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      06-22-2014, 06:26 AM   #1
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M4 (MT) vs RS5 (DSG) comparison review by Auto Bild

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     Featured on BIMMERPOST.com
Enjoy the Read.

Some numbers:

The BMW does 0-100 kmh (62mph) in 4.4 secs (VS 4.2 for the RS5 with DSG). The 0-200 is in the advantage of the M4 in 14.1 secs (VS 14.8).

Weight: 1585kg or 3494 pounds VS 1803kg or (3975 pounds!!) for the RS5.

Lap time (Contidrom measuring 3.8km): 1:34,41 secs (similar to Porsche 911), 2 secs quicker than the Audi. I assume with the DCT version, the M4 would be even quicker... Note that these are the results on the LONG handling track of 3.8km, not the shorter one at 3.4km.

Best times on the same track by Auto Bild:
1:29,50 min - Porsche 911 GT3 RS 4.0 (997, semi-slicks)
1:30,70 min - Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG
1:30,73 min - Nissan GT-R '11
1:30,95 min - Nissan GT-R '09
1:31,00 min - Porsche 911 Turbo PDK (997.2)
1:31,14 min - Corvette ZR1 (AutoBild Sportscars)
1:31,20 min - Porsche 911 GT3 RS (997.1, semi-slicks)
1:31,62 min - Corvette C7 Stingray
1:31,75 min - Porsche 911 Turbo (997.1)
1:31,95 min - Audi R8 5.2 FSI quattro R-tronic
1:33,46 min - Audi R8 4.2 FSI quattro '07
1:34,21 min - Porsche Cayman R PDK (987)
1:34,23 min - Porsche Cayman S PDK (981)
1:34,41 min BMW M4 Manual
1:35,04 min - BMW M3 Coupe (E92) DCT
1:35,76 min - BMW 1M CoupƩ
1:36,12 min - Audi RS3 Sportback
1:36,53 min - BMW M235i
1:36,62 min - Mercedes-Benz A45 AMG
1:36,88 Alfa 4C
1:37,01 min - Peugeot RCZ R
1:37,01 min - Ford Focus RS500
1:37,06 min - Mercedes-Benz SL65 AMG '07
1:37,35 min - BMW M135i xDrive
1:37,53 min - Volkswagen Golf VII R
1:38,24 min - Skoda Octavia RS Combi '13
1:38,38 min - Audi S3 Sportback S-tronic '13
1:39,50 min - Ford Focus ST Turnier '13
1:39,90 min - Renault MĆ©gane RS '14
1:40,15 min - Ford Focus RS '09
1:40,16 min - Mazda3 MPS '12
1:40,35 min - Audi S3 '09
1:40,40 min - Ford Focus
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      06-22-2014, 06:36 AM   #2
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Also found this interesting onboard video for the Supertest on the Sachenring: http://www.autobild.de/videos/video-...4-5139032.html

Best time: 1:37,74

Audi R5: 1:40, 81
M6: 1:37,67
M3 GTS: 1:37,17

Other Sachenring times: http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/sachsenring.html
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      06-22-2014, 07:34 AM   #3
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I cant read german......does anyone know if this is an actual weight, or if its just an estimation?

I have to say, if it IS an actual weight, that's a disappointment. BC you have a manual M4 with no leather, no big stereo, no exec pack and CF roof (I think) that still barely weighs in the 34xx range. Still lighter than an e92 m3, but id expect it to be closer to 3400 and not 3500....
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      06-22-2014, 08:24 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KennyPowers View Post
I cant read german......does anyone know if this is an actual weight, or if its just an estimation?

I have to say, if it IS an actual weight, that's a disappointment. BC you have a manual M4 with no leather, no big stereo, no exec pack and CF roof (I think) that still barely weighs in the 34xx range. Still lighter than an e92 m3, but id expect it to be closer to 3400 and not 3500....
This is exactly the issue that is also being discussed in the weight of a stripper M4 thread - would be interesting to know 2 things:

1) exactly how did BMW arrive at the quoted 1,497kg in its press release from September, 2013?

2) what is the "true" weight of a stripper M4, whether Euro spec or US spec (and more importantly - what exact configuration of equipement is required to arrive at such figures)?
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      06-22-2014, 09:37 AM   #5
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The best is the quotes on the interior:

BMW Brings DTM feeling on the road.

Audi is a GT, not a racer.

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      06-22-2014, 09:40 AM   #6
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With all the opportunity to ask questions of the BMW engineers at the various press drives, why hasn't anyone challenged them on the weight of the car?

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      06-22-2014, 09:56 AM   #7
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This mag rated the M4 an 8 out of 10 for the sound and the RS5 a 6...seems pretty biased to me
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      06-22-2014, 10:16 AM   #8
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Good acceleration numbers against the RS5 with DSG. With DCT the gap would be wider at 200kph for sure.
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      06-22-2014, 10:24 AM   #9
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I am no expert, but the 0-200 km/h does not make much sense to me. For a car that has 425 HP at the wheels, I would expect it to be a bit faster.
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      06-22-2014, 10:29 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trinim3 View Post
This mag rated the M4 an 8 out of 10 for the sound and the RS5 a 6...seems pretty biased to me
Or maybe it's just their opinion... why is it biased?

When someone says something we agreed with it is "honest" and when they say something we don't agree with then it is "biased".

