From the thread-jack files, Episode 93: Ignoring practicality, sports cars > *

[THEROK]

At CS pricing, get a 991.1 GTS. Power is the last thing I'm left for wanting. Grip and feel just isn't where it needs to be at >$100K USD.

Even my peasant ZCP stickering at $89K made me scratch my chin.

[Throttleblip]

Originally Posted by THEROK

At CS pricing, get a 991.1 GTS. Power is the last thing I'm left for wanting. Grip and feel just isn't where it needs to be at >$100K USD.

Even my peasant ZCP stickering at $89K made me scratch my chin.

We've gone a bit off topic but:

In some places the prices of the CS have been revised downward and a new GTS 991.2 (not used 991.1 GTS) with options is much more pricey I believe.

Regarding how the car performs against the ZCP, don't take my word for it (haven't driven it yet), here is a good review.
http://www.evo.co.uk/bmw/m4/19431/bm...-money-can-buy

[spuntyb]

Originally Posted by THEROK

At CS pricing, get a 991.1 GTS. Power is the last thing I'm left for wanting. Grip and feel just isn't where it needs to be at >$100K USD.

Even my peasant ZCP stickering at $89K made me scratch my chin.

Not that it's relevant here, but +1, even a 997.2

[THEROK]

Originally Posted by Throttleblip

We've gone a bit off topic but:

In some places the prices of the CS have been revised downward and a new GTS 991.2 (not used 991.1 GTS) with options is much more pricey I believe.

Regarding how the car performs against the ZCP, don't take my word for it (haven't driven it yet), here is a good review.
http://www.evo.co.uk/bmw/m4/19431/bm...-money-can-buy

I'd love to see a re-written review with the ZCP wearing Cup2s.

I really don't understand this, though:

The transmission is the weak point of the drivetrain. It’s not as swift and fuss-free as the latest dual-clutch gearboxes – up-shifts cause a jolt through to the rear wheels upsetting the vehicle, unless it’s set to its least aggressive mode. However, once wound down, the gearbox starts to labour over downshifts. There’s no way of having the calm upshifts and swift downshifts for some inexplicable reason.

I've never ever felt DCT wasn't quick enough to respond. Ever. Not even close.

[THEROK]

Originally Posted by spuntyb

Not that it's relevant here, but +1, even a 997.2

Tougher call, but yes, def interesting.

[Throttleblip]

Originally Posted by THEROK

I'd love to see a re-written review with the ZCP wearing Cup2s.

I really don't understand this, though:

The transmission is the weak point of the drivetrain. It’s not as swift and fuss-free as the latest dual-clutch gearboxes – up-shifts cause a jolt through to the rear wheels upsetting the vehicle, unless it’s set to its least aggressive mode. However, once wound down, the gearbox starts to labour over downshifts. There’s no way of having the calm upshifts and swift downshifts for some inexplicable reason.

I've never ever felt DCT wasn't quick enough to respond. Ever. Not even close.

Yes, my previous car was a ZCP and it would be interesting.

I also never understood why reviewers say that about the DCT for both the CS and ZCP. For me it's flawless

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by THEROK

I really don't understand this, though:

The transmission is the weak point of the drivetrain. It’s not as swift and fuss-free as the latest dual-clutch gearboxes – up-shifts cause a jolt through to the rear wheels upsetting the vehicle, unless it’s set to its least aggressive mode. However, once wound down, the gearbox starts to labour over downshifts. There’s no way of having the calm upshifts and swift downshifts for some inexplicable reason.
.

These people should learn a bit more about different cars before whining

The M DCTs use an inertial hammer effect when in the max attack modes. They seem to not like this, so they slow it down to where it no longer does that (mode 1) and then complain it's slow

dumb

[THEROK]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

These people should learn a bit more about different cars before whining

The M DCTs use an inertial hammer effect when in the max attack modes. They seem to not like this, so they slow it down to where it no longer does that (mode 1) and then complain it's slow

dumb

Totally, dude. I also don't understand when they speak of "latest dual-clutch gearboxes".

What latest dual-clutch gearboxes? They're all pulling traditional torque-converted units off the ZF shelf as if Lexus didn't do this on their own back in 2005. Even BMW tapped out on DCT with their newest M5.

The F8X DCT is a stroke of genius. If our S55 lump sounded as motorsport racey as the GT3 flat-sixers, it wouldn't play second fiddle to PDK - writers would pontificate about all its unicornmaze shifting feels until the sun don't shine.

Lazy, puppet journos.

