Exec Pack Frustration!

[Technic]

Those are BMWNA decisions, not BMWAG. The same way that BMWUK made the decision of having all those options available over there.

If BMWNA compromises X number of cars with Y number of Z options to import in the USA to BMWAG then BMWNA is also compromising to make money out of those XYZ.

Less number of Z = less chance of losing money on XYZ

But this is the best part of Z: if any customer in the USA still want Z then such customer still can get it if it conforms to USA regulations. Just ask for it as a custom/Individual order.

BMWNA do not restrict those options in the USA, it is just that they are not going to pay to bring those Z options in a batch without the guarantee of making money out of them. The customer will pay.

Originally Posted by ciaranob

Can anyone explain to me why when I go to say, the UK Configurator for the M4, I get to choose nearly twice the options for interior styling (adel leather color options etc) than available on the US site - regardless of having addl modes it makes no sense that the single biggest market for M3/M4 has the least optionality!!! Literally 6 to 7 times more cars sold in the US than the UK or even the home German market. Really bugs the heck out of me as there is a specific color combo on the UK side I would love to order. If you look at all the other exterior options it gets even worse for US buyers. Am I missing something here?

[angelc5]

Originally Posted by dmk08

Happy Day Gents! While out to lunch w/ my boss today I got a note from my CA to come in and spec out my car. He said the order banks are opening soon. The real good news is a lot of people who were in line in front of me have not responded so I am now at the top of the list!

As expected I couldn't control myself and went almost fully loaded. One thing I did find very interesting is he said they are hearing first deliveries in May? Anyone else heard that?

My Official Build:

M4
Mineral Grey
Sakhir Orange/Black Extended Merino Leather
Executive Package
Lighting Package
M Double-clutch Transmission with Drivelogic
Adaptive Suspension
19" Light Alloy Wheel Double-Spoke Style437 M with Mixed Performance Tires
Harman Kardon surround sound system


Very Excited!!!

Cheers

Oh and Edit:

If you're on the fence about Mineral Grey and worried that everyone keeps saying it's "VERY VERY DARK" and "WAY DARKER THAN THE PICS" yeah it's not. I looked at it up at the dealer before finalizing.

Any News if the M3/4 are going to be at the Atlanta Auto Show?

[ciaranob]

Technic - that is interesting - obviously I will be very curious to see what BMW Individual options they offer for the vert but I did not realize that potentially any of the color options not normally advertised in the US market but available elsewhere, would still be available on request to a US order. Is this speculation or fact?

Technic Quote "BMWNA do not restrict those options in the USA, it is just that they are not going to pay to bring those Z options in a batch without the guarantee of making money out of them. The customer will pay."

[aajami]

BMW should work with its dealer network to offer some kid of tier 1 ordering system wherein a customer can unbundle and option his/her car any way they want to from the available list of options in exchange for a non-refundable deposit that gets applied to the cost of the car. That way, the dealer doesn't have to mess with a low- or strangely-optioned car that the general public might not want, and the customer gets exactly what they're looking for.

[Needsdecaf]

Originally Posted by aajami

BMW should work with its dealer network to offer some kid of tier 1 ordering system wherein a customer can unbundle and option his/her car any way they want to from the available list of options in exchange for a non-refundable deposit that gets applied to the cost of the car. That way, the dealer doesn't have to mess with a low- or strangely-optioned car that the general public might not want, and the customer gets exactly what they're looking for.

The cost of doing that would be more than ordering the entire package anyway.

[Sir Loin]

No matter how packages are set up, someone will have something to complain about. I was just reading the UK price guide. Extended leather, 19" wheels, and M Adaptive Suspension are all standard equipment in the UK. I can imagine some people would complain that they wouldn't want any or all of these and would rather have a lower base price instead so their bare bone car is cheaper.

On the other hand, if everything is a la carte, then there would be people complaining that they would rather have packages to bundle some of them for a lower price for the options they would want.

I would be one of those people complaining if the packages or options are not exactly what I want. For BMW, it is damned if you do, damned if you don't.

