anyway
Downpipes - no need to mid pipe or exhaust
Turbos - Pure stage 2, or VTT (Kratos are good, but you said budget)
Custom tune for:
e85 or
93 octane and meth or (requires injection kit and controller)
93 octane and Boostane (haven't tried, but heard it works well)
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      07-19-2019, 08:09 PM   #11
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dont forget about the upgraded (splined) crank sprocket if youre planning on all of this power. thats one of the most important things to replace even on a stock s55...
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      07-20-2019, 01:33 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored View Post
please excuse my ignorance but aren't people getting 550whp+ with just a stage 1/stage 2 tune? that's close to 600whp and doesn't mean you need to build out your block. i specifically said i'm looking to get to the point where i don't need to rebuild the block, and getting a manual would alleviate the need for a clutch at this power level i believe.
No. With Stage 2 tune + DP you are looking at 480-500WHP.
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      07-20-2019, 03:19 AM   #13
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Buy a dodge daemon.

Leave the bmw stock.
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      07-20-2019, 10:37 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
BM3 + Downpipe + Charge Pipe + Intake for FBO mods, you can save a lot of money by buying them as a combo deal. we offer couple combo deals on our website

Pure Turbo kits are the most reliable for us, strongly recommend them

Active Autowerke Midpipe + REMUS exhaust sounds great,add the carbon tips and it will change the way your car looks
Hey Mike, these are great suggestions, but bang for the buck to get to at least 600hp, not sure it catback Exhaust should be in the equation. And especially if he doesnít want upgrade turbos, the money needs to be spent on port injection e85 or meth and a custom BM3 tune?

My route is intakes/ DP/ Chargepipes/ heat exchanger/ crankhub/ pure Stage 2+ turbos / custom 91 tune. Hoping to get 600 with this combo
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      07-20-2019, 10:53 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aBMWfan View Post
Hey Mike, these are great suggestions, but bang for the buck to get to at least 600hp, not sure it catback Exhaust should be in the equation. And especially if he doesnít want upgrade turbos, the money needs to be spent on port injection e85 or meth and a custom BM3 tune?

My route is intakes/ DP/ Chargepipes/ heat exchanger/ crankhub/ pure Stage 2+ turbos / custom 91 tune. Hoping to get 600 with this combo
Correct exhaust will not add any noticeable power, i mentioned it because OP has it listed in his first post saying no matter car does not sound good. But i disagree with the AA midpipe and REMUS axle back, the M3/M4 sounds really good in my opinion
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      07-20-2019, 01:04 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
Correct exhaust will not add any noticeable power, i mentioned it because OP has it listed in his first post saying no matter car does not sound good. But i disagree with the AA midpipe and REMUS axle back, the M3/M4 sounds really good in my opinion
Oh yeah definitely. I just ran that exhaust and itís the best sounding exhaust by far
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      07-20-2019, 02:16 PM   #17
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There are people running a custom E85 tune + downpipes that are getting 580+ whp.

Add in pure stage 2 and you're over 600.

If you don't want to run E85 you need more mods.

Crankhub is a must from how many I've seen blow on here. Drive shaft and clutch you can replace when they break
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      07-20-2019, 02:18 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackey View Post
What octane fuel do you have? Is E85 readily available, or is it a total pain?

Basics
BMC Filters - No need for an intake, and they don't make much anyway
Downpipes - no need to mid pipe or exhaust
Turbos - Pure stage 2, or VTT (Kratos are good, but you said budget)
Custom tune for:
e85 or
93 octane and meth or (requires injection kit and controller)
93 octane and Boostane (haven't tried, but heard it works well)
would 93 + port injection be easier/better? meth sounds like a pain / dangerous.
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      07-20-2019, 07:19 PM   #19
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Port injection isn't needed for 650whp. The stock fuel system is good up to that with pump gas. E85 takes more fuel due to the Ethanol (Ethanol doesn't contain as much energy as gasoline, but is higher octane) and that's why you need port fuel injection if you go that way. It also makes WAY more power than any pump gas tune including 100 octane race gas.