[spuntyb]

Originally Posted by THEROK

Totally, dude. I also don't understand when they speak of "latest dual-clutch gearboxes".

What latest dual-clutch gearboxes? They're all pulling traditional torque-converted units off the ZF shelf as if Lexus didn't do this on their own back in 2005. Even BMW tapped out on DCT with their newest M5.

The F8X DCT is a stroke of genius. If our S55 lump sounded as motorsport racey as the GT3 flat-sixers, it wouldn't play second fiddle to PDK - writers would pontificate about all its unicornmaze shifting feels until the sun don't shine.

Lazy, puppet journos.

This is perplexing to me too. Sure, it's not a 911, but as magnificent as the PDK is in our Macan, the *sole* reason I didn't get the 6MT in the F80 was because I drove the DCT on a lark one day and was blown away at how well it performed. I wasn't on track, but pushing it hard on back roads, I was pleasantly surprised at how fast and capable it was, and I was sold. It's not as telepathic as the PDK, which I still say is witchcraft, but it's not even close to being "slow". Maybe I need to try it out on the course?

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by THEROK

At CS pricing, get a 991.1 GTS. Power is the last thing I'm left for wanting. Grip and feel just isn't where it needs to be at >$100K USD.

Even my peasant ZCP stickering at $89K made me scratch my chin.

No interest for a used car for me, let alone 991.1 GTS. A new 991.2 GTS is 30% more expensive than an M4CS where I live and the 911 does not fill my practicality needs.

[THEROK]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

No interest for a used car for me, let alone 991.1 GTS. A new 991.2 GTS is 30% more expensive than an M4CS where I live and the 911 does not fill my practicality needs.

Sorry 2 hear that

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

No interest for a used car for me, let alone 991.1 GTS. A new 991.2 GTS is 30% more expensive than an M4CS where I live and the 911 does not fill my practicality needs.

I always get the impression there are soooo many people on these forums who would rather be on rennlist but haven't been able to scrape together enough banana peels to do it.

It must be sad to have to settle for an M4 when your heart isn't in it. I'm sure an amish edition base 991.2 carrera with no LSD for 100k is really where it's at!

[THEROK]

Reality is, that 991.2 Carrera likely matches or more likely bests any F8X objectively. I just can't get down with a narrow body 911. RS/Turbo behind or bust.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by THEROK

Reality is, that 991.2 Carrera likely matches or more likely bests any F8X objectively. I just can't get down with a narrow body 911. RS/Turbo behind or bust.

Try going on a 4-week road trip with a family of 4 with luggage in a 991.2 Carrera. Or try going to the gardening center and haul back 12 bag of earth in the Carrera. Or going to the lumbar yard and haul back a bunch of 2x4.

The 991.2 Carrera does not match or best the F8X in all categories

Now, enough of this

Let's talk about the CS' torque curve

[THEROK]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Try going on a 4-week road trip with a family of 4 with luggage in a 991.2 Carrera. Or try going to the gardening center and haul back 12 bag of earth in the Carrera. Or going to the lumbar yard and haul back a bunch of 2x4.

The 991.2 Carrera does not match or best the F8X in all categories

Now, enough of this

Let's talk about the CS' torque curve

That's what the Land Cruiser is for.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by THEROK

That's what the Land Cruiser is for.

I think that is the point the others have been making that you keep missing. The M3/4 are meant to be practical daily drivers that can serve as weekend track toys. That has been the primary design focus behind the M3 since its inception. They are not meant as a pure bread sport car. So if you want a 911, go get a 911 and get off this thread.

Now back on topic.

[THEROK]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

I think that is the point the others have been making that you keep missing. The M3/4 are meant to be practical daily drivers that can serve as weekend track toys. That has been the primary design focus behind the M3 since its inception. They are not meant as a pure bread sport car. So if you want a 911, go get a 911 and get off this thread.

Now back on topic.

Practicality on a mass produced commuter car chassis? Nice discovery man! You're so sensy poo. lol

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by THEROK

Practicality on a mass produced commuter car chassis? Nice discovery man! You're so sensy poo. lol

No, the topic of this thread, which is the CS torque curve.

And the beauty of this version of a practical mass produced commuter car chassis allows me to spank quite a few Porsches on the race track .

It's getting old that every other thread turns into a vs Porsche debate. I am all in for a good vs Porsche discussion, being a big fan of P-cars myslef, but there is the "vs" sub-sction for that

[Throttleblip]

This thread is seriously off topic hahaha :