[SD ///M4]

After my wife heard me talking about some of the discussion in this thread, she happened to see this review of the Mazda 3 on WSJ.com. She converted it to a PDF and e-mailed it to me, with certain paragraphs highlighted, particularly this one:

"In a more practical vein, I'd direct your attention to the price tag. Our test car, a 5-door Grand Touring model clocked in at $24,635, which included a lot of low-cost desirables: heated side mirrors and moonroof; variable heating seats and keyless entry/push-button start; rearview camera with cross-traffic alert and blind-spot monitoring; a Bose audio system with nine speakers; and, front and center, above the central air vents, a 7-inch touch screen hosting an elaborate suite of navigation, audio and app functions, including Pandora."

BTW, they absolutely loved this car. Here's the complete article: http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/...ndHeader_Right.

Remind me again why we're spending three times as much as this car for a M3/M4 with the same equipment, but only if we spend thousands on non-standard packages and options?

[Never Convicted]

Originally Posted by SD Z4MR

After my wife heard me talking about some of the discussion in this thread, she happened to see this review of the Mazda 3 on WSJ.com. She converted it to a PDF and e-mailed it to me, with certain paragraphs highlighted, particularly this one:

"In a more practical vein, I'd direct your attention to the price tag. Our test car, a 5-door Grand Touring model clocked in at $24,635, which included a lot of low-cost desirables: heated side mirrors and moonroof; variable heating seats and keyless entry/push-button start; rearview camera with cross-traffic alert and blind-spot monitoring; a Bose audio system with nine speakers; and, front and center, above the central air vents, a 7-inch touch screen hosting an elaborate suite of navigation, audio and app functions, including Pandora."

BTW, they absolutely loved this car. Here's the complete article: http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/...ndHeader_Right.

Remind me again why we're spending three times as much as this car for a M3/M4 with the same equipment, but only if we spend thousands on non-standard packages and options?

Then don't spend it. Problem solved. You're welcome.

[Benjamin]

Mazda is only adding those things to fight the other brands in that segment. You are going to see lower priced cars with more and more gadgets and bells. This does not mean that the gadgets are going to be anywhere near what you wound find in a BMW or other higher priced car. Most people do not need or want those features and they are simply to get the car sold off the lot. The salesman can then show you all of these features and brag about the car more, making an easier sale and a customer that thinks they are getting more for their money.

The M cars are designed for a specific purpose and aren't really live in cars. For all of the features look at a 5 series or 7 series. For instance who wants a cold weather package in a rear drive sports car or roadster? Not all options fit every car.

[SD ///M4]

Originally Posted by Never Convicted

Then don't spend it. Problem solved. You're welcome.

Sarcasm is apparently lost on you.

[e46e92love]

Originally Posted by GOLFFRR

BMW will always pkg options like this for now on. ITs easier for ordering for us dealers as well. You start making everything available as indiv pieces you end up getting cars that sit on the lots for a long time bc they are not optioned the way a person wants.

So when you group everything its a all or nothing type of buying which makes it easier for ordering as well as selling.

So don't expect BMW to go back towards more indiv options but instead more grouped options. Its frustrating yes however in the bigger picture it works a lot better this way for BMW and dealers.

So basically, they have taken another thing that made spending the extra money on the BMW and thrown it out the window in favor of the Honda / Toyota / Hyundai / Ford / etc way of doing things.

Makes perfect sense.....

Cheers,
e46e92

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by Technic

But this is the best part of Z: if any customer in the USA still want Z then such customer still can get it if it conforms to USA regulations. Just ask for it as a custom/Individual order.

BMWNA do not restrict those options in the USA, it is just that they are not going to pay to bring those Z options in a batch without the guarantee of making money out of them. The customer will pay.

Technic, do you have firsthand experience with this type of order or know of someone that does and has documented it on the web?

I am curious to know specifics about pricing and which sorts of options might be less likely or more likely to get approved. And what about deleting standard equipment or downgrading equipment?

[gee-m-w]

I took an UberX (non luxury car service that you order from your phone) this weekend and it was a Honda Accord EX. It has one touch screen, one large screen above it, and when he puts the blinker on a side view camera shows his blind spot. It had a lot of technology for a non luxury car. Ridiculous that you can get a $75,000 BMW without most of this stuff.

[soccer dad]

I saw all the posts about the Executive package and why they don't offer this or that, no headlight washers, but I want CA/HUD etc...