Methanol (secondary injection to the std fuel or E85 for that matter) is done with 50/50 water and methanol, and you can think of it as basically windshield washer fluid (that's about 25-30% meth btw). It's not all that dangerous (yes it will burn, but not easily), except that you are using it as extra octane / cooling and if you run out, or the pump fails, etc... you are risking the motor. If it were me I would have flow sensors. One of the best ways for meth btw is to do port injection of it, which if I were going to do it is what I would do.

That being said I do not have it. On a track car it's problematic as you go though a lot of it, and there are too many failure points. I'd rather just run 100 octane, but the cooling properties of it would be nice.

FYI - I'm 660rwhp on VTT turbos and 100 octane race fuel with a purposely conservative tune for 100F days on track in the desert. On CA91 I'm only about 540. Ditto on the Pure Stage II+ turbos. Yes I've had those too (long story). About 540-550 hp on CA91 (which is worse than standard 91, and seems to be getting worse lately for some reason).

If I were shooting for 600hp on 91 I would be thinking Meth or boostane btw. I don't think you are going to get there without it. Interesting to see though, as I have been proven wrong before.

On good 93 octane guys are getting 630 at the wheels on the VTT turbos btw. No supplemental fueling.
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Last edited by blackey; 07-20-2019 at 07:25 PM..
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      07-20-2019, 07:55 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mapster37 View Post
dont forget about the upgraded (splined) crank sprocket if youre planning on all of this power. thats one of the most important things to replace even on a stock s55...
Agreed. IMHO makes no sense to spend the money on HP and not on protection.
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      07-20-2019, 07:57 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackey View Post
What octane fuel do you have? Is E85 readily available, or is it a total pain?

Basics
BMC Filters - No need for an intake, and they don't make much anyway
Downpipes - no need to mid pipe or exhaust
Turbos - Pure stage 2, or VTT (Kratos are good, but you said budget)
Custom tune for:
e85 or
93 octane and meth or (requires injection kit and controller)
93 octane and Boostane (haven't tried, but heard it works well)
would 93 + port injection be easier/better? meth sounds like a pain / dangerous.
Not at all!!!!
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      07-20-2019, 07:59 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackey View Post
Port injection isn't needed for 650whp. The stock fuel system is good up to that with pump gas. E85 takes more fuel due to the Ethanol (Ethanol doesn't contain as much energy as gasoline, but is higher octane) and that's why you need port fuel injection if you go that way. It also makes WAY more power than any pump gas tune including 100 octane race gas.

Methanol (secondary injection to the std fuel or E85 for that matter) is done with 50/50 water and methanol, and you can think of it as basically windshield washer fluid (that's about 25-30% meth btw). It's not all that dangerous (yes it will burn, but not easily), except that you are using it as extra octane / cooling and if you run out, or the pump fails, etc... you are risking the motor. If it were me I would have flow sensors. One of the best ways for meth btw is to do port injection of it, which if I were going to do it is what I would do.

That being said I do not have it. On a track car it's problematic as you go though a lot of it, and there are too many failure points. I'd rather just run 100 octane, but the cooling properties of it would be nice.

FYI - I'm 660rwhp on VTT turbos and 100 octane race fuel with a purposely conservative tune for 100F days on track in the desert. On CA91 I'm only about 540. Ditto on the Pure Stage II+ turbos. Yes I've had those too (long story). About 540-550 hp on CA91 (which is worse than standard 91, and seems to be getting worse lately for some reason).

If I were shooting for 600hp on 91 I would be thinking Meth or boostane btw. I don't think you are going to get there without it. Interesting to see though, as I have been proven wrong before.

On good 93 octane guys are getting 630 at the wheels on the VTT turbos btw. No supplemental fueling.
Yes. Our Cali gas SUCKS. I am currently running 100 percent meth injection via a progressive controller and an E 40 tune
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