I also happen to think the M4 sounds good... whether it is better than an RS5 is subjective. I would have thought most people would say no but if someone thought it was, then I guess that is their "biased" opinion
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      06-22-2014, 10:31 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerj View Post
I am no expert, but the 0-200 km/h does not make much sense to me. For a car that has 425 HP at the wheels, I would expect it to be a bit faster.
Think poor launch / traction.

It's telling that the m3 is .4 secs behind at 100km / hour but .7 ahead by 200km/hr
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      06-22-2014, 10:31 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerj View Post
I am no expert, but the 0-200 km/h does not make much sense to me. For a car that has 425 HP at the wheels, I would expect it to be a bit faster.
I agree... the only thing I can think of is the driver/conditions because they also are also slower than many are getting in the 0-100 too. But, based on the results, it does seem a tad slower than I would have thought.
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      06-22-2014, 11:12 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gthal View Post
Or maybe it's just their opinion... why is it biased?

When someone says something we agreed with it is "honest" and when they say something we don't agree with then it is "biased".

I also happen to think the M4 sounds good... whether it is better than an RS5 is subjective. I would have thought most people would say no but if someone thought it was, then I guess that is their "biased" opinion
Fair point. But if we do a little exercise just for fun:

Let's score the styling 8-8 instead of 9-7 for the M4. That brings the M4 from to 236 to 235 and RS5 from 228 to 229. (Some would even argue if the RS5 wasn't 6 yrs old it might actually be better styling)
Then let's flip the sound score from 8-6 to 6-8. That brings the M4 to 233 and the RS5 to 231. Much closer. The m4 would still have the edge but mainly due to its track performance. That's how I would score it but I of course am biased.

Anyways all I'm saying is bias/opinion/preference comes into play for subjective ratings which then appear as an objective overall score.

Sidenote: the Audis weight and aero drag really affect its top speed performance. I would not want to race a M4 at speed if I were in my RS5...it would be quite embarrassing.
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      06-22-2014, 11:18 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trinim3 View Post
Fair point. But if we do a little exercise just for fun:

Let's score the styling 8-8 instead of 9-7 for the M4. That brings the M4 from to 236 to 235 and RS5 from 228 to 229. (Some would even argue if the RS5 wasn't 6 yrs old it might actually be better styling)
Then let's flip the sound score from 8-6 to 6-8. That brings the M4 to 233 and the RS5 to 231. Much closer. The m4 would still have the edge but mainly due to its track performance. That's how I would score it but I of course am biased..
Everyone's biased.

The point of those "scores" are to apply a veneer of objective legitimacy to an obviously subjective evaluation. Just like with video game reviews, wine reviews, or movie reviews, the numbers are not valid or reliable (statistically speaking). You can be sure that the outcome is preordained based on the subjective, and then the "objective" is tweaked to produce the final result. "Yeah, that braking is really much better, let's shift a point there" etc. Or, they change the weighting "braking is now worth 20 points, not 15."
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      06-22-2014, 11:19 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trinim3 View Post
Anyways all I'm saying is bias/opinion/preference comes into play for subjective ratings which then appear as an objective overall score.
I see your point and agree... I dislike the tests that "score" the cars as so many of the measures are subjective as you note. I often think the magazine knows, on an overall basis, which car they prefer and then you wonder if they score things to get that result. Maybe the right result but they have to score individual items to get that result.

I'd much rather they simply comment about the car and then pick and overall winner based on which they preferred... nothing annoys me more than scoring a car for trunk space or silly things like that which are largely irrelevant for most people buying cars like this.
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Last edited by gthal; 06-22-2014 at 11:24 AM..
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      06-22-2014, 11:20 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keto View Post
Everyone's biased.

The point of those "scores" are to apply a veneer of objective legitimacy to an obviously subjective evaluation. Just like with video game reviews, wine reviews, or movie reviews, the numbers are not valid or reliable (statistically speaking). You can be sure that the outcome is preordained based on the subjective, and then the "objective" is tweaked to produce the final result. "Yeah, that braking is really much better, let's shift a point there" etc. Or, they change the weighting "braking is now worth 20 points, not 15."
Exactly
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      06-22-2014, 11:23 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trinim3 View Post
Exactly
Then the circlejerk on the forums can start!
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      06-22-2014, 11:28 AM   #18
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Observation:

The M4 scored higher than the RS5 in the "Sound" category
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      06-22-2014, 11:34 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerj View Post
I am no expert, but the 0-200 km/h does not make much sense to me. For a car that has 425 HP at the wheels, I would expect it to be a bit faster.
The Sportauto supertest got almost the same result. 13.7 second for M4 with DCT
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      06-22-2014, 11:37 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M6-Coupe View Post
The Sportauto supertest got almost the same result. 13.7 second for M4 with DCT
13.7 is a meaningful amount faster than the 14.1 in this test IMO. 0.4s is a decent gap at those speeds... and more in line with what you would expect the car to do. If I would bet, I think the car is 13.3 to 13.5 to 200 once people get familiar with in and it is tested in good conditions.
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      06-22-2014, 11:42 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
Observation:

The M4 scored higher than the RS5 in the "Sound" category
I do think the M4 with exhaust valves open does indeed sound pretty good....but not better than an RS5.
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      06-22-2014, 11:51 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gthal View Post
13.7 is a meaningful amount faster than the 14.1 in this test IMO
so what do you expect if a car with DCT catches 200 km/h in 13.7 and the same car with manual transmission catches that speed in 14.1 second? you need 3 manual gearshifts correct? For sure you know how fast the DCT is
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