Well, there is a trick to getting the executive package for free. Just tick off the box for ZEC and then order the car Euro Delivery! 7% savings is $5,000 and the ZEC is $4,300....problem solved! LOL
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/images/smilies/lol.gif

[BMV///M3]

The only way BMW will offer more stand alone options is by not buying the exec package, just that simple.

Right now I can't justify it. All I need is CA/and back up sensors. Don't care for or need HUD/cameras/sat radio....we'll see what the 2016 model offers.

[Oakleyguy]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

Technic, do you have firsthand experience with this type of order or know of someone that does and has documented it on the web?

I am curious to know specifics about pricing and which sorts of options might be less likely or more likely to get approved. And what about deleting standard equipment or downgrading equipment?

I too am curious.

[Technic]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

Technic, do you have firsthand experience with this type of order or know of someone that does and has documented it on the web?

I am curious to know specifics about pricing and which sorts of options might be less likely or more likely to get approved. And what about deleting standard equipment or downgrading equipment?

Non-published rule:

1. You cannot break up a Package (ordering CA only when it is in ZEC, for example), but you can add to a car something that it is available a la carte in any other country but in the USA (ordering HUD or HK in a 320i) as long as it does not require US certification. I would like to be proven wrong in this one before I try it myself.
2 A Line is not a Package, so technically you can order foglights and M-Sport suspension in a no-Line F10, Sport Seats and M Sport suspension to a Luxury Line F30, etc. However, Line exclusives cannot be mix 'n match -Saddle Brown in a M Sport, Red seats in a Luxury Line.
3. Individual literally can do anything in your car, just bring money.

I ordered a 320i with HUD months ago but I had to cancel and get something on the lot due to my trade in being a sudden POS. I also requested via Individual that the standard Sensatec Beige interior were configured bicolor, (all black except Beige seats and door inserts) but the cancellation came before the approval. I know of (2) E92 M3 with HK and no Nav (no Individual Audio requierement with Nav), a no-Line F10 with M Sport suspension and a 320i with HK in the USA as few examples.

Prices will be the MSRP of the option ($1300 for the HUD, $390 for M Sport Suspension, etc). Individual can charge 1000% or more over the similar option price (metallic paint at $5500 from $550).

The implicit-rule: just because you asked it does not mean that it will get approved. Two different things.

[mkoesel]

Thanks for replying, Technic.

Originally Posted by Technic

1. You cannot break up a Package (ordering CA only when it is in ZEC, for example), but you can add to a car something that it is available a la carte in any other country but in the USA (ordering HUD or HK in a 320i) as long as it does not require US certification.

Ok, so that kills what I think would be the most popular use of this type of Individual customization. I would definitely at least consider stand alone CA or HUD if there were the possibility to do that at a reasonable price.

I would like to be proven wrong in this one before I try it myself.

Not sure what you meant by that. Are you saying you think it may still be possible to get an item normally available only in a package as a standalone option?

I ordered a 320i with HUD months ago but I had to cancel and get something on the lot due to my trade in being a sudden POS. I also requested via Individual that the standard Sensatec Beige interior were configured bicolor, (all black except Beige seats and door inserts) but the cancellation came before the approval.

Interesting. I wasn't even aware that BMW NA would take Individual orders on a 320i. So what did they quote you on a final price for the HUD? Or did you also not get that information before you canceled?

I know of (2) E92 M3 with HK and no Nav (no Individual Audio requirement with Nav), a no-Line F10 with M Sport suspension and a 320i with HK in the USA as few examples.

I wonder what those folks paid for those as well. And I also wonder if these were orders that had Individual paint or interior finishes included as well.

Prices will be the MSRP of the option ($1300 for the HUD, $390 for M Sport Suspension, etc). Individual can charge 1000% or more over the similar option price (metallic paint at $5500 from $550).

So it could be anywhere from what it would have been priced in the guide had it been made available stand-alone, to 20% of the car's base price (more than CCB!).

The implicit-rule: just because you asked it does not mean that it will get approved. Two different things.

Yeah, that's why I was asking you for more details. Trying to get a read on what is realistic.

[Technic]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

Not sure what you meant by that. Are you saying you think it may still be possible to get an item normally available only in a package as a standalone option?

I got that info from a CA "in the know" but I have not tried it myself. It makes sense because once breaking up a Package is approved then the gates are opened. BMWNA do read the BMW forums and I do not think that they will defeat their own purpose of a Package unless you exceed the price of the Package somehow.

As I broke down the ZEC package prices in another thread, it is very easy to exceed the ZEC package price if the options are priced individually. So even if you pick and choose you will be paying full MSRP for each option. And that will add up very quickly.

Interesting. I wasn't even aware that BMW NA would take Individual orders on a 320i. So what did they quote you on a final price for the HUD? Or did you also not get that information before you canceled?

HUD MSRP is $1300 as stated before. I did not get the price of the Individual Sensatec. And it was Individual because in reality what I was asking for were standard black door panels with Sensatec Beige inserts. That is not available stock, it needed to be special requested to the supplier and a special option code generated for this custom interior - that's Individual by default. Everything else in that interior was stock but just black and beige.

And before anybody asks, why Sensatec and not Merino Leather? This car was for my girlfriend that has a special needs son. Leather will not last a year, but Sensatec will for a long time.

I wonder what those folks paid for those as well. And I also wonder if these were orders that had Individual paint or interior finishes included as well.

All those orders were not Individual, just line items added to VO.

The E92 M3 HK add-on was slightly higher in price than the normal $875. I think it was $925 -I do not know why.

Everybody else paid standard MSRP -or so they said.

So it could be anywhere from what it would have been priced in the guide had it been made available stand-alone, to 20% of the car's base price (more than CCB!).

Correct.

Yeah, that's why I was asking you for more details. Trying to get a read on what is realistic.

In my personal experience, BMWNA will try to make it happen if the right channels are contacted. I do not know if the average CA is unwilling to try, too many customer window shoppers out there that ask but not deliver or it is just simple ignorance. But all these special and Individual orders have been available for quite sometime if you are serious and have the money.

It seems obvious but in reality it is not.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by Technic

I got that info from a CA "in the know" but I have not tried it myself. It makes sense because once breaking up a Package is approved then the gates are opened. BMWNA do read the BMW forums and I do not think that they will defeat their own purpose of a Package unless you exceed the price of the Package somehow.

I largely agree although if one were willing to pay, say, feature price plus 25% maybe it would make sense for them to consider it.

As I broke down the ZEC package prices in another thread, it is very easy to exceed the ZEC package price if the options are priced individually. So even if you pick and choose you will be paying full MSRP for each option. And that will add up very quickly.

Do you have a link to that breakdown? I'll try to search it out too, but it might be a helpful reference to have it here anyway. I am not at all surprised that you get a big price break on the package. Still, by ordering ad-hoc you avoid adding unnecessary weight and complexity.

HUD MSRP is $1300 as stated before.

Right, that's MSRP, but as you mentioned, they can jack it up as much as ten-fold, and do just that with the paint (some of which is admittedly justified due to the logistics). So are you saying they were prepared to equip the car with HUD and charge you what would be the normal HUD MSRP? To me that's a no-brainer deal if so.

All those orders were not Individual, just line items added to VO.

Good to know.

The E92 M3 HK add-on was slightly higher in price than the normal $875. I think it was $925 -I do not know why.

Yeah, I don't know why either, but $50 sure beats retrofitting.

What's the estimated normal CA MSRP - maybe $800? I'd definitely consider giving them $1000 for it. And HUD is $1300, but I'll pay $1600 for the priviledge of breaking it out of the package. There - that's $2600 for CA and HUD instead of the $4300 ZEC package, and plus I don't have a bunch of tack-on gadgetry that I don't want. How about it BMW NA?

[Technic]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

I largely agree although if I one were willing to pay, say, feature price plus 25% maybe it would make sense for them to consider it.

Options in a Package have a standard MSRP, there is no additional charge unless there is something else attached to it. See below

Do you have a link to that breakdown? I'll try to search it out too, but it might be a helpful reference to have it here anyway. I am not at all surprised that you get a big price break on the package. Still, by ordering ad-hoc you avoid adding unnecessary weight and complexity.

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...3&postcount=21

Right, that's MSRP, but as you mentioned, they can jack it up as much as ten-fold, and do just that with the paint (some of which is admittedly justified due to the logistics). So are you saying they were prepared to equip the car with HUD and charge you what would be the normal HUD MSRP? To me that's a no-brainer deal if so.

Individual prices change -always to the worst- , not the standard MSRP prices of options. That is because of the additional work and labor required to fulfill that Individual order. In the case of the paint, what a customer is really asking for is for his/her car to be taken out of the standard paint production line to another, to reserve one particular spot in that other line to change the paint of the robots to another, and then run that paint line perhaps only once and that's it.

I asked individual to take a M Performance steering wheel, skip the Alcantara, wrap it in black and Rust Brown leather, stitch the sucker in ///M tricolor and then install it in my car before Euro delivery. So they have to contact the supplier, the supplier has to dedicate one person to do that, and then ship that steering wheel to Garching, take my car over there, remove the factory steering wheel, install the new one and then take the car back to the Welt. Ahh... and then ship the factory wheel to my home once all in completed. If you like this kind of thing then it is worth every penny, if not then it is not. I loved it.

I do not know why the HK in the E92 M3 was increased from the standard $875 charge, maybe was a dealer add-on charge or a misunderstanding of some sort. What I know is that all except that E92 M3 HK option samples that I provided (including mine) were strict MSRP prices from the ordering guides - HUD at $1300, 704 at $390 and so on.

What's the estimated normal CA MSRP - maybe $800? I'd definitely consider giving them $1000 for it. And HUD is $1300, but I'll pay $1600 for the priviledge of breaking it out of the package. There - that's $2600 for CA and HUD instead of the $4300 ZEC package, and plus I don't have a bunch of tack-on gadgetry that I don't want. How about it BMW NA?

CA MSRP is $1000 in the F30. So your total would be $2300 for those 2 options a la carte.

For example, I want only the CA, HUD, rear camera and PDC. That $3450. But I also want "Full" Leather, which it is an extra $3600. That's then $7050.

ZEC + "Full" Leather = $6950. Then I would add some Individual touches. But that's another thread.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by Technic

Options in a Package have a standard MSRP, there is no additional charge unless there is something else attached to it.

Ok, right, I understand that in the context of a normal order. I was simply allowing for the possibility of a mark-up from BMW Individual.

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...3&postcount=21

Thanks.

Individual prices change -always to the worst- , not the standard MSRP prices of options. That is because of the additional work and labor required to fulfill that Individual order.

Alright and I see what you are saying with paint, leather, trim, and all of the custom work involved to provide those colors, finishes, etc. My point is, even for the request to add an normal-production feature to the car that isn't normally offered stand-alone, I imagine there is some degree of logistic overhead from a manufacturing perspective. I guess the nature of this overhead depends on the exact process and the mechanics of the manufacturing infrastructure which are no doubt very flexible but nevertheless programmed and streamlined to do specific things in a specific ways at specific times.

What I know is that all except that E92 M3 HK option samples that I provided (including mine) were strict MSRP prices from the ordering guides - HUD at $1300, 704 at $390 and so on.

CA MSRP is $1000 in the F30. So your total would be $2300 for those 2 options a la carte.

So with that said, as per what you had said a few posts back, it's no doubt that they are not going to be eager to allow this sort of feature by feature customization since it would undermine the package ordering decisions they've made which are presumably to simplify the number of combinations of cars they have to build.

My proposal, or more like a suggestion really, is to simply offer to them to pay some fee on top of the MSRP that these options cost in order to make them more likely to break them out of the package. As you say, they are typically open to trying to give you what you want, you just have to be willing to pay for it. So, my thinking is that if you come to the table with an offer to do so, they might be more willing to try to work out a solution.

It's just a thought. Obviously it generally only makes sense if we are talking about some reasonably nominal amount, although that is going to be dependent on personal priorities and tolerances. My thought was that a 25% surcharge to break an option out of a package would be reasonable to most. But I have no idea if that would be cost effective for BMW and BMW Individual. I suppose part of the problem is that they are banking on a certain sell-through of the package to get economies of scale on the options within it. I suppose that in the end they have forecast that most people will just pay the package price and move on rather than refusing the package and living without some options they'd like to have.